So who will accept the poisoned chalice?

Aveline, I agree with you, too.

Smileless2012

That's a good point Galaxy.

I disagree MayBee charisma is important when dealing with other world leaders.

And which other world leaders have charisma in your opinion? Or is it just our leader that needs it?

maddyone

Smileless2012

I agree that would be the wise thing to do Siope but it's highly unlikely.

KS is being compared to Tony Blair!!! He doesn't have anything like the charisma.

Keir Starmer has the charisma of a wet lettuce. Mind you, Sunak was much the same.

I don’t think charisma is what we need. That has been the problem, this “presidential” approach to choosing a leader.
Blair had charisma, Macron has charisma, Trudeau has charisma, Boris (love or loathe) had charisma-
what we need is competence, strength, respect, honesty a sense of duty and service

what we need is competence, strength, respect, honesty a sense of duty and service

Hear, hear.

And, I think/hope, now here, here.

With Tory voters deserting to Reform in droves where do they go, are Conservatives going to form the centre right, or are they going to move to hard right and win those voters back.

My bet is hard right.

With Tory voters deserting to Reform in droves
4 MP s is hardly “droves”
Protest vote- won’t stay the course.

David49

With Tory voters deserting to Reform in droves where do they go, are Conservatives going to form the centre right, or are they going to move to hard right and win those voters back.

My bet is hard right.

Oh I do hope not. But where are the MP’s that will stop that? Can’t believe that I’m hoping that Hunt becomes leader. Or maybe Tugendhat will try for the leadership again. If they don’t I dread to think how far to the right they will go.

Aveline

He was a decent and serious young man. We were all glad of him during lockdown. I don't like to see him denigrated. There are far worse than him.

well he was certainly handed a poisoned chalice after Johnson and Truss.. I don't vote Conservative but I do think he did his best.. I expect he will resign and move to USA

There were a lot of votes in favour of Reform. So long as immigration is a problem they will I believe stay the course.

Smileless2012

I agree that would be the wise thing to do Siope but it's highly unlikely.

KS is being compared to Tony Blair!!! He doesn't have anything like the charisma.

But Tony Blair was a pr constuct a clever man but not an intelligent man. All fur coat and no knickers, or the male equivalent.

Keir Starmer is a man who first reached the top of his profession and then became a politician. A man with intellectual depth, success in other fields.

We will get more thoughtful governance and less grand standing.

I do not support labour and did not vote Labour yesterday, but not because I did not trust or think the leader was up to it. In 1997, I did contemplate voting Labour but didn't, because I did not trust Tony Blair, I thought him facile, a man whose only experience was in internecine warfare in the party he belonged to.

RosiesMaw

maddyone

Smileless2012

I agree that would be the wise thing to do Siope but it's highly unlikely.

KS is being compared to Tony Blair!!! He doesn't have anything like the charisma.

Keir Starmer has the charisma of a wet lettuce. Mind you, Sunak was much the same.

I don’t think charisma is what we need. That has been the problem, this “presidential” approach to choosing a leader.
Blair had charisma, Macron has charisma, Trudeau has charisma, Boris (love or loathe) had charisma-
what we need is competence, strength, respect, honesty a sense of duty and service

I completely agree RosiesMaw and if Starmer can follow through on his inaugural speech and maintains his integrity we might start to heal this country..

Could be worse if we had trump or Biden, who would you vote for then?
I think with Labour in, hope they stick to their promises, I think they’ll still have the same problems whoever is in

Germanshepherdsmum

There were a lot of votes in favour of Reform. So long as immigration is a problem they will I believe stay the course.

A political philosophy predicated on a negative policy, directed against a minority of the population is all too familiar to those who recognise or have studied National Socialism in Germany in the 20's and 30's.

Whitewavemark2

Listening to Ch 4 early this morning someone said that the rump of Tory MPs left are to the left. We shall have to wait and see.

I was concerned about that.

The two moderates around our way have been ousted.

RosiesMaw

^With Tory voters deserting to Reform in droves^
4 MP s is hardly “droves”
Protest vote- won’t stay the course.

Reform split the right wing vote, letting Labour or LD win many more seats.
We have Labour for 5 and probably 10yrs it’s going to be hard work for them to counter Reform policies, that appeal to many voters.

Aveline

If only Penny Mordaunt hadn't lost her seat she'd have been an acceptable leader for the Tories. Oh well.

I agree. She's seems a decent, intelligent and down to earth woman. Whoever is in power, not a lot changes for the ordinary individual. Many promises, then forgotten or withdrawn, extra money in one area, higher charges in another. Ho hum. At least we won't have to listen to any more election speeches.

David49

With Tory voters deserting to Reform in droves where do they go, are Conservatives going to form the centre right, or are they going to move to hard right and win those voters back.

My bet is hard right.

I suspect they will go further left.
Especially if it is mainly the more left conservative MPs, um, left.

I used to think, wrongly, that the N azis were not far right but far left.

I think I can now see that they were indeed far right.

If coservatives go more left, I dont think it would take much for Reform to fill the gap on the right, and possible go far right in a couple of years.
Some might say they are already there. I wouldnt.

4 actual MPs.
Wonder what they will do.

Europe is turning right. The Conservatives will go further right. The numbers who voted for Reform need to be taken seriously. Way more than the number who voted LD.

MayBee70

Smileless2012

I agree that would be the wise thing to do Siope but it's highly unlikely.

KS is being compared to Tony Blair!!! He doesn't have anything like the charisma.

Charisma isn’t exactly what this country needs at this moment in time. Imo

Look where Blair's charisma got us. Look how Boris and his charisma ended up. Sir Keir Starmer comes across as a decent and principled man without any gimmicks. I didn't vote for him but he is our PM now and I hope for all our sakes, he does a decent job.

Yes he's not very exciting but we've had that -Boris- so bring in the dull but hard working Starmer.

Starmer is bland and full of promises he can’t keep. No charisma at all . I am glad Lib Dem’s got more seats In not excited about anything to be honest and I don’t think it I will get any better. The tories got a lot of things wrong but they also had to deal with a pandemic I don’t think Labour would have had a clue . I too like Penny Mordaunt I would have liked her to have kept her seat

Aveline

He was a decent and serious young man. We were all glad of him during lockdown. I don't like to see him denigrated. There are far worse than him.

Ditto. I voted LD in a LD/Con seat (Labour come nowhere) but I do have sympathy for Rishi Sunak. Most of the shitshow that caused the Tory catastrophe was down to Boris and Truss.

I’m afraid I suspect that at least some of the slagging off of Sunak stems from racism.

I do find it worrying that so many people voted Reform. It seems that blaming one demographic for all the ills of the country is very like what happened with a certain little man in the 1930s.

I don’t think anyone has said that all the ills of the country are down to one demographic.