Chris Whitty - another lockdown

More and more people are predicting the very swift demise of Johnson- and many Conservatives are getting VERY jittery. Of course this will be dismissed by the few here who still support him (the article below is from the Guardian after all- yesterday's) - but the writing is on the wall.

The BIG question now, is what next, or who next?

''On Covid, meanwhile, a different group of renegade backbenchers, including Steve Baker and Mark Harper, have harried the government towards pressing ahead with the 19 July reopening.

Their scepticism effectively killed off the idea of mandatory Covid certificates for entering crowded venues, too, because the government believed it could not get the idea past the Commons without Labour support – though ministers are now urging businesses to implement the scheme anyway.

As the parliamentary term nears its end, Johnson and his chancellor are scrambling to put the finishing touches to a social care package they hope could address claims the government lacks a purpose. But some of their colleagues believe they could still be blown off course – yet again – by the pandemic.

MPs have sensed a narrowing in the polls and the ebbing away of the vaccine bounce. “Public memories are extremely short,” said a senior moderate MP. “I think if we have to reimpose masks then we can just about survive. But if we have to ever close businesses again then the plummet in support we saw last Christmas will be nothing. It’ll be like that on steroids. And colleagues would revolt. The PM is finished.''

wicklowwinnie

Oh, PippaZ, I haven't been reading anything.
I just feel rebellious.
I miss seeing cheerful, smiling faces.
We seem to have become such a miserable country.
Do you think we will ever go back to as we were?

To be honest, I don't see my local area like that at all. We seem, if anything, to have become more community-minded.

I am sometimes sad that people cannot see us smile, but there's another industry to help the economy - see-through masks.

I do hear the government telling people, from school children to older people, just how hard done by they have been. It must be quite depressing if you believe it. Mind you this government will also always point out that this is because someone else is an "other" in some way. They will tell you that it is their fault and that instead of making things better for their voter they are wonderful because they are making things worse for others. That seems to cheer some people up. However, it does sadden me but then they would be doing that covid or no covid.

I wonder just what/who you are seeing that is so miserable and how throwing of the mask you were occasionally will help?

Perhaps I did?
Would you mind if I just ignored you anyway?

MissAdventure

Sorry, I don't know what you're talking about.
Did I say something on this thread a while back?

Am I going mad ??‍♀️
I read a post from you where you said something like so, has it all been an estimate
I’ve looked everywhere but can’t find it not even on my history.
Help ?
If you didn’t post anything like that just ignore me ?

Kali2

It is time all the medical advisors resigned en masse and refused to back Johnson and Javid.

Not sure what that would achieve?

The problem that this Government and others are facing is that not all epidemiologists, scientist and members JCVI(or equivalent) are able to agree on the minutiae of handling a pandemic.

It is time all the medical advisors resigned en masse and refused to back Johnson and Javid.

Lewis Hamilton has just won his eight British Grand Prix, the 99th of his career in front of a crowd of 140,000 at Silverstone.

Restrictions cannot carry on now events like this are allowed.

Of course a lockdown will help Chris Whitty's career.

What a very odd thing to say! I would think that is the last thing on his mind at the moment and throughout all this.

Incidentally, what do you think would be a good career move, a promotion for Professor Whitty? I'd like to know, songstress.

Sorry, I don't know what you're talking about.
Did I say something on this thread a while back?

MissAdventure
In my limited knowledge, yes.
Why has the word could been inserted in every single written/verbal piece of information we’ve been subjected to for the past 16 months.

No more lockdowns. We have the vaccine so we will have to live with the virus. The most important thing now is the economy. Of course a lockdown will help Chris Whitty's career.

Or even "Full Fact"

PippaZ

^We test far more in the U.K. than anywhere else in the world and if you test more you will find more positive cases.^ [Rosiehaha Sun 18-Jul-21 14:02:43]

We have no real idea if this is the case. According to Full Fact:

Adjusting for population, the UK is behind Lithuania (if you look at the number of tests performed) and Denmark (when you look at the number of people tested). It’s also potentially behind Luxembourg and Belgium, though it’s unclear as to whether these countries publish data on the number of tests or the number of people tested. If it’s the number of tests, then they rank below the UK, but if it’s the number of people, they’re above the UK.

These rankings don’t mean that much for various reasons.

^For one we can’t be sure the UK data on testing is particularly comparable with other countries. For example, the UK data includes tests that have been sent out but not necessarily processed, which may not be the case in other countries.^

Interesting that they don't publish data on which tests were performed - PCR or LFT.

Does Full Fit have the data??

Sorry JenniferEccles - this comment you make is inaccurate.

"It’s been proved that the vaccines cut the link between infections and hospitalisation."

It has not broken the link, but it has been severely weakened - even Government Ministers on TV interviews have followed that script.

