Denied toilet break

Jalima

No, no afternoon break lunch ends at 1.10 and they finish at 3.30, which is why i think it is unreasonable to have stopped her going for a wee.

trisher. I absolutely accept your points, and realise how difficult it must be to teach a full class of very young scholars. Does this not prove the point that teachers are overworked, underpaid, understaffed and undervalued?
I feel this is perhaps a political point and best left for another discussion, but looking back on my own experiences and those of my children, I think that a very few teachers have it in them to be sadistic. Many moons ago, I suffered at the hands of a woman who I am sure only took up the profession because she had no children of her own to beat and bully.
Fortunately, she was the one horrible exception in a school full of dedicated and kindly teachers!

I think it's quite shocking actually Lexisgran and I would be complaining to the Head in no uncertain terms.

rosesarered

Seeing the head on Monday, the 2nd time she was refused she even explained holding her wee was giving her stomach ache

Good, hope for the right outcome, this school/teacher need to change things.

Actually for Key stage 1 I think that is an unacceptably long afternoon and I would have expected a break (see I'm not the dreadful bitch teacher after all). It is normal for Key stage 1 to finish at 3.15 and even then have had a short break between lunch and the end of the day. It may be that the end of the day is timed so all the children leave together but that should mean the younger ones get break time. I wonder what the water situation is? most schools now recognise the importance of hydration and encourage drinking water through the day. You might want to emphasise the importance of this as well.
I was trying to balance the number of condemnatory posts about this and try to show that it isn't always vindictive discipline that causes these things simply overwork and omission.

I would say can you wait ten minutes if they then ask again let them go this usually sorts out the ones who just want to waste a bit of time as they forget to ask again as are then occupied with something else

The same thing happened to my five year old granddaughter. They had a student helping out in her class. My GD asked to go to the toilet and was told to go and sit down. When my daughter found out she was really cross as my GD is not very good at holding on, and still has accidents. My granddaughter's teacher was not happy that this happened and had a word with the student. This student was also heard to say "young kids do my head in". I think she's chosen the wrong profession.

I tend to agree with Trisher and lexigran. Having been a teacher (albeit secondary) and knowing how children can try it on to get out of class, I would often ask them to wait and try to guage how desperate they were. If desperate they would usually ask again. If you are not careful there is constant going and froing just when you are trying to explain something. I admit it's rather different with younger children.
My point is that you dont know what th situation was in th classroom, only a one sided story. Its certainly worth speaking to the teacher about but I would do it tactfully. You've no idea what pressure the teacher was under, and s/he probably has no idea that there was a problem. I'm sure it wont happen again once you've spoken.

I had this with DD who actually wet herself in class. I was furious and had a cross word with the teacher, who told me that she'd been in the children's loos and heard DD tell a friend "let's not go now, let's wait and go later, in class".

I replied that there were better ways to make a point than forcing a child to wet herself. I went on to say that I had given my child a change of clothes in case of future accidents and advised her to not say anything to her teacher, but just hide her wet things somewhat secret in the classroom, for her teacher to discover and deal with during the holidays.

Needless to say, there weren't any more accidents.

I would definitely have a word. You cannot put a time on the call of nature.

I find this personally upsetting. I went to catholic school in the 1950s and believe me, you were 'taken' out to queue up to go ONCE in the morning and ONCE after coming in from lunch recess. There were too few toilets for the size of the classes.

I grew up being a bloody camel. I could go all day and not need a wee and thought it was how you were supposed to be. Even when I had toilets available to me all the time I still could only go a couple of times a day.

By age 20 I ended up in hospital with a catheter and a massive infection with a high fever. My urethra had to be expanded a couple of more times after that so I could properly urinate when my bladder was full. Freaking nuns!

Also, there are instances where children's bladders do NOT grow as quickly as the rest of their waterworks. My nephew was having to stop behind almost every tree until he was about 9 or 10 as his bladder was too small. He did grow out of it.

