Friendship,advice and support if estrangement has affected your life.

Oh you didn't DSL no need to apologise. You know what it's like, you start thinking and end up going in a direction you'd rather not go.

I think it's wonderful that you'll have this opportunity to spend time with your GC after all that you've been through and I look forward to hearing about the things you get up too with them.

I remember the buying/selling stress and it's not for the feint hearted but always seems to be a part of the process hugs. I know you weren't ignoring me I mean if nothing else, I'm not easy too ignore. Just ask Mr. S..

We too provided the deposit for my daughter in law and the now ES to buy their house. I believed l had a good relationship with DIL at the time , but l did notice that she didn't say thanks or anything at all about it at the time.
During the estrangement, all done by email years later, l was told that I'd only given the money to my son not her as well. Which l hadn't as l expected the house would be jointly owned.
I also expected she would be living in it too! Perhaps my mistake was that l made the cheque out in my son's name.
Oh well, water under the bridge now. I'm past caring about her logic.

our ES's wife didn't thank us either Hilltop.

Although I have the pain of my son estranging from me I am so lucky that my daughter's partner - now fiance - has been lovely to get to know. We immediately hit it off with silly friendly nicknames for each other. He treats my DD well - which is all I could hope for - and is often the first to say thanks for any favours or gifts to them both. He's also an absolute ray of sunshine. He is such a welcome addition to our family and he's long called me the MIL affectionately, apart from the nickname, although there's some time until they tie the know officially. He bakes me goodies and is always happy to receive mine and especially shows off his birthday cake to all and sundry - I am defacto family cake maker it seems. And nobody minds when they come out wonky.

You know reminding myself how lucky I am in this respect is so uplifting. I do try not to dwell on all the hurts life sends but they do of course hit hard sometimes. But a little heartfelt gratitude for life's blessings is a good remedy when we can embrace it.

MiaZadora81

Okay seriously though, I do need support about my other thread because I want to compromise.

I'm the OP of the thread and I asked for "the estranger" perspective. I'm aware that everyone can post on any thread, however, people who don't identify as "estrangers" came to the thread and gave their opinions about why the "estrangers" are wrong which led to arguing, etc.

It's frustrating and tiresome for everyone, so can we please have a truce or something?

I'm not saying this would be forever, but maybe we try it for a week and see how it goes?

My thread is about how people who identify as "estrangers" feel and I want it to be a safe space for people to share how they feel.

So, for the next week, how about the people who don't identify as "estrangers" observe the thread but refrain from commenting

Again, I can't dictate who goes where, I'm just trying to give everyone some space to feel safe.

As I understand it, this specific thread is for everyone who is dealing with estrangement. However, I'm happy to stop commenting here and will do so if I can just find a resolution to my problem.

If people want to make a new thread for "the non-estrangers" maybe that would help? I honestly don't know, it's just a suggestion on because the goal is not to exclude anyone.

I can't speak for anyone other than myself, but I have no problem refraining from commenting in such a space, whatever it's called

Again, I'm not suggesting people stop commenting forever on the other thread, I'm just suggesting a trial period so that my thread can have a chance.

Thanks to everyone for helping me figure this problem out.

It seems that people ignored my post about compromising and giving the estrangers space.

This is the only post that I actually asked for help with and people ignored that

This exact dynamic is why estrangement happens.

One person says "apples are fruit" and the other person says "not all fruit are apples, I hate apples but I love oranges. Watermelon is okay but only if it's perfectly ripe"!

Mia says "boomers control 80% of the wealth", and people say "not all boomers are wealthy!... But the young people just want everything right now and don't know the value of hard work. What's wrong with these young people not understanding anything?? I wore rope for clothes and they want Gucci!"

People seem to want to keep telling me I'm wrong and arguing their point, but don't want a solution. Makes no sense to me at all.

I will happily take my statistics and data right on over to the other thread... But not if people just follow me over there and keep telling me I'm wrong.

I came and posted on the thread as an stranger *Mia and answered your question. Some people responded to that. Was that not okay?

