Well done to the Nurses who stood up for Women’s Rights

And changing rooms and other spaces for women only.
You’d think it would be pretty cut and dried now wouldn’t you?
Anyway, well done them and any other woman who has stood up for women’s rights.It takes backbone to go up against institutional idiocy.

Well done to them. The idiocy of telling 300 female nurses that if they weren't happy in a changing room with a man a cupboard had been made available for them.
It really beggars belief. So glad people are beginning to see sense.
A transwoman is a man.

Honestly who would have thought if we were to wind back a matter of 20 years or so. that women would have to jump through hoops in going through a 16 day trial to prove what has already been established and what should be an absolute right for the safety, privacy and dignity of the individual.

Given the constant mantra of "the letter of the law must be obeyed" when it suits why therefore has there been so much shilly shallying on the part of Bridget Phillipson in holding back trans guidance to work forces.?

No woman or girl should have to suffer the indignities these women have had to put up with. "Institutional Idiocy" indeed it is!

The nurses had complained that he/she had been watching them undressing. Very creepy and possibly dangerous.
How many of us would want our DDs or GDs in that position.

You don't bugger about with Northern women.
Seriously though this is my NHS trust, how am I supposed to have faith in the service they offer.

Well done to them all.

A victory for common sense but it's just the beginning.

I really hope it is just the beginning. We now need to make it more acceptable for transwomen to be 'out' as such, and not to fool themselves into thinking that nobody knows. When that happens they can more easily change in front of other men.

What is the point of a single-sex space that can be used by people of either sex?

I have a gut feeling, and maybe I'm wrong, that there would be some in the government who would have preferred the ruling to go the other way, they just don't come across as being very on board with it.

I dread to think if that had been the outcome, how all the areas we regard as safe places would be severely compromised.

I have a trans niece who wouldn't put anyone in a scenario like those ladies experienced..

I don't know how many more women are going to have to go to employment tribunals and the like before the government insist on the law being enacted, but let's also not forget these actions have to be privately funded. There have to be fund raisers to cover the high cost of the legal representation. Of course the employers have public funds available to them, the rest covered by insurance so don't care how protracted the proceedings are.

I have wittered on for some years about those of us in the WI who have/had transwomen accepted without a vote of the membership.

The National Federation wrote a grovelling, mealy mouthed apology that transwomen would no longer be accepted in the WI. However they say that they are going to start up Sisterhood groups which accept transwomen. So my next email to BFWI will be asking if the members of the WI have to pay towards this new venture ?

In our WI magazine we often have pictures of suffragettes. How two-faced can the WI be? Our grandmothers and great grandmothers fought for Women’s Rights, they would be horrified at how their sacrifices have been squandered.

Unfortunately Flippin2 there are far too many, especially in the NHS it seems, who are only too happy to.

Rosie51

I don't know how many more women are going to have to go to employment tribunals and the like before the government insist on the law being enacted, but let's also not forget these actions have to be privately funded. There have to be fund raisers to cover the high cost of the legal representation. Of course the employers have public funds available to them, the rest covered by insurance so don't care how protracted the proceedings are.

I think the supporters hope this strategy will eventually wear people down until they just capitulate, and give up.

I am going to make myself very unpopular with when say what I think.

My understanding is that Rose had been using the women's changing room since 2019 and it was only in 2023 that a small group of nurses decided that it was an offence to their dignity as women to have to share a changing room with a trans male.

Rose strongly denies that she looked at the women in a creepy way. Incidentally, do they mind sharing a changing room with lesbians who might look at them while they change?

I find many examples of the way trans men trample on women's rights very offensive, for instance wishing to compete against women in sports.

On the face of it I find it hard to summon up a great deal of sympathy for the Victorian sensitivities of these snowflake nurses.

Lesbians are women.
This is a man.

