Would you use the App?

I only use my phone for texting and rarely take it when I go out - so a no from me. I don't intend to mingle with others for a very long time - so no problem, really!

As soon as it’s available I’ll be downloading it. I have no fears concerning any privacy issues. I do want this virus to be beaten.

At the moment no if it proved to be useful then yes but I think it’s a long way to prove what actually use it will be and I don’t understand why people would blindly follow a government initiative without question just because

Australia has been using it a weeek and I heard a spokesman says they re not sure how useful it will be

I don't have a smart phone but intended to buy one purely so that I can join the tracking scheme. However I'm not happy about joining anything that Cummings is involved with, either directly or indirectly and I've read that the UK one cannot be used in Europe and may make it difficult if we want to travel abroad in future. I have absolutely no idea why we have to use a different system to everyone else. In the same way that we didn't lock down when other countries did and will be the last country to wear masks in public places. So, yes, I do want to be tracked but not by this one. As it's for the greater good I probably will relent but I'm not happy about it.

maybee my thoughts exactly.

I am also concerned about data security.

What information Growstuff? I don't hold anything confidential on my phone and never use it for anything confidential, nor is it linked to any other computer. I'm too concerned about losing it.

Also, is it definite that it was Mr Cummings who decided to go down this route and which system to use?

The contract was given to one of his vote leave people [or his brother]; as with the Dyson ventilators it's as if contracts have to be given to people who support Brexit and the government not necessarily the people/companies that are the best ones for the job.

You mean Dominic Cummings brother or a vote leave brother?

Do you mean the government is only giving contracts to vote leaver voters?

Marc Warner is the brother of Ben Warner, who is best buddies with Dominic Cummings. He's associated with some people such as Peter(?) Thiel, who is behind a number of controversial political campaigns for Trump. He is a data scientist and it was his company which did much of the work "harvesting" names of people who were targeted in the Vote Leave campaign, along with Cambridge Analytica. They had millions of names, which they had obtained (allegedly illegally) who had shown in interest in xenophobia, reducing immigration, anti-EU, etc. They obtained the names by trawling through social media comments, so if you happened to make a joke about foreigners or said you wanted to reduce immigration, your name was added to a list and you were then sent ads on Facebook and Twitter and as spam, etc. There were so many of them that they became subliminal. Others weren't sent the messages and didn't know they existed. Warner's company has been given a number of lucrative government contracts over the last few months. It's alleged they weren't even put out to tender.

Why do I find that so easy to believe? Cynical, moi?

NfkDumpling Bluetooth technology, unlike GPS, doesn't locate your precise destination. The app will only ask you for the first part of your postcode. All the time you are negative for Covid-19, you will just communicate with other app users. However, as soon as you say that you have symptoms, you will be asked for further details and the information will be sent to a central database.

There are two main dangers from a data protection point of view:

1 The technology could be used in the future for other purposes.

2 Even though it's anonymous, the data will be analysed and will provide valuable information, if millions of people are involved. For example, it will provide information about how many people in specific areas within specific age groups needed ventilators.

That sounds quite harmless, but it's actually worth a fortune and marketing people will pay huge amounts of money for it. For example, a company wanting to sell oxygen masks would know where the greatest need is and could place advertisements strategically, either physically or online.

Warner's company has been paid £250,000 for the app, but he stands to make much more in the future from selling the information and, possibly, using the technology for other purposes.

PS. My daughter works for the ICO and they are very concerned about the potential for hacking and misuse of the data.

Ah, so it's not personal information, it's big business getting advantages.

I'll still have the app, as I think the ends justifies the means. There isn't time to analyse different systems and decide which has the least problems. The imperative is to get the infection figures down and anything which does that and gets us out of this mess is good.

Will the companies using GPS be any different?

It's possible that the app won't work effectively, anyway

Despite what the NCSC has continued to imply, the app will not, as it stands, work all the time on iOS nor Android since version 8. The operating systems won't allow the tracing application to broadcast its ID via Bluetooth to surrounding devices when it's running in the background and not in active use. Apple's iOS forbids it, and newer Google Android versions limit it to a few minutes after the app falls into the background.

That means that unless people have the NHS app running in the foreground and their phones awake most of the time, the fundamental principle underpinning the entire system – that phones detect each other – won't work.

It will work if people open the app and leave it open and the phone unlocked. But if you close it and forget to reopen it, or the phone falls asleep, the app will not broadcast its ID and no other phones around you will register that you've been close by.

There is more about the use of the data, but this is the question mark over its practical use.

www.theregister.co.uk/2020/05/05/uk_coronavirus_app/

That's worrying, MaisieD. As is the Cummings/Warner connection and the wider implications that it could be used for subliminal marketing, as well as the potential for the system not being compatible with European systems. Not to mention the apparent croneyism.

Do we have a choice, though? If we want this thing crushed, there's surely no option but to install the app?

Thanks for all the information it has been really interesting. I'm not sure about it still. I do think it might be better to recruit hundreds of people to trace and tell anyone who has been in contact with someone with the virus. It would be more effective and I think people would take much more notice. They could offer testing when they make contact.

Yes, I would download the app.

Singapore that usually complies to everything ask of it only has a 20% take up

Yes I would definitely.

That’s really interesting. It seems though that Italy is using a Bluetooth system and Germany is jettisoning the Google one it was going to use and is now looking at Bluetooth based one too. Although it probably depends on which paper you read. (And don’t ask me to find the links - I’ve browsed too far on other things to go back!).

I agree that Mr Cummings seems to have far too much influence. I would like to know if it was put out to tender.

No, don't see the point. It is no help if you encounter someone with no symptoms. The security of the app is questionable to say the least.

I have seen a number of assertions that it wasn't put out to tender, Nfk. (Can't link for much the same reason as you ? ).

I'm getting so angry about, and frustrated by, the apparent utter disregard of the 'rules' and the blatant cronyism. This is looking more and more corrupt.

utter disregard of the rules
You mean like Niel Ferguson who as just quit after being caught bringing his married lover into his home. Hypocrite ???

I would probably use it, but I would prefer there to be a system whereby everyone had to use an app of some sort (as I think was the case in China) before you could buy bus or train ticket, go into some premises (eg supermarkets) and so on, so that there was full compliance, as that would make it more accurate, and also because I don't see why some people should sacrifice their privacy when others can opt out.

It would be better if the app could be on a standalone device, so not attached to the data on our phones, but I can't see that happening. Maybe I would delete things like Facebook before installing it - I don't know. I'm not really bothered if the government know where I've been (the kitchen, bathroom and bedroom are the most-visited places these days!), but I'm less keen on giving up information on who I've called or what I've posted on social media.

I am fully aware that if someone powerful really wanted to know all of that they could do so, but (a) it's highly unlikely that they would be interested in me, and (b) they wouldn't find anything incriminating or interesting if they did - I'm a law-abiding type - but I don't like the idea of a national database of information that we all volunteer to populate.

I will definitely download the app. This virus is lethal and the World Health Organisation said weeks ago that testing tracking and tracing were essential in suppressing the virus so I fully support anything which helps in any way with that.