Estranger - sorry auto correct

hugshelp

I came and posted on the thread as an stranger *Mia and answered your question. Some people responded to that. Was that not okay?

Definitely not a problem hugs, I'm not trying to stop people from sharing their stories. I read yours and i really do appreciate your sharing, as you offered the perspective I asked for.

It's just that people keep coming in just to invalidate the estrangers and it's very unpleasant.

There are a handful of people around here who feel that no discussion is complete without their input. None of them identify as estrangers and are adamant that they were wrongfully estranged, so they're all over my thread criticizing word choices and telling people their wrong.

It's disrespectful and antagonizing and has been the theme here for a very long time. Someone DM'd yesterday saying it has been like this for 9 years and to give up because nothing will change.

That's messed up on a lot of levels and I'm here asking people who were not the target of my thread to give the people who were a safe space, even for a week.

What's wrong with that?

It’s just become a long tirade of extra long rambling posts, mainly talking how much everyone has suffered to outdo each other along with analysis of the monetary system, baby boomers etc. I am very interested in politics, , the stock market etc on the relevant thread. Is it to prove how much everyone knows, it does not impress me, is not a subject for support on an estrangement support thread.
Unless this completely disintegrates and I suspect why, it is about time it got back on track.

MiaZadora81

MiaZadora81

Okay seriously though, I do need support about my other thread because I want to compromise.

I'm the OP of the thread and I asked for "the estranger" perspective. I'm aware that everyone can post on any thread, however, people who don't identify as "estrangers" came to the thread and gave their opinions about why the "estrangers" are wrong which led to arguing, etc.

It's frustrating and tiresome for everyone, so can we please have a truce or something?

I'm not saying this would be forever, but maybe we try it for a week and see how it goes?

My thread is about how people who identify as "estrangers" feel and I want it to be a safe space for people to share how they feel.

So, for the next week, how about the people who don't identify as "estrangers" observe the thread but refrain from commenting

Again, I can't dictate who goes where, I'm just trying to give everyone some space to feel safe.

As I understand it, this specific thread is for everyone who is dealing with estrangement. However, I'm happy to stop commenting here and will do so if I can just find a resolution to my problem.

If people want to make a new thread for "the non-estrangers" maybe that would help? I honestly don't know, it's just a suggestion on because the goal is not to exclude anyone.

I can't speak for anyone other than myself, but I have no problem refraining from commenting in such a space, whatever it's called

Again, I'm not suggesting people stop commenting forever on the other thread, I'm just suggesting a trial period so that my thread can have a chance.

Thanks to everyone for helping me figure this problem out.

It seems that people ignored my post about compromising and giving the estrangers space.

This is the only post that I actually asked for help with and people ignored that

This exact dynamic is why estrangement happens.

One person says "apples are fruit" and the other person says "not all fruit are apples, I hate apples but I love oranges. Watermelon is okay but only if it's perfectly ripe"!

Mia says "boomers control 80% of the wealth", and people say "not all boomers are wealthy!... But the young people just want everything right now and don't know the value of hard work. What's wrong with these young people not understanding anything?? I wore rope for clothes and they want Gucci!"

People seem to want to keep telling me I'm wrong and arguing their point, but don't want a solution. Makes no sense to me at all.

I will happily take my statistics and data right on over to the other thread... But not if people just follow me over there and keep telling me I'm wrong.

I completely missed your post above Miaziadora Not sure how.

My comment would be that some posters do not identify whether they are estranger/estranged or both. They may not wish to. They may wish to post on your thread about their feelings but without giving specifics about their situation? I'm not sure if there is a solution to that really but just thought I would highlight it as something to consider.

Thanks Mia. Good to know.
I think that part of the problem is that there are times when we all feel attacked because an opposing viewpoint is expressed in what feels like an accusatory or over-generalised manner. And I mean all, not all 'in one camp or the other.'

Social media is a clumsy means of communication at the best of times but when people who are hurting from different perspectives come together it can be very difficult to remember to word everything as well as we could.