This is what Reuter's said on 27th June:
www.reuters.com/world/uk/uk-coronavirus-vaccines-have-weakened-link-between-infections-death-says-2021-06-27/

But, if you prefer the Johnson/Mail/Express/Sun style view here's a quote from the Mail Online on 1st July:
www.dailymail.co.uk/news/article-9745369/Boris-Johnson-Jabs-broken-link-infections-deaths.html

The NHS have the govt told that they can't cope with Covid and a winter flu. Is this not all to do with years of NHS cuts within the grass roots levels, i.e. nurses, junior doctors, specialists and the lack of ward facilities. Now it is coming back to bite them on the bum as they can't cope due to lack of facilities and staff but they still have loads of admin people and planning people and directors at the top on fat salaries. So now we go in and out of lockdown to keep admissions at a minimum.

Oh, PippaZ, I haven't been reading anything.
I just feel rebellious.
I miss seeing cheerful, smiling faces.
We seem to have become such a miserable country.
Do you think we will ever go back to as we were?

Thanks Callistemon, now I know what Taiwan did in response to Covid. I know that New Zealand haven’t been able to access enough Pfizer vaccines. They were aiming to have vaccinated their entire adult population by September, they are now saying it will take until the end of the year.

I don’t know what Taiwan did, except completely close their borders at first.

Taiwan dealt with it in a similar way to New Zealand, I believe.
However, having relaxed they now find cases are on the rise which is what I wonder may happen if Australia and New Zealand relax their rules in future.

Like those two countries, the vaccination rate has been low due to shortages of the Pfizer vaccine.

I’m beginning to think I live in a different country to the rest of you. I’ve only seen one blatant none mask wearer. He was in the lift in the hospital where I was visiting my elderly mother who had fallen and broken her shoulder. I challenged him by saying you’re supposed to wear it over your mouth and nose, not under your chin. He rudely responded that if I wanted to give out orders I should be wearing a uniform. I ignored that. He pulled the mask up, but took it down when he exited the lift. Everywhere else I see people compliant with mask wearing. We’ve just been out for lunch, we’re on holiday, but everyone used a mask upon entry to the restaurant. The same last night aswell.

So what were these ways? And why did they work so well?

A very valid question. With regard to China, as we all know, it is an authoritarian government. That means people were not allowed to leave their homes at all, except for one visit to the supermarket so many times a week. They had to download and fill in a slip and show it to the police when they did go to the supermarket. No other outings allowed. None! At all! For three months. No one was on the streets, and the city borders were closed. This is Wuhan. No one could leave the city, no one could enter, even if their home was there. So that’s how China were different. They also made all new arrivals to the country isolate for two weeks in a hotel, everyone wherever they came from. Any city where a Covid case arose went into a similar lockdown to Wuhan.
I don’t know what Taiwan did, except completely close their borders at first.

If only people themselves took responsibility for their actions so many refuse to wear a mask or even self isolate when have been told to do so .I myself felt safer in Lockdown and people and shop workers more friendly, No firm enforced mask wearing as too much abuse so much for it being legal. My local food store had a notice on the door No Mask No Entry and I heard people saying I just tell them I am exempt or my child does not like me wearing on

We test far more in the U.K. than anywhere else in the world and if you test more you will find more positive cases. [Rosiehaha Sun 18-Jul-21 14:02:43]

We have no real idea if this is the case. According to Full Fact:

Adjusting for population, the UK is behind Lithuania (if you look at the number of tests performed) and Denmark (when you look at the number of people tested). It’s also potentially behind Luxembourg and Belgium, though it’s unclear as to whether these countries publish data on the number of tests or the number of people tested. If it’s the number of tests, then they rank below the UK, but if it’s the number of people, they’re above the UK.

These rankings don’t mean that much for various reasons.

For one we can’t be sure the UK data on testing is particularly comparable with other countries. For example, the UK data includes tests that have been sent out but not necessarily processed, which may not be the case in other countries.

I can not believe people behaving as we have no problem re covid.. I went to my local town early this morning... Hopefully to avoid people, but I've never seen it as busy...most people not wearing masts.. Or if they did, it was under their chin?.. Its as if its all forgotten about.

Whitewavemark2

Callistemon

I do think we should be looking to China and learn from them as they seem to have handled the pandemic far better than we have. I think it’s Taiwan that started to get a huge increase in infections after doing so well initially but have now got it under control again. Surely we should learn from countries like that?

China and Taiwan have totally different styles of government.
The two countries had completely different ways of handling the pandemic.

Both have followed a very similar process in handling the pandemic and we have a lot to learn from them. It is political ideology that is stopping such a sensible strategy

Perhaps people don't realise just how much the world has sidelined Taiwan - the WHO should have listened to their recommendations in how to deal with pandemics but refused to do so, listening to China instead.

I expect we will go into another lockdown. It’s inevitable. Who’s to blame? Take your pick, but this is STILL a new thing, no one knows what to do, everything’s still an opinion. If you want certainty come back in 100 years.