You need to ask your baby’s permission before changing his or her nappy….

NotSpaghetti

I worked with more than one mum who never talked to her baby - and even toddlers, years ago, Mollygo
They didn't know you needed to.
The mums thought there was "no point" because they didn't talk back.

It was desperately sad.
Unfortunately it's not a new thing.
And nothing to do with mobile phones.

With help, the little ones could grow and blossom
🌸

I used to talk to all mine until I realised I couldn't get a word in edgeways!

NotSpaghetti
She might just be encouraging those parents who don’t talk to their children, to do so from early on, in all situations not just nappy changing.
Possibly most of us did, without the distraction of mobile phones. Maybe most parents do now.
My DF’s mother never talked to him as a baby. He was shut away in the nursery with a nanny, so I am aware that some parents from all walks of life didn’t talk to their children.
That’s not really the same as asking your baby if he/she wants a nappy change though.

Yes definitely talked to babies still in nappies. But they were under 18-20 months. I would ask “does that feel nicer” etc
My daughter said no and not to most things as soon as she discovered the words…..well that and dog!
Eg. Me: “is that food/toy/whatever good?” Daughter no, not good.
Me: “is it bad?” Daughter “no! Not bad!” 😸

I thought she was a long time talking but she’s definitely made up for it since.

Doodledog

Why refer to other people’s way of doing things as ‘absolute twaddle’ or ‘barmy’?

Talking to children is neither (IMO), and respecting their boundaries makes perfect sense. I understand that to others it may not, but I read posts about how children ‘belong to’ their parents without feeling the need to rubbish that point of view, even though I find it a troubling way to see the parent/child relationship.

Nobody has said that parents ’have to’ ask permission of babies, and there is not an iota of interference from ‘the state’ on this matter, but it seems that there are those who are so certain that they are right about everything that they can’t accept that anyone else might see things differently and could just possibly have a point.

That attitude is common in online social forums. Rogerian psychology includes finding a point or points of agreement. T

When schoolchildren are taught to debate Rogerian psychology is the model taught.

Caleo

Astitchintime

I used to say to my babies….”come on, let’s get this stinky nappy changed and put on a nice clean one” but asking permission to do so?????? ………what a load of absolute twaddle!

It is about the attitude of the carer towards the child. If the carer believes the child is her own wee person then the carer will transfer that attitude of respect and sympathy if only from the body language.
However nappy changing and bathing are excellent opportunities for the baby to learn the sorts of things that can be said and how to say them.

Caleb, you will note that I stated I did talk to my babies…….it was the ‘asking permission’ that I considered to be a load of twaddle!

Mollygo

NotSpaghetti
She might just be encouraging those parents who don’t talk to their children, to do so from early on, in all situations not just nappy changing.
Possibly most of us did, without the distraction of mobile phones. Maybe most parents do now.
My DF’s mother never talked to him as a baby. He was shut away in the nursery with a nanny, so I am aware that some parents from all walks of life didn’t talk to their children.
That’s not really the same as asking your baby if he/she wants a nappy change though.

My mother was a Nanny. I'm sure, remembering her as a mother, she would have talked to her little charges although they were 'spruced up' and taken to see Mother and Father for half an hour before bed-time.
The Nannies used to meet in Kensington Gardens and the children could play with others.
She kept in touch with the last family and I remember taking her to visit her 'boys' when they were grown men in their fifties!

I talked to my two almost non-stop from birth. It is amazing that they ever got a chance to say a word themselves.

Good communication skills have played a key role in both their careers, so I didn't entirely silence them!

Like M0nica I talked to my babies non-stop from birth and they became early talkers and chatty toddlers. I was pleased to see that my daughter did the same with my grandchildren. We are a chatty family.

This is obviously to teach children to be aware of the possibility and the danger of abuse.

As soon as he was potty trained, my eldest DGS would send everyone out of the room if he needed to go to the toilet. Since then, I have always asked the DGC of both sexes if they would like me to leave the bathroom if they are on the loo. Some do, some don't, but they have been given the choice and been made aware that there is such a thing as a private sphere.

This would never have occurred to me with my own boys, but I was a very "hands off" mum anyway. Their own children seem to have a very sensible attitude, so it has all turned out fine for both of those generations. The little ones are certainly consciously trained to protest at being touched unsuitably - something we didn't do in our time, although there may have been some mention of it in kindergarten.

And I'm sure my own parents would never have even been aware of any threat, or if they were, would have been too embarrassed to say anything or to even imply that we, as babies, would ever have to defend ourselves..

Let's hope that bringing this out into the open and raising awareness in the children themselves will help to prevent child abuse in the future. I fear, however, that the lady who started this debate is preaching to the choir and that the real perpetrators will never get to hear this sort of discussion or if they do, will poo-poo it (excuse the pun)

Astitchintime

Caleo

Astitchintime

I used to say to my babies….”come on, let’s get this stinky nappy changed and put on a nice clean one” but asking permission to do so?????? ………what a load of absolute twaddle!

It is about the attitude of the carer towards the child. If the carer believes the child is her own wee person then the carer will transfer that attitude of respect and sympathy if only from the body language.
However nappy changing and bathing are excellent opportunities for the baby to learn the sorts of things that can be said and how to say them.

Caleb, you will note that I stated I did talk to my babies…….it was the ‘asking permission’ that I considered to be a load of twaddle!

I did indeed note that you talked to your babies.
I am sure your attitude of loving them showed in your tone and body language too.

Many posters take the original claim literally and perhaps out of the context within which the author wrote.