We should also try and remember not everyone can word things as well as they would like. I remember someone on a thread seemed really antagonistic but then learned that their communication style was largely due to neurodivergence. Naturally I did my best to take that on board.

I don't communicate as well as I used to as brain damage and sight impairment from an accident has considerably slowed my ability to read and type. So it is quite a laborious chore to try and get it right. Sometimes I just forget to check it.

The problem is you get a lot of trolls and people who just like to be disruptive on social media, and people often forget to make these allowances, thinking others are being deliberately provocative.

Perhaps we all need a wee reminder to think of someone else's perspective before we press post. Often our emotions produce a knee-jerk reaction that is not expressed as gently as it might be.

hugshelp

Thanks Mia. Good to know.
I think that part of the problem is that there are times when we all feel attacked because an opposing viewpoint is expressed in what feels like an accusatory or over-generalised manner. And I mean all, not all 'in one camp or the other.'

Social media is a clumsy means of communication at the best of times but when people who are hurting from different perspectives come together it can be very difficult to remember to word everything as well as we could.

We should also try and remember not everyone can word things as well as they would like. I remember someone on a thread seemed really antagonistic but then learned that their communication style was largely due to neurodivergence. Naturally I did my best to take that on board.

I don't communicate as well as I used to as brain damage and sight impairment from an accident has considerably slowed my ability to read and type. So it is quite a laborious chore to try and get it right. Sometimes I just forget to check it.

The problem is you get a lot of trolls and people who just like to be disruptive on social media, and people often forget to make these allowances, thinking others are being deliberately provocative.

Perhaps we all need a wee reminder to think of someone else's perspective before we press post. Often our emotions produce a knee-jerk reaction that is not expressed as gently as it might be.

Good points hugshelp and worth thinking about

And maybe we should clarify what someone actually means before we assume we know sometimes. Asking questions is a much better way to learn from one another than arguing the toss.

hugshelp

And maybe we should clarify what someone actually means before we assume we know sometimes. Asking questions is a much better way to learn from one another than arguing the toss.

Yes and believe them when they do clarify

My comment would be that some posters do not identify whether they are estranger/estranged or both

Agreed. So then just let the people who do identify as estrangers have a week of space.

If people don't identify as estrangers, then refrain commenting on the thread asking for estrangers, for just a week to see how it goes. That is not unreasonable.

I can agree to refrain from commenting here for a week, no problem. In fact,

I would agree to stop commenting on this specific thread forever if I could get 2 specific people to stop commenting on the thread I made

However, I don't think anyone is interested in my initial compromise and I'd bet half of my healthy 401k that those 2 people will never agree to stop even if it means I disappear from this thread.

I've started an excel spreadsheet of possible discussions related to estrangement for this thread, complete with sources.

Topics include estrangement caused by disparities in emotional intelligence and communication styles, reconciliation through compromise and bias, and the role of Internet scams in estrangement.

Does anyone have a preference for where I should start?

Mia......I cannot see why you so angry. I have seen no evidence of you being got at it, stalked or hounded, on either of these threads.

I just don't know what you want from us. You ask for support and we try to give advice but you throw it back in our faces.

Yesterday you ranted about boomers holding 80% of the wealth and how difficult it was to afford housing, Not only did we agree with you, I even tried to give to give you some sound practical financial advice. I gave you 5 tips to help you.

I genuinely am at a loss as to see how I could have been more supportive. Or did you just want me to say "there, there, you are so right, you a helpless victim suffering because of all the nasty wicked boomers who have stolen all the money".

Same today.....you asked for the viewpoint from the estranger and Hugs told you her story, yet you are still complaining. I have just doubled checked todays posts on the other thread and I can see no evidence of anyone being disrespectful or antagonistic, not towards you, Hugs or anyone else. Just some general chit chat and a brief discussion about chat rooms. Unless I've missed something in which case I stand corrected.

