Lateral flow tests

Jillybird
Hi! My husband and I have both had 2 AZ vaccinations. We are on the Office of National Statistics research testing programme. For about a year they've been coming to the house every month and taking blood and doing swabs. The blood shows whether or not you have antibodies, so whether you've had covid in the past. The swabs show whether or not you have/haven't got covid when the test was done. The last ONS shows that my husband has antibodies (from his vaccinations) but showed that I have no antibodies (the vaccinations haven't worked for me, probably due to taking steroids for the last 10 months which lowers your immune system).
We are both doing lateral flow tests twice weekly which have all been negative.
I'm really pleased that we are on the ONS programme as I would otherwise assume that since I've had both my jabs that I was well protected. The no antibodies result proves differently. It's as if I've not had any vaccinations so I'll need to be extra careful in future. There must be quite a number of people in my position who think that they're well protected but aren't.

No you wouldn't. But think about it for a moment. How much better would we all feel if no new Covid cases were reported? We started off worrying about deaths., then it was hospitalisation, now there is to be no freedom until there are no cases. Why does no one else see the pattern here and realise just how manipulated we have all been.

And that last comment is exactly what I am talking about.

Franbern

Problem with these LFT is that they are so very inefficient and get so many flase positives. At my daughters school, two of her pupils got positive results, which proved negative when proper test carried out. A few days later teacher at one of my g.sons school got positive test -which would have meant him going into isolation over next weeks half term when his family are going on holiday - proper test showed this to be a negative.

If we cannot trust these test results, seem little point in doing them.

If you have a positive lateral flow test, you then have to have PCR test, this ensures all cases are caught, and any false neg/positives are quantified. Joining the Zoe app ensures tests arrive promptly, and results given day after posting back,very efficient. If teachers test was positive on lab Test then yes isolation would have been necessary, but as it showed negative on lab Test, what is the problem? Better be safe , and although had both vaccines, still test twice weekly.

www.gov.uk/government/news/new-analysis-of-lateral-flow-tests-shows-specificity-of-at-least-999

GrannyRose15

No you wouldn't. But think about it for a moment. How much better would we all feel if no new Covid cases were reported? We started off worrying about deaths., then it was hospitalisation, now there is to be no freedom until there are no cases. Why does no one else see the pattern here and realise just how manipulated we have all been.

Why? Because you're only manipulated if you allow yourself to be.

The PCR texts also give out lots of false positives. When the LFT's first came out they were touted as far more accurate than the PCR test. Then 'cases' went down using the LFT, shortly afterwards it was said that they were also giving false positives (or negatives). It would be far better for you to spend your time educating yourselves as to how to boost your immunity rather than waiting for a flawed outcome from any of these tests.

Yup, I do them twice a week. Negative. Glasgow needs all the help we can give.

I did my first one on Monday thankfully it was a negative. I’ve six left as I received a pack of 7 perhaps my DH will do one himself he’s confused about the whole process so he’ll need support. These tests will give us security in the knowledge we’re not carrying. Surely it can only be for the good.

effalump

The PCR texts also give out lots of false positives. When the LFT's first came out they were touted as far more accurate than the PCR test. Then 'cases' went down using the LFT, shortly afterwards it was said that they were also giving false positives (or negatives). It would be far better for you to spend your time educating yourselves as to how to boost your immunity rather than waiting for a flawed outcome from any of these tests.

It is rare for LFTs to produce false positives. They are far more likely to give false negatives, which depends on the skill of the person doing the test. Self-testing is more likely to produce a false negative result than one done by people who have been properly trained. That's why LFTs are no guarantee that a person is negative.

effalump How do you suggest boosting immunity to Covid?

esgt1967

GrannyRose15

The longer we continue testing, the longer restrictions will be in place.
It's time to get back to normal.

I agree with GrannyRose15 but not going to elaborate as I will be crucified for having that opinion.

We have achieved our aim of protecting the vulnerable (of which I am one) as best we can with the vaccinations, we need to get on with our lives now.

Thanks. Not many people on here seem to agree with me. And I suspect even fewer would dare to admit it.

growstuff

GrannyRose15

No you wouldn't. But think about it for a moment. How much better would we all feel if no new Covid cases were reported? We started off worrying about deaths., then it was hospitalisation, now there is to be no freedom until there are no cases. Why does no one else see the pattern here and realise just how manipulated we have all been.

Why? Because you're only manipulated if you allow yourself to be.

Then you have allowed yourself to be manipulated for the last 15 months. Most of what we have been "asked"/ "required"/ "ordered" to do has been a gross over reaction to the actual threat of the disease. We should never have agreed to be locked down for so long and we have all been manipulated by fearmongering into doing what we have been told.
Post after post on this site has kept the fear going.
We should all be ashamed of what we have done to this country in order to protect the oldies who have already had a good shot at life.
It's to be hoped, for the sake of all Gransnetters, that young people never realise just how much we have cost them.

