Stats on the up

MaizieD

there is some criticism of Wales for going ahead with the ozone based air cleaner. It has to be used in an empty room because ozone is toxic. Which seems to me to be a bit pointless because ideally you want the air to be cleaned while the children are in the room breathing in and out covid aerosols.

Units with HEPA filters which can be used when the room is occupied seem more practical.

CO2 monitors are fine up to a point but what is the school supposed to do if it shows a too high concentration? Whip all the children out until it goes down?

Exactly! It's better to filter the air in the first place. CO2 monitors are only a proxy to show that air isn't being circulated adequately. They do nothing to remove particles and don't indicate whether infection is present.

I have two HEPA filter devices, which I bought for my mother, who had COPD. Two would be enough for a classroom. I seem to remember they cost under £100 each. The filters are quite expensive, but the cost would be a drop in the ocean in the context of the amount which has been spent on Test and Trace.

I don’t know Growstuff I can only mention what I have read I am not privy to government information I have no idea if this will happen
You obviously have much more inside information than me

rosie1959

I don’t know Growstuff I can only mention what I have read I am not privy to government information I have no idea if this will happen
You obviously have much more inside information than me

I know a number of headteachers, who have been told nothing about having C02 monitors supplied. Maybe they're just the only ones and every other school in the country is receiving them, but it doesn't seem likely. It seems like the "40 new hospitals" claim and much else the government spouts.

Headteachers in England have been instructed that pupils must attend school even if somebody in the household has tested positive. This is lunacy.

Germany are not testing after October. They say herd immunity isn’t going to happen and everyone is going to catch it at some point

MayBee70

Germany are not testing after October. They say herd immunity isn’t going to happen and everyone is going to catch it at some point

There’s more to that statement. Perhaps you missed that part.

www.dw.com/en/germany-to-end-free-covid-testing-in-october/a-58822085

I need to listen to the full blog. I’ve had a rubbish day (waiting in for someone to come and repair something who didn’t turn up) so I probably overreacted in a ‘we’re all doomed’ sort of way…..

MayBee70

Germany are not testing after October. They say herd immunity isn’t going to happen and everyone is going to catch it at some point

I'm not sure where you picked that up.

Currently, Germany offers everybody free tests, including those who want to go abroad. The idea with stopping free tests is to increase the uptake of vaccination. Some people use testing as an alternative to vaccination.

It was the start of DrJohns blog. But I was so fed up I listened to a few minutes of it and took the dog out for a walk. Going to listen to it properly now.

Callistemon

^£3.31m will be provided for new ozone disinfecting machines, to reduce cleaning times, improve disinfection and reduce costs. The funding is expected to supply more than 1,800 machines, at least one for every school, college and university in Wales.^

At least one for every school - some schools have dozens of rooms and well over 1,000 pupils.
Will they set them going every night, I wonder?

They are only going to be used after a Covid outbreak.

it's dr bharat pankhania at exeter university.

twitter.com/doctorshaib

MayBee70

Germany are not testing after October. They say herd immunity isn’t going to happen and everyone is going to catch it at some point

MayBee70 got it pretty spot on. Germany will stop free testing as a way of managing Covid because it's going to be endemic and everybody is probably going to catch it anyway, even the vaccinated, who are much less likely to become ill. So we have to live with it.

Who'd a thunk it? Maybe they read my post.

Germany are ending free tests to encourage a greater uptake of the vaccine. They are preparing for a fourth wave this autumn driven by the unvaccinated. They are not encouraging a let's go for it option.

Yep.

And no free tests if you are vaccinated, so people won't test as a preventative measure because it will cost them money, so there will be people in the community with undiagnosed Covid infections. So they are treating that as acceptable.

Living with it.

they have those fogger machines in the school i work at
they may be of some benefit but they didn't eliminate covid infections completely last term
interestingly it seemed it was in the early years classrooms that kids fell sick the most because they were the ones on the move and mingling all day
higher up the school where kids sat at their designated desks all day there were hardly any infections even though they had a smaller workspace

In Germany, negative results will be required for people who haven’t been vaccinated or can show they’ve recovered from the disease to eat in restaurants, go to the hairdresser and attend sporting events, etc. The government will no longer pay for antigen tests as of Oct. 11.

This isn't an acceptance by the German government that everybody will be infected, but a drive to get more people vaccinated. It's a form of bribery really.

LFTs aren't an effective way of controlling infection anyway.

Alegrias1

Yep.

And no free tests if you are vaccinated, so people won't test as a preventative measure because it will cost them money, so there will be people in the community with undiagnosed Covid infections. So they are treating that as acceptable.

Living with it.

No, they're not treating it as acceptable because those people will have to put up with a number of restrictions.

Dr John did say that there were scientists in this country that were of the same mindset but that he was interested to hear what SAGE were going to say.

No, they're not treating it as acceptable because those people will have to put up with a number of restrictions.

What, the vaccinated? Don't think so.

Alegrias1

^No, they're not treating it as acceptable because those people will have to put up with a number of restrictions.^

What, the vaccinated? Don't think so.

Did I say the vaccinated would have to put up with restrictions? No, I didn't, although they will have to put up with having the restriction on their "freedom" by being vaccinated in the first place.

Those who are unvaccinated will have to put up with a number of restrictions, which will exclude them from all indoor public places, including hairdressers, unless they pay for a test.

That is not a free-for-all and it's not accepting that everybody will be infected, which is what Dr John Campbell was talking about.

I'd also add that all 12 year olds and over have been offered vaccinations in Germany.

Calm down, dear.

MayBee70

Dr John did say that there were scientists in this country that were of the same mindset but that he was interested to hear what SAGE were going to say.

There always have been scientists in the UK who have advocated the Great Barrington Declaration approach. Essentially, it accepts the survival of the fittest.

The Great Barrington Declaration?
Calm down dear

Acceptance that Covid will be endemic? Mainstream scientific thinking.

Refusing to accept that? A bit confused. Keep up dear.

If you are vaccinated you can still catch and pass on Covid. The German authorities are accepting that some people who have been vaccinated will not get tested and so will be in the community. Passing it onto all sorts of people. They won't have to put up with the inconvenience of testing or restrictions that the unvaccinated will.

growstuff

MayBee70

Dr John did say that there were scientists in this country that were of the same mindset but that he was interested to hear what SAGE were going to say.

There always have been scientists in the UK who have advocated the Great Barrington Declaration approach. Essentially, it accepts the survival of the fittest.

I don’t think it was those looney ones that DrJohn was referring to. Which is why it took him a couple of days to do the blog ( which often happens if he doesn’t like what he feels he has to say). My first thought was, so where does that leave people with compromised immune systems: people undergoing chemo therapy etc. I’m struggling with processing it all, which is why I had to stop listening and took the dog for a walk. I just wonder where we would be now without the vaccines. If only we’d had a vaccine ready when the pandemic first started. And, imo it’s even more important to find out the origins of this virus.