Going into debt for Christmas

Our generation had a totally different view on debt. Interest rates at times were so high. Until recently interest rates have been so low that attitudes are totally different. It has become a must have society.

Also with the prospect of severe climate change and possible global wars I imagine that a lot of people are living for the moment..

I can remember during the inflationary period of the late 1960/70s, DH and I saving 6 months for some furniture, only to find, when we had the money that the price had gone up in that 6 months by more than any credit charges we would have paid.

It did make us more flexible in our attitude to credit, however we would never go into debt to cover something like Christmas.

We had one very tight year when DH's job was insecure and the children had homemade aand charity shop presents and they used to describe it as the best Christmas ever.

I think the people most likely to go into debt at Christmas are those on the smallest budgets. When parents have had to scrimp and save throughout the year and children have had to forego holidays and treats, sometimes, even new clothes. they are more likely to lash out at Christmas.

I suspect they also do not want others to know the extent of their financial struggles and think that showering their children with expensive toys will hide their poverty from other people. All it does, of course, is make their money problems worse.

Of course, there’s debt and debt. Manageable debt isn’t bad, but I guess we are discussing those who just buy, buy, buy without a thought how to pay it off.
I agree that we live in different times, but my DDs who aren’t poor, have been brought up to understand finance and how it works.
Sadly a lot of other ACs inherit the same attitude to debt as their peers and parents - throwing caution to the wind.
It’ll never change.

Our daughter a few years ago held back some of our granddaughters birthday presents and wrapped them up for Christmas, no shortage of money just didn’t want to add to the plastic mountain.

Sadly I think it’s often those with the least that will spend the most.

Why do people give children so much for Christmas and birthdays? On another thread posters have talked about bedrooms full up and overflowing with presents for grandchildren, Of course, they may have 20 grandchildren, but probably 3 or 4.

We have never overloaded our grandchildren with presents, 2 presents each, agreed in advance with parents.

Sago I think that you are correct. Fiscally secure parents ( and grandparents) are the most likely to be comfortable buying from the second hand uniform stall at school, charity shops , or recycling hand me downs.
Some of my clients at foodbank find this difficult and some do get into debt at Christmas. We're extra busy in January .

Primrose53 Just been listening to a discussion about this on TV.

I don’t think it’s ever worth it. When our kids were small we had a big mortgage and not much money left. I often used to be up at midnight still finishing off knitted dolls clothes for my daughter’s new doll.

I suspect as usual everyone is different. Not all people value saving.

We married when I was out of school at 16. I've never worked, money was tight for years as my husband worked and built his business. Wasting money has never been for me. I assumed the only money I could ever 'earn' was from saving and being economical - so I am. But, views on saving differ...

using credit cards can encourage debt in some people. They go into shops before christmas and the hype sucks them in, after all it does not feel like money at the time

Norah of course you have 'earned' money throughout your life. You have always made it clear that you helped your husband with his business and you have run the household and kept the home fires burning so that he could give all his time and attention to his work.

What is that, if not earning your living in the family business?

I always sawDH and I as running a joint enterprise, especially in the years I was not in the formal economy. He was able to concentrate on his work, that took him to remote parts of distant countries in the days before mobile phones and the internet, secure in the knowledge that he could trust me to be running everything at home, able to cope with any emergencies that arose, including with his parents. Good for him, good for us.

There seems to be a frequent assumption now that aside from stockings, if children don’t have a massive pile of presents - just from parents - they’re somehow deprived.

I don’t know about anyone else, but when dds were small they had one (biggish) present from me and dh. It wasn’t a question of money, we weren’t short, it just never occurred to us to shower them with stuff - they did have 🎅🏻 stockings and presents from other family, too, and always seemed very happy.

I'm the same as you, Primroes 58. Still doing this now! Homemade/secondhand gifts are very acceptable in my family... In fact we take a pride in finding bargains, and only give small gifts, especially for the adults.

Yes, our tw got a big present and a small, and grandparents and othere relatives would give one present . Stockings were for trivia, sweets and pocket money toys.

This hasn't changed in our family. The problem that has risen with our two DGC, now both in their teens, is that their parents have a very wide friendship group, the majority of whom are childless and often single, so DGC have been the only children in this circle and as a result they get bought presents by all these friends. It is easing up now they are teenagers, but it used to be almost embarrassing, how much they were given.

Davida1968

I'm the same as you, Primroes 58. Still doing this now! Homemade/secondhand gifts are very acceptable in my family... In fact we take a pride in finding bargains, and only give small gifts, especially for the adults.

My dd1 finds lots of toys in charity shops or on e.g. FB marketplace. She buys virtually all her own clothes in charity shops too - dd2 is the same. They do seem to have v good charity shops locally though - lots of really nice, good quality things.

I suspect that there will no posts on this thread from people who indulge their grandchildren, or who used to do so with their own children, as the tone is already rather judgemental

I think with the easy availability of credit and tough economy, many younger people rely on it, partly out of necessity, partly out of ease.

I know when we were younger with 3 young children, a mortgage and car payment, we used our credit card more than we should have. But it would be for bigger items like a water heater or new tires, and paid off as quickly as we could.

Now using your credit card is easy, and encouraged by gaining travel points, so I can see where young people fall into a trap of going into debt.

Can you imagine the children of today being grateful for knitted dolls cloths. In the era of child of entitlement.

It is sad that parents seem to feel pressured into giving great piles of presents. It is not good for them, nor the children, nor the planet.

Doodledog

I suspect that there will no posts on this thread from people who indulge their grandchildren, or who used to do so with their own children, as the tone is already rather judgemental

I'm sorry you read a tone judgmental. I read totally logical dislike of debt. Everyone is different to their views of extra debt or saving excess.

I admit we indulge our children and grandchildren (and GGC and the next generation after that as well - too many G's.

But we never have card debt for pressies - when we had no money they received minimal home made. They still receive home made items to a large extent -- I have to give my 'art' somewhere

I agree it is often parents who can least afford to spend wildly who do so. I give my DGS's a new toy like Lego, this year a dressing gown and a selection pack or when younger a chocolate Santa. They have 4 sets of Grandparents and 1 set of Great Grandparents who will buy them 1 gift each and my DD is very frugal because she'd rather buy them a zoo pass, EH and NT passes as they like to go out somewhere each weekend.

My DF died 7 days before Christmas leaving DM with 4 children under thr age of 12. His 48th birthday would have been Christmas Day. She was honest and simply told us she couldn't spend lots on us; paying bills was her priority. We were brought up knowing this and never asked or expected expensive items. None of us feel we missed out as basically most of the stuff kids want is plastic cr*p! Anyone who spends what they can't afford is irresponsible. A warm home and decent food is much more important for the rest of the year rather than one overhyped day.

I have always been very generous with my children and grandchildren. Just can’t help it. No, I am not buying their love.
As I’ve said, their needs are greater than mine. Merry Christmas all 🌲

I am comparatively generous with mine (or that is how I see it - and they do) - but it is of course all comparative - there is a £50 limit on each person.

It's sad that so many families feel pressured into spending more than they can afford on presents. Two women sitting behind me on a bus in the run up to Christmas last year were complaining about the cost of presents. One of them said that she was still paying off the debt from the previous Christmas.