No, I haven't allowed myself to be manipulated. There is almost nothing I've missed over the last 15 months. I'm fed up of people lecturing others about "fear". I haven't been frightened because I knew there was almost no chance that I would be infected.

If you think taking sensible precautions is being subject to "fearmongering", I'm afraid we differ about who has fallen down the rabbit hole.

How would you feel I said you'd been manipulated into voting for Brexit?

The government says 'fewer than one false positive in every 1,000 lateral flow tests carried out'. However, if you relate LFT false positives to total LFT positives, the figure was nearer 20%. The BBC reported in March that 18% of LFT positive results were overturned by subsequent PCR laboratory tests.

This article deals with some of the uncertainties about LFT.

www.theguardian.com/world/2021/apr/15/rapid-covid-testing-in-england-may-be-scaled-back-over-false-positives

Thanks for the link Cunco. I must admit I don't understand why the number of positives stays the same, even if the number of genuine positives falls. I'll see if I can find something else, which explains it.

Meanwhile, the number of confirmed cases has doubled in a week, so I hope that's a blip.

If your LFT shows a positive result, you need to self-isolate and book a PCR test to confirm the result. According to the BBC report, 82% of the LFT positive tests are confirmed by the more reliable PCR test but 18% are not. Since the BBC report in March, more questions have arisen about the accuracy of the LFT and more research is being undertaken.

I agree that the recent rise in cases is a worry. At this stage, they have not been reflected in hospitalisations or deaths but it is early days in the case uptick. I suspect we are about to see the real world test of the vaccine. Fingers-crossed!

Yes, I've read a few reports about LFT false positives, but I don't really understand why. It seems that many of them are down to people self-testing and not reading the result properly. The results from them do seem a bit random. I'm glad I've never relied on them.

It does seem a little unlikely that a qualified doctor would be unable to do two tests correctly! The tests are unreliable. That’s why I don’t use them.

I have my government box of them sitting by my phone. I used one last weekend before I met somebody and went out for lunch. As expected, it was negative. I couldn't possibly have been infected because I hadn't been anywhere I could have caught anything. The person I met has had regular tests because he has worked throughout the pandemic doing research into coronaviruses. I haven't a clue when I'll use the rest. I prefer to make sure I don't get infected, despite having had both vaccinations.

I've been doing some maths with the figures and it's quite interesting. LFTs are far more likely to produce false negative results than false positives, so give people a sense of false security. They are another tool along with vaccinations and all the usual precautions, such as self-distancing, masks and good ventilation, but no more. They're not a cast iron guarantee and I don't see a problem, so long as people understand that.

The figure of 1 in a 1,000 false positives is theoretical. Therefore - theoretically - if the incidence rate is 1 in a 1,000 (and it's still higher than that in some areas), the tests will pick up one true positive and one false negative. Obviously, that's inconvenient for the person who is false positive because he/she will have to self-isolate until a PCR test returns a negative result. Nevertheless, from a public health point of view, it's probably worth it because the true positive person could go on to seed many more infections.

The issues arise when the incidence rate is low. Many areas (including mine) currently have an incidence rate of less than 1 in 5,000. That means that if everybody is tested, there will be one true positive for every five false positives. In other words, the accuracy for positives is 20%. It means that five people have to self-isolate unnecessarily, not to mention the cost of providing LFTs. If the incidence rate were to rise again, LFTs would become more valid.

It does seem that LFTs are being used as a sort of "comfort blanket" for many people. They have their uses for identifying the majority of infected people when incidence rates are high, but I don't see they're serving a useful purpose. They're also encouraging people to use the "false positive" argument as an excuse for lifting all restrictions.

I haven't ever done a LFT. I don't see the necessity though if I was advised (told) to do it, I would. I've been supermarket shopping for almost a year which was before tests became generally available. I wear my mask and sanitise my hands, and haven't been out and about besides shopping. And I am doubly vaccinated.

I agree with you annodomini. I'm in the same situation, except I haven't even been out for supermarket shopping. However, I can see they serve some purpose from a public health perspective in places like schools. I just find it concerning that people seem to think they provide a guarantee of no infection.

I've never done a test and don't know where or how to get one.

I'm in an area which is registering under three infections (which could well be zero infections) and has done since the start of April. I've not had a cold or even a sniffle for well over a year, shop when its really quiet and my life style is such that although I get out and about a lot I don't go where there's crowds of people. So I haven't felt the need to do one.

We do the same and so far our visitors have also taken them prior to calling.

Can I please ask if anyone has had a problem reporting a lft negative test on line, as I put all info in but it would not let me submit it. Something about security