Another chance to fail.......

Wow what a fantastic article - passionate and heartbreaking in equal measure. I agreed with every word she said.

I remember college insisting that my DD went on taking her maths GCSE with the aim of turning her D into a C - I lost count of the number of times she got a D. In the end I went to them and said "She is D standard in maths - she is happy with that - I am happy with that - leave her alone please!" She went on to get a degree and an MA.

Thanks so much for that Pamish it is wonderful. I remember "Every Child Matters", now it seems the purpose of education is to humiliate children as much as possible, what could be worse than failing a test once, why failing it twice of course.

Yes indeed! - well said that lady!! If only the outcomes of these ridiculous policies were not so serious - how very sad it all is.

This wonderful post by a parent of three adopted girls explains exactly why the re-take forever idea is deluded. https://disidealist.wordpress.com/2015/04/08/mediocre-failures/

We need to abolish league tables- they cause the problems.

SATS were originally a way of assessing schools and whether they were making progress. Inevitably schools started pushing individual children to get their levels.
They were never meant to be used as a pass/fail test that children had to aim for. Many children with special needs would be stigmatised if they were.
The Tories seem to be totally confused about maths, use of data etc Gove wanting all schools to be average. Morgan refusing to answer easy maths questions asked by a child and Cameron now getting completely confused about something that was only ever meant to provide management statistics for heads, governors and LAs. I feel like that little girl who apparently banged her head on the desk in despair.

I don't think the government understand the word average!
Ofsted turned 'satisfactory' into a dirty word and then dropped it.

Idealising teachers is as dangerous and demonising them. There are brilliant and exceptional teachers, there are poor teachers and in the middle the bulk are good and adequate teachers. It is ridiculous in any profession to expect most to be outstanding. It is the law of averages.

Most teachers do a brilliant job, a few do not and some are just worn out!

Most parents really support their children's learning & progress , a few parents don't care much about school and some are too distracted by other things to prioritise their kids' progress at school.

Some parents are wealthy enough to give children opportunities that broaden experience, a few do what they can on limited resources, and some, rich and poor, don't invest enough time in their children.

Many kids have a carefree childhood, a few kids are abused , some kids are ill/carers/ disabled.

Many kids live in a stable and secure family, some have a disorganised and muddled family and a few have their lives disrupted by bereavement, war, poor housing & hunger.

My point is it is NOT all about the teachers!! It is a wider society issue if we want all children to be literate and numerate to a life functional level.

I have always found that the best way to judge a school is by what parents say about it, albeit, not always realising it.

When DC started school we lived in the catchment area of what was considered the best primary school in the area. Several people told me how wonderful it was, how well their children were doing there and then would tell me a story of something that indicated that the school was very strict and rigid and made no allowances for any problems a child might have. There were places available at another school in the area, that was more child-orientated. My DC went there, were very happy there and did very well.

Add to that the fact that it is such a tiny school that one year group might only contain 3 children, then the data (groan!) become meaningless.

Oh - hear hear flickety - what a nonsense it is. We have found that parents ignore the OfSted reports now as they have cottoned on to what a farce they are. Again we had a lower assessment because of an accumulation of children with problems in one year and we got the parents together to explain the content of the OfSted and they said they could not care less, their children were happy and learning, and they paid the assessment no heed.

I think the Ofsted tests and the significance put on them is ridiculous. DGC are fortunate to go to one of the most highly rated schools in their town, then, it was suddenly declared to be a failing school because of a problem identified in one year group.

That was sorted and it went back to being outstanding again. Any system where a school can go from outstanding to failing and to outstanding again in a year is by definition not suitable for purpose.

There is no problem testing what children can do - and this is ongoing in schools in all sorts of ways, both formal and informal. That is how teachers know the best way to help each child.

The problem is that schools are judged now on their data - reams of it each week to be churned out (I am a school governor - trust me, I know!) - and this leads them into working to the tests. Before SATs time, children are just grinding their way through test after test and I have yet to meet a teacher who thinks this enhances their education or love of learning - but if your school might get a crap OfSted on the basis of these tests, schools feel they have no alternative but to concentrate on these rather than on education.

No matter when you went to school or what the overall school curriculum was then or now. In all decades the school leaver who cannot read, write (spelling), or is not numerate or unable communicate verbally is going to find it very difficult to get or hold down any form of employment.

I do not have a Gradgrind type attitude to education, nor do i advocate the rigid rote learning uncreative education systems of some Asian countries, but all the world's greatest pianists spend a lot of time practising scales and learning theory to get the technical expertise that produces great music.

It is no point giving children an education that makes school a pleasurable experience, that enhances their creative abilities or widens their understanding of the world if they leave school without the basic underpinning of a good grasp of the three 'r's and communication.

Like pompa I too used to have to screen school leavers who applied for jobs. The number that couldn't spell, add up or string together a coherent sentence was staggering (this was for clerical work). Whilst I accept that some children do have difficulties this cannot be the majority.

At the risk of being shot down in flames may I suggest that some teachers are just not up to the job!

(puts on tin hat and ducks behind a wall)

I used to teach Essential Skills to adults. Too many of them were struggling with literacy and numeracy not to mention IT skills. Some were mildly dyslexic, others had fallen behind because of illness and all of them suffered from low self esteem.

Sadly the funding was cut for this provision in my area and I was made redundant after many years of teaching.

Hopefully testing will pick up these problems early on but I wait to see if this proves to be the case. Testing is not a bad thing per se - BUT more paperwork for the poor teachers - not a good thing.

At the end of my career I had 8 pieces of paper attached to each learner. I spent far too much time filling them in and not teaching.

I think the problem is that it is the educational system that needs testing. But how do you do that without testing the product of that system ?

Absent, Your priorities are quite correct comes first, sobriety second Cheers!

Every time I think that the government can't get any worse with their ideas they come up with another damaging one like this one. Constantly testing children is damaging and does nothing to help them educationally.

I thought I had just written an intelligent comment in answer to your post pompa. I may have failed to press post or, worryingly, put it on another thread that has nothing to do with the subject. Oh, dear, a pre-dinner glass of wine and looking at Gransnet is clearly not a good combination.

These were youngsters (16 +) that were considering going into caring. In fact what you say is relevant, Their maths knowledge was that I would expect of an 11 year old. I suspect that students are given so many options that the concentration on the basics is diluted. I would point out that I don't think this is the mean ability level, we are producing many excellent minds, but seem to be failing some. Arithmetic and English are the most important subjects for life today. From a good understanding of these further learning can develop.

pompa I don't know what type of employment you are talking about but the 11 year olds who gain a L4b (current expected level) in English and Maths are way more able than I was expected to be in 1962 when I was 11!

I think that sometimes we look back through rose tinted glasses. In those 'rosy' days there was plenty of employment for the less academic young person in domestic service, factory work, apprenticeships etc. Higher education has been more accessible to the bright kids who previously would have become clerks, service industry employees or have blue collar jobs from the age of 15/16 because they could not afford to go on to higher education though they had the ability.

There have always been illiterate/innumerate school leavers and even more who, in the past, were institutionalised without the chance to learn. Let's stop dissing the much improved education available to kids nowadays and accept that the world has moved on..what was a good education in 1950 is not always appropriate for the 21st century. I am not saying it is all perfect but it is certainly not all bad.

tiggypiro