Up to the 2nd December.

I work in a school I'm a bit anxious going in tomorrow after a weeks break I'm 63 and have a few medical conditions asthma being one of them though all guidelines are put in practice I feel more worried now than I was in the last lockdown

Totally agree with what you say earnshaw. I'm in the same position with a vulnerable DH. All we can do is try our best to look after ourselves and our loved ones and if possible help others in need.

I have downloaded literally hundreds of papers from the learned journals and in the press (I produce a current affairs email for a local group) and this is the most appalling over-reaction to a respiratory virus ever! Using the current criteria, we would have to lock down in the flu season EVERY year. Tom Jefferson and Carl Heneghan from the Oxford Centre for Evidence Based Medicine have handed the PM a blueprint: Planning the Way Forward, which is complete common sense and based on established practices for dealing with pandemic infections. This virus is not Ebola, it is not Spanish Flu, it is not the Black Death (I know, that's bacterial), it has an Infection Fatality Rate of between 0.1 and 0.2%. That's one or two per thousand infected, with the very elderly disproportionately infected (x1000) as opposed to seasonal flu, which kills some children and young people every year. We had a low flu season last winter, and sadly, Covid is taking away the elderly frail who would have died of the flu, or even a cold. Is it actually worse to die of Covid or of flu? SAGE is stuffed full of mathematical modellers and sociologists who are working to models and projections. It has become an echo chamber and they are now determined to 'prove' that their initial modelling is correct. However, as the physicist Richard Feynman said: "It doesn't matter how beautiful your theory is, it doesn't matter how smart you are. If it doesn't agree with experiment, it's wrong." Well, the 'experiment' is real-world data: the fact is that the Death Rate is NORMAL for the time of year. Having 85 - 90% intensive care bed occupancy is NORMAL - would you want your intensive care beds running at 60%. Only 48 Nightingale Hospital beds were ever used. Does it matter that the infection rate, based on a hundreds of thousands of tests, is running higher than the 'reasonable worst case scenario'? No, it doesn't, because what matters is hospitalisation and death rates, which are NORMAL. The Zoe Covid Symptom App and study, with 4 million app users, is showing that the infection rate is mainly passing harmlessly among young and healthy people, and that the infection rate is either levelling off, or coming down. The PM is inexperienced at governing, ignorant of science, and terrified of admitting that they got it wrong. He has been taken in thrall by SAGE, who will never have to suffer redundancy, penury and the other consequences of Lockdown, and can never be voted out. Remember, infections are coming down NOW. they will claim it was their lockdown which did it, just as in the Spring, when the infection rate had already peaked. As Richard Feynman also said: "I believe that a scientist looking at nonscientific problems is just as dumb as the next guy." Time for Boris and the whole cabinet to look at the wider harms and issues, and put them on the balance sheet. Time for some rational thinking and honesty!

Great comment Frankie51?
The Christmas obsession really irritates me. Lives are more important than carving the turkey, yet people go on and on about it. Even Beth Whatsit’s first question to the PM after his important address was could families meet up for Christmas!
And why can’t she speak properly? I can’t concentrate on what she says for the hip hop down with the kids missing ‘t’s and ‘g’s all over the place. It’s like being a professional pianist and missing out notes ?
As another poster said, at least bombs aren’t raining down on us.

BlueBelle

Whenever we come out after a few weeks it ll shoot up
Until they get a workable track and trace nothing will make any difference or until they stop overseas travel This is now termed the ‘Spanish wave’ as it all came about from European travel, both ways
I m very annoyed as I m in a low risk area and we could easily have kept going

Couldn't agree more Bluebell.
GPs surgeries knew way back in July that the numbers were going up in October. Sadly this useless government did nothing and they could have done so much. They handed the competent NHS Track and Trace to the totally useless Serco Track and Trace and now we are in this situation again. Serco have a terrible reputation but they are friends of the Tories.
So much blood on their hands. Plus the misery of not being able to see or hug your loved ones.

The govt are trying to "follow the science" but that is very difficult when it seems that the scientists can't agree with one another

Carolpaint

Read Professor Gupta. This is awful, abysmal news. Hate it, all the pathetic of our land rejoicing, it will be a millstone for a century. We have a high death rate because of the NHS being too successful, people are living that should not be. Many of our fittest have to work long shifts because of wimps that have decided their previous illness precludes them coming in duty, others that have to work have have have to do their duty. Many nurses, midwives, teachers, transport workers are having to carry all the slope shoulders.

Professor Gupta’s suggestion relies on the concept of herd immunity. There is no possibility of this, because immunity lasts but a few weeks.

