Reassuring news: Schools opened again in Denmark with success.

Well there’s no point in arguing the point as we come from two totally different philosophies, and backgrounds too I imagine.

I started this thread as an opportunity to look at how this Danish school has restructured a classroom for their older primary age pupils. I didn't say it would apply to a whole school and neither did I say it would as easy to apply for every year group.

I don't know how many have taken a look at the clip but from reading some comment, I don't think some have.

I stress and repeat myself again, for the few here, in saying I would hope that UK schools are given enough support by UK Gov to make it as safe as possible for children and staff to return to schools. This means time and money. The 3 weeks they have is not enough time.

I agree that three weeks is not enough. However re clips...I’m sure we have both seen specimen lessons that bear no resemblance to actual practice. I think you know what I mean.

Furrett

You make a lot of wrong assumptions about me.

Please watch the report as it would give you the answers you seek

WOODMOUSE. Your ‘clip’ is 16 minutes long and I would have to wade through several other Covid-related news items to get to it. However, and I’m trying not to sound arrogant here honestly, I am very familiar with the Danish education system which I consider, is excellent, and only second to the Finns.

I doubt very much whatever good practice is shown would translate into many of our schools and our pupils. I don’t want to carry on this discussion because I’m now very weary of the whole business so please forgive me if I sign off.

My ‘assumptions‘ we’re merely one professional to another so I’m sorry you took that amiss,

Good night,,

Furrett. I'm quite aware of "specimen" lessons and would never use them myself as an example for other teachers/schools. I was an advisor (advanced skills teacher) for a few years and would lead by example: teaching a class to aid the support I gave teachers.

But the clip isn't such (ie a specimen lesson). Take a look !

Oh dear! Furrett. The clip from the school is only about 3 mins long. Hopefully you get the opportunity to watch it tomorrow.

My thread did narrow it down and I said watch it from 22.45 as that included the part from parliament but to help start it from 27.00.

I see it translating to our year 6 classes. Nearly my whole career has been with Year 5/6, from small village schools to a large city schools, one with an ERF for deaf children.

I've just watched the video and I'll repeat …

Those children were at least seven. It would be difficult to get 4 and 5 year olds to behave like that.

Another difference was the desks. Each child had a single desk. I have never seen reception and Year 1 pupils sitting at desks in rows like that. They are also used to sharing equipment.

I agree absolutely with furret. This is about relieving parents of childcare responsibilities, not education.

There is conflicting evidence about whether children can be carriers. It has not been proved that they aren't.

I’d be perfectly happy to copy the Danish education and childcare system. But we’d need the Danish level of taxation and teachers’ pay too.

This - no risk assessment yet been carried out. Why doesn’t that surprise me?

DfE chief scientific adviser admits he hasn’t assessed the school reopening guidance... [and that] DfE had done no modelling on the impact of reopening on transmission rates ...the decision to reopen was made by cabinet, not the DfE'
(Schoolsweek 13/5/20).

I've just watched the clip - very impressive but as others have said not so easy to replicate here.

The school is obviously very well resourced and it must be said the children look to be from comfortable backgrounds.

We can't pick from other countries systems and expect the same results but, that said, the schools must open eventually to all children and we have to start somewhere.

Does anybody know the numbers of key workers' children who been attending throughout and if there have been any cases of the virus spreading from children to staff? Remembering that these children are those of NHS, shop, transport workers, etc and should be the highest risk.

As an aside, the Danish children were fluent in English!

Denmark is another country.

I was thinking as well that possibly Danish children will receive counselling and help should they be stuggling and upset about the isolation. There's no such help in the UK.

What I’ve noticed in general ( all forms of media) over the past day or two is the almost perfect correlation between those who say we can’t possibly make international comparisons of deaths per 1m because countries are so different and those who squeak look at Denmark to argue that we should send our little ones back to school. Still being logical is never a strong point of the right, is it?

