Narcissists are boring

It was a less bonkers trait of hers to be fair...

She also believed she could psychically wish people ill and when bad things happened to people she didn't like she took the credit...

And she had techniques for making people uncomfortable like staring at their ears or nose...

As I can't make good eye contact, this is hard for me because I'm always worried I will make them uncomfortable so I've settled for just looking away from them!

Some people hate that and sort of try to move into your eyeline

Ah well, I work in a school, they all just understand I'm probably on the spectrum lol

Is your Mum my Mum's sister Violetsky? My Mum used to go into trances and it was quite odd. She also made a lot of people uncomfortable and killed quite a lot of my friendships because they didn't want to come to our house anymore because "Your Mum's wierd!" . She probably did it on purpose.

I also struggle with eye contact and probably sometimes overdo it in an attempt to be sincere lol. Yes well, it's a good place to work when you are!

Lol

Yes same with eye contact, so annoying

And if I get accused of doing something I haven't done I have to do a whole soul search to ask myself if I could possibly have done it and it can be so painful honestly

You should have seen me when a colleagues purse went missing. I'd have failed a lie detector and was very relieved when the culprit was caught red handed

Still, I don't mind being neurodivergent, it actually helps me in my job... especially things like mirroring children with SEN needs and making them feel comfortable

I don't mind being neurodivergent either, yes it can help in some jobs and also it's good to think outside the box. I think we neurodivergent are good in teams because we see things that others don't see, adding that extra perspective that may have been missed or those important little details that matter.

Yes, to mirroring and making kids comfortable (of all ages haha, because everyone has that inner child)

I am also able to do that inner search and if I had done it, I would say so. That's why it's so frustrating having someone try to pin things on me that I know I haven't done. That's classic Projection for you, though.

Yes it is, that's why it's so important we have these conversations and protect ourselves

The mothers you are talking about obviosly have mental illnesses. They don't consciously decide to be horrible, go into trances, being weird, the mind is damaged. You don't know all their story. I know it's hard to live with, it gets too much and you cut off, I understand that. You are entitled to cut your own path and good luck to you. If you need understanding for how it affected you, surely they need the same. By all means lead your own lives, don't have a thing to do with them, but don't judge but understand it's an illness.

What a weird thing to post on a thread where people have been coerced and abused

Allsorts

The mothers you are talking about obviosly have mental illnesses. They don't consciously decide to be horrible, go into trances, being weird, the mind is damaged. You don't know all their story. I know it's hard to live with, it gets too much and you cut off, I understand that. You are entitled to cut your own path and good luck to you. If you need understanding for how it affected you, surely they need the same. By all means lead your own lives, don't have a thing to do with them, but don't judge but understand it's an illness.

Allsorts I think the difference here is that the mothers/parents are being identified as narcissists and the conversation is specifically about dealing with/recovering from narcissistic parents.

If the back story was, for example, a parent damaged in the war or damaged by a severely physically abusive childhood or a Parent who was bi-polar then I think understanding, if not forgiveness, (though not detracting from the impact on the AC who is trying to recover) comes more naturally.

With Narcissistic Personality Disorder, therapy can help but there is no cure and because a child's relationship with that person is interwoven with the narcissistic parenting, (which is often many variations on emotional abuse) then even if they understand, they will still have a need to frame and reframe their experiences, the impact on their own adult behaviours etc. Doing that doesn't mean a lack of understanding of the cause, but that isn't a priority on any level for an AC recovering/managing the impacts of that parenting.

And it's not going to be highlighted on a thread like this, pretty unsurprisingly!

Hi Madgran Very thought provoking.
I think that perhaps an ‘understanding of the cause’ should be a priority of a person recovering from emotional abuse.
Compassion to others and oneself, leading to a degree of forgiveness and a sort of release.

Sorry, I put that badly - I meant understanding why the abuser acts the way that they do.

I think I understand why my mother is the way that she is and I do have compassion for that

But behaviours you inflict on one or some, having a false self and covering up those bad behaviours makes it a choice.

I know what you mean, Allsorts. I have known two narcissists (by my diagnosis!) and neither of them is happy. Both have had a string of failed relationships and few, if any, close friends. They tend to reinvent themselves each time they get a new supply, as part of the 'mirroring' that goes with love bombing. This means that they don't really know who they are - everything from taste in music to political allegiance shifts to that of the new supply, and when the devaluation starts it devalues their sense of self. They start again when the next 'supply' comes along.

I think they genuinely think they have found 'the one' to help them (whether it is a close colleague, a lover/spouse, a best friend or whatever) each time, and the 'love bombing' is as real as they can be. It's all a lie, but they mean it when they say it. they really want someone to understand them and 'complete' them by giving them unconditional love/respect/care.