"Rose strongly denies that she looked at the women in a creepy way" Well as none of us were there except the nurses involved so we cannot make a judgement on that, but why would we disbelieve women who are put in such a situation and feel threatened or merely uncomfortable? Why would we believe the Rose person who shouldn't be there. One of the nurses said he asked her three times whether she was going to get changed. This person is a biological male, and like others who seek to do the same they're being utterly provocative. Why can they never ask for the third space? in a hospital I bet somewhere other than the men's changing area could have been made available. I also read that one of the nurses had suffered some sexual abuse previously, and as such, being in such a situation caused her immense distress. So calling her out as a snowflake shows an amazing lack of empathy under the circumstances.

Anyway I thought calling people snowflakes was deemed pejorative these days.

Why would any woman be disturbed to have a lesbian in a changing room with her? are you suggesting that to be a lesbian would mean they are a danger to their own sex in such a scenario that's a sweeping assumption and without stating the obvious lesbians are women, this person is not a woman.

Magenta8 wrote On the face of it I find it hard to summon up a great deal of sympathy for the Victorian sensitivities of these snowflake nurses

Yeah, how silly these women are to be bothered that a man is witnessing their episode of menopausal flooding, or looking at their underwear or at their bodies, that may be scarred by surgery or bearing the evidence of multiple pregnancies, that only a woman can experience.

I expect snowflake nurses just do the pretty side of nursing, like wiping brows and arranging flowers. They'll leave the jobs of dealing with bodily fluids and blood and guts to the more manly nurses.

On the face of it I find it hard to summon up a great deal of sympathy for the Victorian sensitivities of these snowflake nurses.

Magenta, I find it hard to summon up tolerance for any woman(?) who can write such an intolerant post.

Magenta8 On the face of it I find it hard to summon up a great deal of sympathy for the Victorian sensitivities of these snowflake nurses.

Are you a woman, and if so are you quite happy to strip down to your underwear in front of males not related to you? 'Rose" is a male with a male body, not a woman. Why would I care that a lesbian was in the changing room with me, she has every right to be there unlike this man who is trying to get his wife pregnant while saying he's a woman.
Given the backlash women get for not wanting males in their single sex spaces it takes a lot of bravery to speak up. It's only in relatively recent years that anyone has felt empowered to do so. Rosie Duffield was ostracised by the Labour Party for daring to say men can't become women and that sex is immutable.

SueDonim excellent points. I'd forgotten these 'snowflake nurses' only mopped fevered brows or held someone's hand in a kindly way!

Of course to allow one 'special man' into the female changing room but to keep all the other males out is indirect discrimination against the other men, since they are all exactly the same sex.

The only people who can cope with the ordeal of calling out these men, are those women who are incredibly strong and resilient, it is an absolute ordeal to challenge these men and the systems that enable them.

eazybee

^On the face of it I find it hard to summon up a great deal of sympathy for the Victorian sensitivities of these snowflake nurses.^

Magenta, I find it hard to summon up tolerance for any woman(?) who can write such an intolerant post.

Me too.

The post is anti-women on a number of levels.

It is intolerant of women (how dare they question the male right to view female bodies at will?).

It is intolerant of lesbians (are they somehow confused in your mind with sex abusers, Magenta?).

It suggests that the male 'Rose's word is worth more than the word of several women - why should the fact that Rose says the way the women were looked at was not creepy mean that this is the case, when several women say they felt that it was.

It is apparently ignorant of the fact that trans men are, in fact, women, so are entitled to compete against other women in sport, unless the transmen have taken male hormones or other disallowed drugs.

Finally, it is offensive to suggest that women who do not want to undress in front of a male colleague are 'snowflakes'.

No wonder why you feel that your post might be unpopular with women.

eazybee

^On the face of it I find it hard to summon up a great deal of sympathy for the Victorian sensitivities of these snowflake nurses.^

Magenta, I find it hard to summon up tolerance for any woman(?) who can write such an intolerant post.

I think Magenta8 is confused in her thinking so perhaps we need to be tolerant of her.

Surely the answer is to give the small cupboard space to the trans nurse/s.

Not all trans people are obviously trans, and most certainly many pose no threat to women at all.

Straight men, like the ones who pose as trans or go into gay clubs are far more of a danger, they are not trans at all, just sex pests.