Riverwalk I understand from various sources (local and media) that the number of eligible key workers' and vulnerable children was very low. I'm not sure of the percentage, but it was somewhere in the region of 5-10% of those eligible nationally, although there are regional differences. In some cases, schools only have one or two pupils.

PS. Danish children are taught English from a very young age.

My feeling is that schools do have to re-open at some stage. Teachers have tried hard with online learning, but it can't replace the classroom. Some children don't have computer facilities at home or parents who are willing/able to organise them. There is no doubt that the most vulnerable children are losing out even more than they usually do.

However …

The UK still hasn't got a grip on new infections. Lockdown has been half-hearted and should continue and be even stricter and better enforced. It takes about two or three weeks for the results of lockdown to show up in the number of serious cases and deaths. Stricter lockdown would bring the number of infections right down, whereas loosening it now will result in the numbers spiralling out of control again and no chance of containment. There will be no alternative other than so-called herd immunity

Meanwhile, the government needs to get PPI made. For school staff, that wouldn't involve full gowns, but we need masks and hundreds of thousands of hand sanitiser dispensers.

Efficient test, track and isolate systems need to be in place, so that localised outbreaks could be stamped on. That involves having real boots on the ground, not just relying on an app. Recruitment for the "real boots" hasn't even started.

Nobody knows for sure how much children transmit infection, but it would be wise to err on the side of caution. The government didn't work with the teaching unions on this, but railroaded them and attempts to demonise them have appeared in the media (wonder who briefed them … ahem).

Rather than thinking from a business perspective (ie which children need most childcare to enable parents back to work), this should have been approached from a pragmatic and educational angle. It would, for example, be easier to manage if slightly older children (Year 2?) went back first plus Year 10 and Year 12, who will be sitting exams next year.

The first priority in schools must be an independent risk assessment of each school and the provision of resources. In China, for example, each school has a nurse, who is able to assess any child with a cough or sneezing.

I saw a factory on the news this morning taking temperatures as workers arrived. It would be good to see something similar in schools.

grow I don’t think anyone thinks schools shouldn’t reopen - it’s all about when and how isn’t it. I’ve just been talking to a friend in Sydney - the children are back one day a week in small classes. There were nine new cases in Oz yesterday. I appreciate this doesn’t make me an expert on the Australian schools system but she said schools are organising it differently in that some are basing it on sibling groups ( sounds sensible) others on year groups. The children are doing online learning whilst in the classroom and the whole raison d’être is to help the children have some peer group contact. If all goes well, then they’ll go back two days a week and so on. Of course, they’re at a different stage in the school year with the summer hols months away. Anyone can now go for a test ( this is NSW) and results available within 6-24 hours.

I'm not sure of the percentage, but it was somewhere in the region of 5-10% of those eligible nationally, although there are regional differences. In some cases, schools only have one or two pupils.

Thank you Growstuff. That's a very low take-up for those eligible.

Many key workers do shift work so maybe parents are juggling childcare between them. A friend's daughter and SIL are both NHS frontline doctors and their three children have been attending throughout, including during the Easter holidays.

I wonder how the vulnerable children and those from difficult backgrounds are faring - I've read that their take-up was very low

I must admit that if I were a key worker, I would move heaven and earth to find alternative arrangements, rather than sending my children to school.

The bigger concern is the low take up from children from deprived families.

Many secondary teachers have been told to prepare for a limited Year 10 return from 1 June. I don't know why that doesn't seem to have been reported in the media.

grow I’ve missed that about Year 10. Good heavens, surely not a problem with the Governments communication strategy ?

I guess it doesn't fit the "teachers are a load of lazy idlers" agenda.

I have GC in years 10 and 12, with GCSE and A-level respectively next year. It's those two year groups which should be a priority for schools reopening. I know that even my 14-year-old GS is anxious to get back to study.

anno the priority should be when is it safe. I believe there is some evidence about older children being more likely to transmit if infected. I’ll see if I can find the link. I do appreciated that all the evidence in the whole area of children and transmission is not clear cut. What is clear cut is our still high number of new cases daily and out totally inadequate testing infrastructure