When things go wrong, as they always do, they are angry/disappointed as they see it as someone else letting them down, which proves to them that nobody is ever going to be good enough for them. They really do think they are the victims, and that nobody understands them/people are jealous/all women(or men) are unfaithful/they are being picked on etc etc, and they can't see their own role in any of it.

Their actions might be choices, but they are driven by deep-seated psychological motives (usually of survival, because of the abandonment they suffered as a child).*

They are very damaged people. It is really difficult to have any sympathy when you've been on the receiving end of their cruelty, but I wouldn't want to live in the head of a narcissist.

*I don't want to say too much, but the two people I knew both had 'events' as children. One lost her mother at 5, and the other was sent to a relative's because her younger sibling was sickly and their mother couldn't cope. Her sibling was 4 years younger. Both of these things tie in with what the psychologists say is at the root of narcissism - a feeling that they are alone in the world at a critical stage of development.

FannyCornforth

Sorry, I put that badly - I meant understanding why the abuser acts the way that they do.

Yes I agree. I think an understanding of why is important. I just don't think that people should have to endlessly express that understanding on a tgread like this, when talking about and sharing experiences and finding people who have had similar experiences.

Brilliant comment Madgran

I agree Madgran

We know what we know. I couldn't possibly begin to explain everything I've been through on an online forum, yet that doesn't alter facts. That's why it is useful to talk to people who know and have shared experiences, with very little explanation needed.

The thread is about whether narcissists are boring, though. Not necessarily a thread just for sharing experiences. IMO they aren't - they are individuals. Some are boring and others anything but.

FWIW, I think that an understanding of why they are how they are is really helpful. It can make you understand that their treatment of you wasn't personal, and not your fault, but a result of their 'wiring'. It took me a while (ok, ages, and I still hurt sometimes) to realise that obsessing about their behaviour is no different from obsessing about why a crocodile eats people.

You can choose to look for reasons why your arm was bitten off and bemoan your fate, or you can accept that it was nothing you did, and there was nothing you could have done differently. There is no point though. It's just what crocodiles do.

I do find it boring because narcs are stuck and repeat the same old same old stuff like a stuck record because they won't seek therapy to move on. Instead it is us who get therapy and move on (and then we really are past hearing it all regurgitated)

I don't think they can move on, OaU. Crocodiles won't seek therapy as they don't know that there is an alternative to being a crocodile, and for them there really isn't.

It's not an excuse, but an explanation. The best thing is to stay away as much as possible, but when it's family or when you have to work closely (or whatever) with one, all you can try to do is switch off from it.

The thread is about healing

It is about getting to that place where narcissists are boring and predictable.

It's about recognising them

It's about protecting yourself from them

It's about knowing when others are using the triggers a narcissist installed to hurt you or shut you down.

It's about loving yourself enough to walk away from them

It's about helping others do the same

The difficult thing about learning to recognise them is that they often start by being kind and even loving. It is dangerous to assume that everyone who is good to you has ulterior motives - on the whole they don't.

I know that I can be too trusting, and too ready to 'let people in', and that does leave me open to being targeted again; but if the alternative is to distrust everyone, be on constant alert for red flags and shut myself off from people, I don't think it's worth it. It's tricky.

The thread is about whether narcissists are boring, though. Not necessarily a thread just for sharing experiences. IMO they aren't - they are individuals. Some are boring and others anything but

Except that the title is not reflecting the discussion. I think the title is misleading and unfortunate, but it is possible to see where the conversation is going despite the title!

I do get your explanation VS re the purpose and reason for that title though

It’s very difficult dealing with anyone with a mental illness, not for the faint hearted. I wouldn’t say a narcisstic person was sane and level headed.

VioletSky

I think I understand why my mother is the way that she is and I do have compassion for that

But behaviours you inflict on one or some, having a false self and covering up those bad behaviours makes it a choice.

Yes I agree Violet . Understanding the cause and having compassion don't cancel the choices made to behave in particular ways

Recovering from narcissistic abuse is weird and confusing because you spend a lot of your time thinking that if you could handle things better, things would be better.

The truth is there is just no way of better handling abuse.

Family who abuse you quit long before you did.

They can protest but they quit, estrangement is not on you

Any child from an abusuve relationship, a narcissist that plays with your head, physical abuse, should walk away for their own mental health. No one chooses to whom they are born and that family has total control over you for years. You have to recognise your helplessness in such a situation, equally seek to understand rather be understood by those parents. They are not changing because they can't. .Some adults, regrettably have children that are impossible, those children rule and make home a totally unhappy place one crisis after another.