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Second waves - dealing with the virus part 2 😷😠

(232 Posts)
MawB Tue 23-Jun-20 08:59:01

It’s not gone, it’s not even going to be gone - but it’s how we deal with it that will make the difference.
Beijing faced lockdown after reporting an outbreak last week after being declared virus-free for a whole day.
An Anglesey chicken plant has had 175 new cases recently.
Germany has had a serious outbreak in and around Gütersloh starting in an abattoir and meat processing plant, it is suspected involving unsanitary living conditions for migrant workers.
Berlin has had a surge in the poor and densely populated Neu-Kölln area of the city
And now South Korea , previously held up as a shining example is facing a worrying surge as health authorities in South Korea admitted yesterday it was experiencing a “second wave” in Seoul.
Jeong Eun-kyeong, director of the Korea Centers for Disease Control and Prevention, is reported as saying it had become clear that a holiday weekend in early May marked the start of a new wave of infections in the densely populated greater Seoul area, which had previously seen few cases.
There are some common factors such as working temperatures in the meat processing plants but also the lamentable living conditions where migrant workers have been involved and of course predictable consequences in lapses in social distancing, but in all cases prompt identification, testing, tracking and isolating have been paramount in stopping these second waves from becoming countrywide.
I just hope that this time the government and our public health authorities can learn from the experience of others.

MayBee70 Tue 30-Jun-20 19:24:08

The thing about Bournemouth, though, is that it was very hot therefore lots of uv light and there would have been a breeze from the sea. So it wouldn't replicate conditions inland in crowded places. And without test, trace isolate etc how will any information be collated?

Fennel Tue 30-Jun-20 12:49:00

There was a good article in yesterday's Guardian, (not the main section) about the crowded beaches at Bournemouth . and other places where there have been packed crowds recently.
I can't find the ref. as it has gone for recycling.
The writer points out that these events will provide perfect settings for evidence that the virus will spread in those conditions. Or not.
Taking into account age groups, inside/outside, ethnic mixes etc.
ie was it worth taking the risk?
Hoping I've recalled it correctly.

growstuff Tue 30-Jun-20 11:31:04


Growstuff there's nothing to link anybody who is flying in to Britain and then going to Leicester to check into hospital, as far as I can see.

So it's all dog whistle "Let's blame Pakistanis"?

Chewbacca Tue 30-Jun-20 09:16:15

Growstuff there's nothing to link anybody who is flying in to Britain and then going to Leicester to check into hospital, as far as I can see.

growstuff Tue 30-Jun-20 09:10:06

I'm even more confused now. Apparently this 50% represents just 30 cases since 4 June.

There have been far more imported cases from Spain, Italy and France.

Admittedly, most of them were before 4 June, but that's not what the headline says.

growstuff Tue 30-Jun-20 08:57:17

I'm confused.

I believe East Midlands Airport is the nearest to Leicester. Does it operate flights from Pakistan?

Are people going straight from the plane to hospital? Why don't they go to Loughborough, Derby or Nottingham?

vegansrock Tue 30-Jun-20 07:07:58

If people in Leicester want to go to the pub aren’t they going to travel to the next town/ village? Are they going to stop travel in and out ?

Riverwalk Tue 30-Jun-20 06:34:54

Yes, I know the article was from the Telegraph but I was querying from whom the 'reports' came.

there have been reports of some arrivals ....

Did the reports come from hospitals in Leicester, the emergency services, airport authorities, etc. If some were going instantly to intensive care as reported they must have been in a bad way.

I'm just interested in the origin of the reports that spurred the article.

Chewbacca Mon 29-Jun-20 22:19:05

Reported where and by whom?

By me, in the post above yours; extract from the Telegraph. confused

MayBee70 Mon 29-Jun-20 20:40:53

It was in the Telegraph. 1/2 all imported cases have come from Pakistan.65,000 people have entered the UK from Pakistan since March 1st. 2 flights per day. 30 cases since 4th June have been from Pakistan. Some people literally go straight to hospital. The Emirates have suspended flights from Pakistan and there is risk of spread to Europe via air bridges. I’ve listened to DrJohns latest videos and, blow me the dog needed to go out for a wee just as I got to the relevant but, but I was able to rewind it.

