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Asian Lockdown

(98 Posts)
GagaJo Sun 10-Jan-21 20:35:44

I said this in March. I've said it somewhere on here this week (and last week, and...)

Stricter coronavirus lockdown measures such as those enforced in Asia should be introduced in the UK to stop the spread of the virus, experts have reportedly suggested.

Stricter measures should include the closure of places of worship as well as compulsory mask-wearing in order to stop the spread of the new COVID variant sweeping across the country, several experts have said.

Anthony Costello, a professor of global health at UCL and a former WHO director, told the Mirror: “We are in a national crisis with a pandemic out of control.

“We should have no nurseries open, no synagogues, no churches, no mosques. We should have compulsory masks, two-metre distancing. We have to take this really seriously – that’s what Asian states did.”

According to the newspaper, his comments were echoed by Christina Pagel, professor of operational research at University College London, who has previously questioned the efficacy of the latest lockdown.

She told the Mirror: “We have to start thinking about mandatory isolation, like in China and Vietnam. We have lots of empty hotels. We could use that space.”

Biscuitmuncher Sun 10-Jan-21 22:18:37

There is medication to control mental illness? Oh my gosh that's that problem solved then

tidyskatemum Sun 10-Jan-21 22:24:43

Don’t just assume that Asia means China. All SE Asian countries are far more used - and willing- to wear masks than we are. Test and trace (remember that?) is generally very efficient and contacts are far more likely to isolate when they are told.

grannyrebel7 Sun 10-Jan-21 22:25:46

Biscuitmuncher you are endangering other people's lives if you do not stick to the rules. Just like to add about how Australia and New Zealand had stricter lockdowns and they are democracies. If they can do it why can't we?

M0nica Sun 10-Jan-21 22:29:53

EllanVannin If only. Problems with mental health have been increasing in society for a long time and lockdowns have only aggravated the matter. This is why the whole concept of 'bubbling was brought in, single households being able to visit and spcialise with another household.

I have every sympathy for Biscuitmuncher in the dilemma she has faced with the mental health issues in her family. My DD came to deaths door as the result of the cut back and retreat to phone consultations by her local GP. Fortunately, the problem was discovered and medication prescribed before she had the imminent fatal heart attack that she was in line for before she was treated.

However there is a saying that 'hard cases make bad law' and the problems her family members and my DD had are a strong argument for much better medical help and understanding of mental problems during lockdown. What price saving a COVID life, if someone with something else dies because of a lack of services that were cancelled because of COVID.

But deciding as a result to ignore all the COVID restraints, will only make matters worse for you, your family members and people like DD because they will only prolong the outbreak and prolong the length of the lockdown, and if caught flouting the rules, it could be very expensive for you.

Never cut off your nose to spite your face - and at present that is what you are doing.

MissAdventure Sun 10-Jan-21 22:33:54

I would support a properly planned and strictly enforced lockdown, provided it was shown to be the only way to fight the virus.

I think we're heading down that road, anyway.

FlyingSolo Sun 10-Jan-21 22:35:04

A balance has to be found between the risk of becoming infected with the virus and the risk to mental health. It is not right to say there is medication to control mental health. Medication for mental health can be trial and error and not all mental health problems can be fixed with medication. There is no quick fix for either the virus or for mental health problems. There are medications and treatments for the virus but they too are trial and error and not guaranteed to succeed. I haven't left my home for 43 weeks tomorrow, I live alone with no garden. I can assure you this is not doing me any good.

GagaJo Sun 10-Jan-21 22:38:17

The REALLY sad thing MissAdventure, is that IF enough people had really complied (and of course, if the government had enforced closure on pubs etc) it may not have been necessary to have a rigid and strict lockdown.

But as soon as the government say, 'outside exercise only once a day' we have scenes like the parks this week or the beaches in April/May.

MissAdventure Sun 10-Jan-21 22:39:26

One of the long covid issues can be mental health problems.

As it is, I don't feel events up until now have done anyone's mental health any favours.

Littleannie Sun 10-Jan-21 22:45:43

Yes, grannybags, dentists were closed during the first lockdown, and many people suffered dreadfully. If you have never had an extraction which got infected, think yourself lucky. I did. I ended up having a piece of my jawbone removed.

MissAdventure Sun 10-Jan-21 22:52:41

I have an infection I my tooth, right up in the root.

I'm still trying to sort out 2 extractions which need doing around it.

Esspee Sun 10-Jan-21 22:53:49

Leucretzia. The whole province in which Shijiazhuang is situated had a total of only 120 new cases on Thursday last week. All but one in the city itself.

11 million residents are in strict lockdown and nobody can enter or leave the city. 5,000 test sites have been set up and everybody is being tested. This is likely to take 10 days (going by the time it took to test Wuhan’s citizens.)

Compare their daily count of 120 with ours of 55,000.
Compare the speed in which they can test entire populations.

Seems to me we could learn a lot from the Chinese approach.