Since then, I have always asked the DGC of both sexes if they would like me to leave the bathroom if they are on the loo. Some do, some don't, but they have been given the choice and been made aware that there is such a thing as a private sphere
How refreshing to know that something I always did instincttively was the 'right" thing - I would leave to door open/ajar and say something casual like "give me a shout if you need me"
Never gave it much thought
Innocent days?

NotSpaghetti

This "discussion" is yet another example of people sounding off without trying to understand.

I don't know why people are so keen to rubbish things without knowing anything about them.

Speaking to Australia’s ABC News on 8 May, Deanne Carson said she works with parents from birth teaching them "to set up a culture of consent in the home" and to talk to their newborn baby saying things like "I’m going to change your nappy now, is that OK?"

“Of course a baby’s not going to respond and say, ‘Yes, mum, that’s awesome, I’d love to have my nappy changed!’ but if you leave a space, and wait for body language, and wait to make eye contact, then you’re letting that child know that their response matters,” says Deanne.

Since giving that interview, Deanne has found her views ridiculed online.

Deanne tells BBC Three that her words have been misunderstood.

She says parents should communicate with babies while changing their nappies, so that – even though they can’t respond with words - they learn from an early age that they are in control of their bodies.

Deanne Carson appeared on ABC Australia
“We read to small children with no expectation that they will pick up a book and read it back to us or even really understand what the book is about,” Deanne explains. “What we are doing there is building the foundations of literacy and normalising reading. So when we practise consent with babies, we are doing exactly the same.”

Deanne, who works with the child protection organisation Body Safety Australia, explains that parents already talk to their babies about what they like and don’t like.

"We often speak to them, wait a beat or two, and then respond for them – most people do it, and it’s how babies learn language and empathy,” she says. “For example, we’ll say, ‘Would you like some banana? I have a lovely banana just for you! You would, you would like a banana?’"

Deanne says that parents already talk to their babies while feeding them
Deanne adds that approaching babies in this way means that they're more likely to have healthy relationships with people when they grow up.

“If children grow up in a home where their bodies and voices are respected, then that’s the core value they will bring into their future relationships."

Let's not rubbish all new ideas before we've found out what they are.

The above is what Deanne Carson actually said in May 2018.
It is a well known tactic often employed by "The papers." to take a statement out of context or paraphrase it in order ridicule it.

Allira, my Mum was a Nanny for a while, in Hampstead, so probably quite a "posh" family compared to hers (my Grandad was a country Blacksmith). She used to talk to us when my sister and I were young, but mostly criticism and orders, rarely cuddled us. Perhaps she got her ideas from her Nanny days? She most certainly would NEVER have even dreamt of asking permission to change a nappy! When she had my very much younger brother I don't remember her saying anything to him at such times. She just got on with a necessary task. I didn't follow her example when I had children. "My goodness, where did all that come from?" and a running commentary would have been typical from me, followed by a tickle or maybe a tummy raspberry when the clean nappy was on.

Aely my mother was taken on by a wealthy London family as Nanny after they'd asked two other Nannies (Norland trained) to leave because they were far too strict.

My mother would have been kind and loving - but certainly would stand no nonsense! Her mantra was that there was something in every child that was lovable.

Complete cobblers.

Skydancer

Complete cobblers.

Hoping you mean the asking permission to change a nappy, Skydancer!

Allira

Skydancer

Complete cobblers.

Hoping you mean the asking permission to change a nappy, Skydancer!

Haha, I thought exactly the same Allira! I'm sure that's what Skydancer refers to as cobblers, not your lovely mum's mantra One I shared, but sometimes that loveable part took a lot of finding 😂

What a load of cr. p...😂

Magenta8

NotSpaghetti

This "discussion" is yet another example of people sounding off without trying to understand.

I don't know why people are so keen to rubbish things without knowing anything about them.

Speaking to Australia’s ABC News on 8 May, Deanne Carson said she works with parents from birth teaching them "to set up a culture of consent in the home" and to talk to their newborn baby saying things like "I’m going to change your nappy now, is that OK?"

“Of course a baby’s not going to respond and say, ‘Yes, mum, that’s awesome, I’d love to have my nappy changed!’ but if you leave a space, and wait for body language, and wait to make eye contact, then you’re letting that child know that their response matters,” says Deanne.

Since giving that interview, Deanne has found her views ridiculed online.

Deanne tells BBC Three that her words have been misunderstood.

She says parents should communicate with babies while changing their nappies, so that – even though they can’t respond with words - they learn from an early age that they are in control of their bodies.

Deanne Carson appeared on ABC Australia
“We read to small children with no expectation that they will pick up a book and read it back to us or even really understand what the book is about,” Deanne explains. “What we are doing there is building the foundations of literacy and normalising reading. So when we practise consent with babies, we are doing exactly the same.”

Deanne, who works with the child protection organisation Body Safety Australia, explains that parents already talk to their babies about what they like and don’t like.

"We often speak to them, wait a beat or two, and then respond for them – most people do it, and it’s how babies learn language and empathy,” she says. “For example, we’ll say, ‘Would you like some banana? I have a lovely banana just for you! You would, you would like a banana?’"

Deanne says that parents already talk to their babies while feeding them
Deanne adds that approaching babies in this way means that they're more likely to have healthy relationships with people when they grow up.

“If children grow up in a home where their bodies and voices are respected, then that’s the core value they will bring into their future relationships."

Let's not rubbish all new ideas before we've found out what they are.

The above is what Deanne Carson actually said in May 2018.
It is a well known tactic often employed by "The papers." to take a statement out of context or paraphrase it in order ridicule it.

Thanks Magenta. That was needed .