Just want to say, keep as safe as you possibly can

NemosMum

I have downloaded literally hundreds of papers from the learned journals and in the press (I produce a current affairs email for a local group) and this is the most appalling over-reaction to a respiratory virus ever! Using the current criteria, we would have to lock down in the flu season EVERY year. Tom Jefferson and Carl Heneghan from the Oxford Centre for Evidence Based Medicine have handed the PM a blueprint: Planning the Way Forward, which is complete common sense and based on established practices for dealing with pandemic infections. This virus is not Ebola, it is not Spanish Flu, it is not the Black Death (I know, that's bacterial), it has an Infection Fatality Rate of between 0.1 and 0.2%. That's one or two per thousand infected, with the very elderly disproportionately infected (x1000) as opposed to seasonal flu, which kills some children and young people every year. We had a low flu season last winter, and sadly, Covid is taking away the elderly frail who would have died of the flu, or even a cold. Is it actually worse to die of Covid or of flu? SAGE is stuffed full of mathematical modellers and sociologists who are working to models and projections. It has become an echo chamber and they are now determined to 'prove' that their initial modelling is correct. However, as the physicist Richard Feynman said: "It doesn't matter how beautiful your theory is, it doesn't matter how smart you are. If it doesn't agree with experiment, it's wrong." Well, the 'experiment' is real-world data: the fact is that the Death Rate is NORMAL for the time of year. Having 85 - 90% intensive care bed occupancy is NORMAL - would you want your intensive care beds running at 60%. Only 48 Nightingale Hospital beds were ever used. Does it matter that the infection rate, based on a hundreds of thousands of tests, is running higher than the 'reasonable worst case scenario'? No, it doesn't, because what matters is hospitalisation and death rates, which are NORMAL. The Zoe Covid Symptom App and study, with 4 million app users, is showing that the infection rate is mainly passing harmlessly among young and healthy people, and that the infection rate is either levelling off, or coming down. The PM is inexperienced at governing, ignorant of science, and terrified of admitting that they got it wrong. He has been taken in thrall by SAGE, who will never have to suffer redundancy, penury and the other consequences of Lockdown, and can never be voted out. Remember, infections are coming down NOW. they will claim it was their lockdown which did it, just as in the Spring, when the infection rate had already peaked. As Richard Feynman also said: "I believe that a scientist looking at nonscientific problems is just as dumb as the next guy." Time for Boris and the whole cabinet to look at the wider harms and issues, and put them on the balance sheet. Time for some rational thinking and honesty!

So what is the cause of 40000 ++ excess deaths this year?
Have all the other countries got it wrong?

The government are trying to keep the virus at bay whilst getting the economy going. It is unchartered territory and they have an incredibly difficult job to do. Some just seem to have a go at them whatever they do but what would they do if they were in charge? It is up to all of us to follow the distancing guidelines, otherwise it will keep rising until there is an effective vaccine. It is in people’s hands.

If people had done what was asked of them we wouldn’t be in this position. All down to selfish people who will not adhere to social distancing. We all want to be with our families, I have only seen my 98 year old mother once since the end of March. She is being kept safe and understands what is happening, just fed up like the rest of us.

Hollysteers

Hurray for some commonsense! All the people wining about Christmas really irritates me, too. We are in the grip of a pandemic, no-one knows how long it will last and how we will get out of it or when. Just be thankful you are still alive. We never hear, of course, about the people who find Christmas a chore and are glad not to have to do it all again. I expect most of us have had many years of coping with guests and visitors whom we invite out of a sense of duty. There are 365 days in the year, minus 2 still leaves 363.

Boris Johnson and the government have not got everything right but I believe they are doing their best. If anyone knows of anyone who could do better please tell us who you have in mind.

And when the lockdown ends everyone will go to each others houses for christmas.i say we should let things ride itself out

I agree with you.from the start i said it was over reaction.abd i got called some really nasty names.more people die from flu alone each year.ok i know this one is a bit more lethal.to vunerable people.but it is an over reaction

My brorger is a sciebtist and a kaboratory technican.he knows what hes talking about.boris is making a moubtain out of a mole hill and causing panic and stress tk the vunerable

Brother and scientist laboratory techncian.mountain out of a mole hill

I don’t feel any pity whatsoever for the government. We are where we are because of the poor decisions that have been made. Initial lockdown too late, kids sent back to education too soon. Dominic Cummings keeping his job and thus making lots of people feel that they could get away with that behaviour too. This lockdown should have happened at leat two weeks ago and in my opinion won’t have as significant an impact if education remains open. I am just left wondering how many more people will become ill before schools and universities have to be closed.

Until the idiots take things seriously this chaos will continue. Speaking to a local GP. GP had a call from woman wanting antibiotics. GP goes through her symptoms. Dry cough, loss of smell and taste etc. Classic Covid19 symptoms. Told to get a test. Refused and demanded antibiotics. GP reiterated for her to be tested. She refused and when told to isolate with her 2 children stated that people should keep away from her. So she and her family have infected an unknown number of people. Unfortunately Covid19 is not notifiable so GP can do nothing.

All very well some saying protect the vulnerable and everyone else carry on but it will still mean pressure on hospitals, my daughter and family are awaiting covid test results as my granddaughter's best friend, also 19months has just been diagnosed as positive for it and they were at the park together last week. Mark Drakeford did the right thing of putting Wales on 17 day lockdown, only a week to go for us. We should be able to continue with other hospital treatments in Wales. Before anyone says but they have the Nightingale hospitals yes we have, just not the staff

I am in Scotland and Sturgeon decided a 5tier.I am high risk and Haven't left house since beginning of March.I was on life support 2years ago which resulted on me now on bipap.I live in one of the highest COVID areas there has been a big amount of cases on our housing estate alone.I don’t think I will see my two grandkids at Xmas which breaks my heart as lost my husband last Xmas and grandkids had such a very close bond with him.I just have felt Robbed since Xmas last year loosing husband funeral then COVID no grandkids to come visit or have their stay overs.But we have all obeyed rules.I think we will be hit with lockdown soon Nicola likes to be different to rest of government.I have just to accept it’s going to be lonely Xmas but there will 1000s more the same.stay safe people

Jackie my heart goes out to you - life can be extremely cruel.
Wishing you well and hopefully you will see your grandchildren - even if no hugging!

Tillybelle: I agree with you. What Carolpaint said was appalling and without justification.

NanaAnnie

Assuming the decision isn't overturned in Parliament on Wednesday.

That is unlikely. There are some Tory rebels but, the Labour Party is supporting it.

Anyone know where we can find out what the rules and regulations are for this current lockdown. Is there a website?

Newatthis

Anyone know where we can find out what the rules and regulations are for this current lockdown. Is there a website?

It’s on the government website, tells you all you need to know.