M0nica Sun 10-Jan-21 22:54:49

Gagajo The problem is not that people did not comply with the rules they did, but this current reactive government did not think things through clearly. In highly populated urban environements, where many people, especially families with children, live in cramped and inadequate accommodation a complete lockdown, with people housebound is going to cause more problems than they solve. If people have to live in prison conditions, you need an enormous number of people to police them. The ratio in prison between prisoners and warders is quite high. This would not be practical

The result would be a rapid rise in mental health conditions and domestic abuse of all kinds, including suicides and murder. It would, in hot weather, lead to wholesale rule disobedience and probably rioting.

Similarly the crowding in public green spaces is because of the high ratio of people needing to use the space to the size of the space. There is a simple solution and that would be a rolling curfew, where neighbourhoods were allocated times when they could take exercise in public spces, with adjoining residential areas heavily policed during their curfew time.

All the problems of not distancing have risen in urban areas. In the quite highly populated rural area I live in, there has been very little flouting of distancing, because there is plenty of space for everyone to get out locally, walk the footpaths, wander around the village and for children to use the playground.

We need some open and constructive thinking on the subject not just constantly blaming 'other people' who is, of course, anybody but us.

MissAdventure Sun 10-Jan-21 23:03:55

It's not a matter of blame; that's almost immaterial at this stage.

It's about how best to gain footing.

The nearest we came was just before the schools opened.

Alegrias1 Sun 10-Jan-21 23:10:40

I think this pandemic has driven people beyond the limits of reason. I mean the people who think we need to copy totalitarian regimes, for goodness sake. Scaring people witless so they'll do what they're told now seems to be the method of choice for our governments.

The reason people do what they are told in China is because if they don't, they'll get shot.

We have given up so much already in this crisis. We are living in a time and place where it is illegal to travel to another part of our own country. Where policemen think it's ok to ask someone outside with a cup of coffee where they've come from and what they're doing.

One of the options for this much vaunted Asian style lockdown is compulsory quarantine in a location decided by the government. Everybody has their limits, and that would be mine. Incarceration by the government because you might be sick, and they won't trust you to do the right thing? No, too much.

Lucretzia Sun 10-Jan-21 23:12:59

Quite agree, Alegrias1 ... again

China 2019

Great place to live ... not

Grannybags Sun 10-Jan-21 23:13:17

I didn't mean I wanted dentists etc to close I just meant that was what a really strict lockdown meant.

I'm struggling with my own mental health at the moment and I just wish everyone would abide by the rules if it helps us to get out of this mess any sooner

Chewbacca Sun 10-Jan-21 23:37:39

Another here in agreement with Alegrias1.

In regards to a total lockdown including the closure of dentists; I think that's madness. I saw my dentist in July when they reopened and was told then that he'd seen some of the worst dental infections in patients, due to an originally minor condition going untreated, than he'd seen in all his 45 years as a dental surgeon. If you're going to close down dental surgeries, you'll be inflicting more burdens on an already fragile health service because patients will end up in hospitals for treatment.

Curlygirl Sun 10-Jan-21 23:40:23

I think the lockdown does need to be tightened as it is frightening how many people are ignoring the rules but given the way China tried to hide the extent of the virus and are not cooperating with WHO who are investigating the source of the outbreak I wouldn’t believe a single word they say.

MissAdventure Sun 10-Jan-21 23:46:53

All these half arsed lockdowns with so many exemptions and exceptions don't make anyone feel that we're all in it together.

Kandinsky Mon 11-Jan-21 08:41:39

I definitely think all places of worship should be closed completely, along with nurseries and non essential shops.
I’m sorry, but trusting in God to keep you coronavirus free is not really an option at the moment.,

Kandinsky Mon 11-Jan-21 08:45:46

There’s less restrictions now than there was back in the 1st lockdown, yet more people are dying now with this new variant - it just doesn’t make sense to me.
Lock us down until the majority of at risk people are vaccinated as the vaccine is the only way out of this.

BlueSky Mon 11-Jan-21 09:00:47

We can’t have a free western style life and then wish for a totalitarian regime solution. We can’t have our cake and eat it!

MissAdventure Mon 11-Jan-21 09:05:25

Why not?
We all know and understand the reasons, and that a temporary measure will be enough to halt the virus from overwhelming us completely.

Why can't we?

Alegrias1 Mon 11-Jan-21 09:24:12

I'm amazed that people from the generation that make up most of Gransnet's demographic think that adopting the methods of a totalitarian regime is acceptable. I think you must be mixing up tighter restrictions with punishing people who disobey. By the way I think we should restrict the interactions more. Places of worship are closed in Scotland, there's somewhere to start for England.

Why can't we wish for a totalitarian regime solution? Because the government govern, and the police maintain order, under our consent. That's not a pie in the sky, left wing idea, its the basis for society in the UK. If we start doing what the government say just because they are telling us to and because of the threat of punishment, then the basis of our society is lost. Lockdowns achieve their aims - and it will no matter how much you try to demonise others - and it's succeeding due to the acceptance of the people that its the right thing to do. Coercing people not to sit on a park bench is not how a proper society behaves.

BlueSky Mon 11-Jan-21 09:28:56

Well said Alegrias you answered a lot better than I could have! The British people and totalitarian regimes never got on!