“By the end of winter, pretty much everyone in Germany will probably be vaccinated, recovered or dead,”

Alegrias1

But the original post was about denying medical treatment to people who don't take the vaccine.

We don't even deny medical treatment to murderers, rapists, terrorists. No civilised country does. But someone can suggest denying it to anti- vaxxers. Although I'm sure some people would like us to deny medical treatment to murderers and we could probably have a very lively thread on that topic.

But don’t they deny transplants to people that don’t stop drinking (I’m thinking back to George Best here) and to have things like gastric bands don’t you have to lose lots of weight first to prove that you’re committed (and also to make the operation safer I suppose). So it isn’t the case that all medical procedures don’t come without some conditions attached.

Alegrias1

But the original post was about denying medical treatment to people who don't take the vaccine.

We don't even deny medical treatment to murderers, rapists, terrorists. No civilised country does. But someone can suggest denying it to anti- vaxxers. Although I'm sure some people would like us to deny medical treatment to murderers and we could probably have a very lively thread on that topic.

No, the OP was about the cases in Germany.,

Alegrias1

The slippery slope is about submitting to medical interventions you don't want.

Today, you have to have an injection because it's for everyone's good.

Tomorrow, you have to get sterilised because there are too many people in the world.

I know that's extreme. I'm being provocative.

Wrong word-youre being daft

MayBeMaw

Alegrias1

But the original post was about denying medical treatment to people who don't take the vaccine.

We don't even deny medical treatment to murderers, rapists, terrorists. No civilised country does. But someone can suggest denying it to anti- vaxxers. Although I'm sure some people would like us to deny medical treatment to murderers and we could probably have a very lively thread on that topic.

No, the OP was about the cases in Germany.,

The original post I was replying to was posted at 11:25 on Tuesday. Apologies for causing confusion.

Some never get it despite mauling all over each other and no fax. Some get it after tenuous contact and no fax........then they die. A risk not worth taking......"do you feel lucky, punk?" Is a phrase I keep thinking of!

#VAX!

I am treble jabbed, but I will NOT go for testing as that is an invasion of civil liberties. This past 2 years have seen a gradual erosion of our freedom and I am sick of it. It is becoming a police state, and a real snitch on your neighbour country.

Nagmad2016

I can't help being a bit cynical about anti-vaxxers. If there is a medical reason why they shouldn't have the vaccine, all well and good. If it is just a case of digging their heels in for political reasons, then I think it is selfish. My SIL and her family are anti vaxxers, she says we are like sheep and we are being poisoned by the vaccine. Bit of a double standard when she has regular Botox injected into her face!!

That is classic, Nagmad2016, and reminds me of a little video I’ve seen recently - some American Instagram ‘influencer’ with grotesquely swollen lips, saying she won’t have the vaccine - ‘My bahdy, my choice’ - she doesn’t want anything that hasn’t been tested enough going into her bahdy….
She comes across as stupendously thick!
Wish I could post it here - it’s very funny (in a despairing, black comedy sort of way)

songstress60

I am treble jabbed, but I will NOT go for testing as that is an invasion of civil liberties. This past 2 years have seen a gradual erosion of our freedom and I am sick of it. It is becoming a police state, and a real snitch on your neighbour country.

What! Ridiculous!

I agree with Algerias and Urmston. Advice goes up and down according to the message of the moment, esp re chances of vaccinated people transmitting the infection.
I haven’t seen comparative stats of hospitalisation and deaths among previously healthy people vaxxed and unvaxxed and those with underwear relying health conditions ditto - i.e certainty that it is vaccination that is the key factor rather than age or existing illness.
But I deplore vaccination being used as a political weapon and the shrieking of the anti-vaxx campaigners.

What a strange view you have of society Gabriella.

songstress60

I am treble jabbed, but I will NOT go for testing as that is an invasion of civil liberties. This past 2 years have seen a gradual erosion of our freedom and I am sick of it. It is becoming a police state, and a real snitch on your neighbour country.

Maybe I've misunderstood you.

If there's a reason for thinking you might be infected, are you seriously saying that you wouldn't get yourself tested? As you are concerned about your own freedom, would you carry on mingling with other people and infecting them?

How exactly does being tested erode your freedom?

Do you feel the same about all medical tests?

Just heard BIL has tested positive today....??

Being vaccinated doesn't mean you won't die from Covid (just heard about a healthy, double vaccinated 50 year old who has died from Covid.)
Recovered - can we catch it again? Does he know?
Dead - from Covid or other reasons?
Being unvaccinated - some people are symptomless or have mild symptoms, even those with underlying health conditions like my relative.

Jens Spahn, the German health minister may say that but we still don't know enough about this virus to be certain about anything.

In the U.S. the virus has spread to the wild deer population. Deer inhabit most of the U.S. and are common sights even in suburbs and the smaller cities, with occasional incursions even into places like Chicago and NYC. With this reservoir and opportunity for mutations, we will never be rid of the virus. They are hunted and eaten here.
I am quite amused by people who think a government GPS will be installed with the vaccine, particularly when they are holding their mobile while telling you!

What I could not understand today was a news item about a young mum of 3 children who has just died of covid. She was not vaccinated. Her father was saying if vaccinations had been compulsary, with perhaps a fine of £ 1000 pounds, to those who refused he believes that his daughter would have had her jabs! He stated she always put her children first and because of this she did not have time to get vaccinated. She was not an Anti vaxer she just did not have time even though her uncle died of covid last year. If that was not a wake up call I don't know what is. I feel sorry for those children growing up without Mum but I despair at some people's thinking.

How can anybody say they “don’t have time” ?
How long does it take, for heavens sake.

I know an anti-vaxxer (rather dim) who 'won't be Guinea pig for something that's not tested - and could have serious side effects in five year's time'. (I just said that I'd prefer to be alive in five years!)

She also won't be tested, as 'I won't give them my DNA' (who would want it? - words failed me.)

Grayson Perry has Covid. We had tickets for his show?
But I hope he is not too ill with it.

maddyone

songstress60

I am treble jabbed, but I will NOT go for testing as that is an invasion of civil liberties. This past 2 years have seen a gradual erosion of our freedom and I am sick of it. It is becoming a police state, and a real snitch on your neighbour country.

What! Ridiculous!

I’ve seen some posts on GN that make little sense, but that takes the biscuit.

Songstress post ….obviously

Hetty58

I know an anti-vaxxer (rather dim) who 'won't be Guinea pig for something that's not tested - and could have serious side effects in five year's time'. (I just said that I'd prefer to be alive in five years!)

She also won't be tested, as 'I won't give them my DNA' (who would want it? - words failed me.)

We’ve had people on GN saying exactly that Hetty - something that’s not tested etc
? “They all laughed at Christopher Columbus, when he said the world was round
They all laughed when Edison recorded sound “ ?
Complete a well known song!

Thanks for clarification Lucca. I wondered for a moment until your next post. I agree with you, that post takes the biscuit. If songstress had any experience of a real police state, she’d know the difference.

I think there are some very confused people out there. Someone replied to something I said on Facebook ( she said that mask wearing was dehumanising) and, being nosy I looked at her Facebook page. She was anti vax and anti mask pro gun and a huge Trump supporter. But pro life