Riverwalk Mon 29-Jun-20 20:06:12

there have been reports of some arrivals almost instantly going to hospital for intensive care,

Reported where and by whom?

Chewbacca Mon 29-Jun-20 19:16:08

Is this what you've seen Jane10?

Data from Public Health England (PHE) shows that 30 cases of coronavirus in people who have travelled from Pakistan since June 4, which is understood to represent half of the incidents of imported infection.

With up to two flights a day from Pakistan, there have been reports of some arrivals almost instantly going to hospital for intensive care, amid concerns that the influx has led to localised clusters....

MayBee70 Mon 29-Jun-20 19:15:03

It was on Dr John Campbell’s blog: quite a recent one. He’s very concerned about what is happening in places like India so wouldn’t be someone to say something like that in a nasty way. I’ll try to re listen to the blog and get more details. They don’t necessarily go straight to hospital. I tend to have it on in the background and can’t always take in all the information. I did think that Leicester was more Hindu than Muslim though, but I could be wrong.

varian Mon 29-Jun-20 19:11:14

England has the worst record in Europe

maddyone Mon 29-Jun-20 18:58:23

I don’t know if it’s true, but I have heard that too.

Jane10 Mon 29-Jun-20 18:38:12

Is it really true that people are flying in from Pakistan and going direct to hospital?

AGAA4 Mon 29-Jun-20 16:32:46

As Leicester has had a big spike in infections something had to be done. I think they have delayed the opening of bars and restaurants for two weeks.

Allowing the infection to spread to other parts of the country has to be stopped.

GrannyGravy13 Mon 29-Jun-20 16:07:49

The Mayor of Leicester was interviewed on the lunchtime news and he is not in agreement with locking down the city or even delaying the opening of bars, restaurants etc.

So much for localised lockdowns to help control the virus, not sure how this could be imposed without local political agreement?

growstuff Mon 29-Jun-20 15:42:25


Growstuff, Yes I do. It’s not perfect I will admit. But I certainly wouldn’t want to live in a country where disagreement with government policy was a suicide mission. Even Gransnet would not be allowed in so many countries.

You may feel you are not listened to here but you are allowed to express your opinion without fear. By the government that is.

We'll have to agree to disagree. I'm not claiming for one minute that the UK is anything like North Korea, Russia, Saudi Arabia or some other countries.

However, I honestly think people should ask themselves just how democratic the UK is. It's being chipped away under our noses.

Incidentally, democracy is not the same thing as free speech and they don't always go together.

growstuff Mon 29-Jun-20 15:34:29


Dr. Ellie Cannon says this morning she’s sticking her neck out here by saying she doesn’t think there will be a second wave.

Be great if she’s right.

Many scientists think the virus is weakening and there won’t be a second wave. Just whack-a-mole of small clusters n the next few weeks.

I'm sure I've asked this before, but could you please give some evidence that the virus is "weakening"?

I have a friend (a Professor at a UK university) whose team is working on how the virus operates and he doesn't seem think the virus is weakening.

Scientists have a better understanding of how it attacks the body, which means that treatments could improve, but the virus itself isn't weakening.

So which reputable scientists or doctors think differently?

Obviously, I'd like it to be true, which is why I'd like to see some evidence.

MayBee70 Mon 29-Jun-20 12:23:15

This was in the Leicester area by the way.

MayBee70 Mon 29-Jun-20 12:22:41

Just mentioned on another thread that people were flying in from Pakistan and going straight to hospital with Covid. It was in one of Dr John Campbell’s blogs and he’s very thorough about getting his facts right. I need to listen to it again, though, as there’s so much to take in in his blogs.

Chewbacca Sun 28-Jun-20 12:33:59

Leicester is facing another, localised, lockdown due to an increase in reported cases according to BBC news today.

Jane10 Sun 28-Jun-20 11:24:42

It's not a second wave it's just another outbreak! Test and trace.

Callistemon Sun 28-Jun-20 11:07:27

With respect to Dr Ellie Cannon, she is a GP and broadcadter, she's not an epidemiologist nor a virologist nor even a scientist.

Her speciality is women's health, apparently.