Allsorts....I do hope you aren't accusing me of trying to "show off how much I know" I posted the financial advice out of a genuine wish to help Mia.

I am sorry if I come over as a "know it all".. I was merely trying to help. As it is I can see I was plainly wasting my time.

I've just realised I have posted on a thread I said I'd leave

Genuine error

It's still on my active list

I am nosy

I lost track of which thread was which

derbyshirelass

Please go look for my response to your advice, posted at 06:18.

I also sent you a private message.

I'm not angry, please stop assigning that emotion to me. I am frustrated and confused, but I'm not angry.

If people don't identify as estrangers, then refrain commenting on the thread asking for estrangers, for just a week to see how it goes. That is not unreasonable

Yes I understand that that is your suggestion. But they may comment without saying that they identify as an estranger, is what I meant. I was aiming to be helpful in terms of highlighting something that might possibly make your suggestion slightly less straightforward to implement.

No worries vs.

I don't understand what the problem is either DSL. This is an open forum and people are allowed to post wherever they choose too.

Normally when someone starts a new thread, they're pleased to see it doing well with plenty of responses and there have been today, on the new thread and all of them pleasant to read.

I shall continue to post there when I want too Mia. I have no personal preference which one of the discussions you've thought of bringing to this thread you bring first.

The one you posted last night on boomers provided a basis for an enjoyable discussion on here today, so I'm sure that any other topics you raise will do the same.

*I shall continue to post there when I want too Mia*- Smileless2012

Lololol did you think I, or anyone, doubted that?

The next time someone tells me to take my statistics/data to another thread, I'm sure you'll be there defending my right to post here correct?

I do remember you saying that there are threads you wouldn't be interested in and don't participate in, but I've concluded that you were being facetious.

My aunt taught me that not everyone is capable of compromise, and in real life, many people who won't compromise end up estranged, so it all makes sense to me.

Hugshelp, I love that you brought up communication styles in your post. So I think I'll focus on how the relationships between communication styles and estrangement.

Looking forward to it everyone!

MiaZadora81

derbyshirelass

Please go look for my response to your advice, posted at 06:18.

I also sent you a private message.

I'm not angry, please stop assigning that emotion to me. I am frustrated and confused, but I'm not angry.

Thanks Mia, and thanks for your pm. I've pmd you back.

Compromise is a tricky one isn't it. Sometimes compromise can feel like you are selling your soul or is that just me, ?

I sometimes feel when I compromise then I'm not being my authentic self. I do know I compromised too much with my DIL because she accused me of being fake. And in a way I was, because I wasn't being true to myself.

Compromise can be very difficult, some people find it very hard to back down once they have assumed a position. They just dig themselves into a deep big hole. They feel if they compromise they might be seen as weak. To them compromise means they are "losing face". It becomes an issue of pride.

It's complicated.

Good assessment of what compromise can mean to people DerbyshireLass; I think most are more than willing to compromise if they don't feel bullied, harangued or coerced in to something. That's usually counter productive and leads to feet being firmly dug in. Tricky things relationships....

DerbyshireLass

Compromise is a tricky one isn't it. Sometimes compromise can feel like you are selling your soul or is that just me, ?

I sometimes feel when I compromise then I'm not being my authentic self. I do know I compromised too much with my DIL because she accused me of being fake. And in a way I was, because I wasn't being true to myself.

Compromise can be very difficult, some people find it very hard to back down once they have assumed a position. They just dig themselves into a deep big hole. They feel if they compromise they might be seen as weak. To them compromise means they are "losing face". It becomes an issue of pride.

It's complicated.

I agree with you completely.

From my perspective, it's all about what the most important goal is.

For a lot of people, they value being right and not backing down over all else.

So these people will stand their ground until the end all the while complaining that they've been abandoned.

We all get to decide what matters to us and what we prioritize, but also means we don't get to blame other people when they make different choices.

In my case, I asked for something that I was also willing to do. The people I asked said no they don't want to do it.

That's okay, but it's not fair to complain about the consequences of that decision.