I don't think a child of 6 should be stopped from going to the toilet - especially not for that length of time. I agree with the poster who said that being unable to access a loo or, in this case, being denied access to a loo would cause anxiety to anyone and more so to a child. What originally might have been a bit of "playing up" could turn into a real problem.

I would have a polite word with the teacher to find out exactly what happened. If you establish that you have been given an accurate account, I think I would say that I was not happy for the child to be denied a toilet break.

This is the same situation as happened to my six year old granddaughter. She kept wetting herself and had to sit in it all day. Very upsetting for child and mum. My daughter spoke to the teacher. The problem is now resolved. But it was horrid for my granddaughter.

Just a quick update my daughter had her meeting with the head teacher this morning. The rules are no loo in lessons unless they have a note, think this is madness but dd is going to write a quick note for dgt, but remind her to go and try at break and lunch.

cannot help feeling sorry for the poor children sitting holding it who do not have a note

Do the school Governers know about this rule?

Parent governors should know about this ruling as it's a parental issue.

lexisgran I am shocked! I didn't think that there were schools with such Victorian principles still in existence. Even when I trained (50 years ago now) we were told by our Health Ed tutor that children should be able to go to the loo if they really had to. As I said it is a long afternoon for Key Stage 1. Your DD should write a letter of course but can I suggest she also raises the matter with the governors and the PTAF if there is one.
I would suggest she adopts the policy of- children need hydration for their brains to work properly, stopping them going to the toilet increases the chances of them restricting their fluid intake and there will be negative effects on their learning. The school should either change their policy or introduce a short break in the afternoon for the younger children.
Even my 4 year old GD knows about drinking water, her nursery warn children if they don't drink they will develop 'raisin brain"!
Good Luck
If she wants to be subversive your DD could encourage all the class parents to write letters!!!

I was a teacher and am shocked at this ruling. At the beginning of each academic year, parents in my school had to fill in an admin form, stating any medical conditions of pupils, so we were usually aware of children with medical conditions, who needed to frequent visits to the loo. This info would be updated throughout the year. Supply teachers were advised of this info, which was kept on a database, easily accessed by ALL staff, including pupil support assistants. Any named child was advised to catch the teacher's eye and just slip out without disturbing the lesson. Also, I knew those pupils, who would ask to go out, just to get out of the lesson. If a child who never asked to go out, asked, I knew that there was a problem and would send them immediately. It's all about common sense.

I don't think this ruling is acceptable for adults (I know there have been reports of call centre staff being reprimanded for going to the toilet but I think that's reprehensible) and I think it is completely unacceptable for children. It could set up all sorts of phobias and anxieties. I would have thought school and life in general is stressful enough for children these days without adding to it.

Is this is a practice that is thought to be acceptable by the educational establishment and are there any rulings/guidelines relating to it?

"No loo in lessons unless they have a note" - how ridiculous.

the ht did say some children had been going off to the toilets during class too much, which is why they have introduced the rule. She also said if a child had medical reasons they would be allowed to go. DD intends on fnding out whether the goveners are aware.

Will update, surely not every teacher is going to stick to the rule and will show discretion if the child is bursting, at least dgt will now be allowed with a note anyway

The HT needs to sort out the children who are going off not punish the others because of the few. There are so many ways of managing this-coloured bands one for girls one for boys, no one goes unless they have a band. A clock on the door child sets it when they leave so teacher can see how long they have been. Loads of other things. It's lazy just to have an all compassing ban.

She is not planning on accepting this and i am sure when a few more parents complain, which i am sure they will if their child is refused the toilet, it wil be dropped

id be tempted to tell my children to wee on the teachers desk if told no

It must be difficult to try to control a class of infants let alone not knowing where some of them are some of the time because they have nipped off to the loo; some may need it and some may just fancy a little wander around the school.

Oh that's true Jalima1108 but any decent teacher identifies these children in the first few days and restricts their movements more than others. It's also useful to have a HT or other member of staff who does the occasional wander around the school and pounces on the miscreants who think a toilet is a playground (makes them think twice about it!)