In hindsight, do you think there was a way to have prevented estrangement?

I do think you need normal household rules.

So, if it required it, I'd cheerfully nag them about loading/unloading the dishwasher, bring down any plates etc from their bedrooms, and bring down dirty washing.

They wanted clean plates, clean clothes, and as I was working full time, I didn't have time to be their slaves as well. 🙄

Phones were a different saga when my AC were teenagers. There were no mobiles, and I wasn't having them tying up the home phone for hours (and running up the bill), talking to those they'd seen at school all day. So, I bought a home pay phone. That sorted it out.

But, the rest I was pretty laid back about.🙂

MayBee70

I’m many years on from where you are Dazy but I struggle with the fact that my children ( who were also my world) seem to socialise far more with their father and his family, even though he left us for someone else and I’m still the one that provides childcare etc. I wonder if, when their father still lived with you, you were still the disciplinarian ( I’ve always thought that that always falls upon one parent and not the other) and it’s just continuing in that way? Can’t really offer advice other than try to make a life for yourself and be happy.

When couples split up , so often the one with whom the children live becomes the disciplinarian while the other simply takes them on fun outings. It is hard being the one who has to deal with the day to day! Teenagers can be challenging in every home. I once lost my temper with my son and shut him out of the house without any shoes on in the winter. I told him to phone his dad and get him to come and get him! He phoned and his dad refused!

My kids are now in their 30's and both have said on occasions what a rubbish dad he was! They both see him though, not very often as they live at a distance, and both are aware that it is always on his terms. He doesn't often put himself out for them. He was a good dad when they were young but at the end of the day he always put his own needs ahead of everyone else's.

There is good advice here about building a life for yourself, as they won't be living with you forever. Make sure they know they are loved. As they get older they with recognise things for what they are. Try not to react when MiL speaks ill of you.
I was lucky that mine treated me fairly, though she finds it hard to believe either of her sons are less than perfect. I have had to set her straight once or twice when she has complained about things to do with them, but we still stay in contact and have a reasonable relationship.

Good luck!

Yes, if I had kept my mouth shut every time he told me to I am sure I'd have made a wonderful doormat for my son for years to come. He really didn't want a parent with a mouth, so he ditched me.

If you fear that you may have lost them, it's worth thinking about how to talk to them in a way which might avoid a damaging split. It will only work if you are able to let go of 'stating your case' - saying what you have done for them, for instance, suggesting they should be grateful. I am only saying these things as examples, they may not be what you might say - the overarching point is to seek to hear them as fully as you can, not challenge them or justify your self. It might help first to talk it through with a sensible friend (no drama queen!) or even find a good counsellor. Then you have had a safe place to express your feelings and be heard. After that you might feel ready and able to say to them something along the lines of this : "I can see that you feel angry with me and I realise that I have sometimes said things which could have led to your feeling like that. I am sorry. I would like to understand how you feel and how I could respond in a way which worked better for you in the future" Not easy in a way, but also could be a relief - put down your pain, your feeling of being misunderstood, your own anger - and just speak truthfully and with acceptance of your own part in whatever is going on. No parent gets everything right - do not beat yourself up - and few parents have the courage and insight to speak to their children in the way I am suggesting here. But I think you might well be able to do this - find the courage to feel the fear and do it anyway. (That is the title of a paper back book by Susan Jeffers - you might find it helpful) I wish you well.

I feel for you having had a rotten time. But as a social worker I saw lots of families in crisis & I don't think there is any normal things to grumble about, presumably your ex has different standards & maybe some of that laid back style would see you through this period?
I used to let my kids 'suffer' from their own lack of action, ie 'mum I've got no xxx to wear today!!' me 'Let me show you how the washing machine works so you can do it in future.'
I saw myself as training them to be adults & if their self care was lacking, they felt the effects. The teenage years don't last & they will grow out of this.
I just feel it is too easy to be too critical and anyone would naturally shy away from that. Arrange more nice times for yourself and enjoy your young people more, ensure they enjoy their time with you even if home standards slacken, help them see you as a friend, not a nag & you won't feel that you are in danger of loosing them, which will help you too.

You say ypur children have been and are the reason for your existence. Your children are oldet teenagers. Perhaps uou are smothering them, especially the daughtet you mention. Perhaps you are needing to pull away, accept your children will have different views from you on many things, including your ex, their Dad. Don't keep on trying to fix it, leave your daughter to come round at her own pace. Find something for yourself that will be a distraction for you.

Welcome Dazy. Don’t worry about what might never happen. I was always the disciplinarian in our house. I was the ‘nag’. Dad was the ‘nice’ parent, especially in my daughter’s eyes. But he left me for someone else and he saw my 3 AC occasionally (youngest was still in school). Now they are married and have children of their own. To their credit, they do take the little ones to see their Grandad -( although I hate it that they call her Nan). I wish things were different but…..
You have had a hard time. I hope you enjoy your teenagers - difficult, but lovely xx

I am estranged from my adult children and because of that I only see the eldest 2 of my 5 grandchildren (through their other parent) who are all under 14. Their father and I divorced amicably when they were between 11 and 15 and he showed interest in them until he got a new girlfriend, I had several failed relationships as I couldnt pick and choose when I wanted to be a parent.
You do your best for them, support them as much as you can but ultimately you can't (and shouldn't) control what happens as they become adults. Mine left home, came back when things didn't work out for them, and left again when it suited them. When they left home they forgot I existed unless I was of use to them so I decided it was time for me to carve a life for myself again and have a good relationship but they didn't like that even though they had relationships and childen themselves. It appears that their mother should always be available when needed but its OK for their father to do as he likes.
Not sure this is much help but I bent over backwards to support my kids even in adulthood and never expected this so who knows. Worrying about it now won't change a thing but make sure you're not left alone with nothing, waiting for them to throw you the odd 'titbit' from their new lives as and when it suits them. I hope for much better for you and anyone else on this thread but there comes a point when you have to stop living your life for your kids 😔😘

Gran16 .

Violetsky- absolutely brilliant advice: love smile and don’t treat your children as you burden carriers - they are much too young for that. Been there and done that so speak whereof I know what.

As others have said you need to get on with your own life. your children would probably love to see you getting out and about and I'm sure your relationship would improve.
Do you like walking - there are probably several groups in your area.
The U3A (University of the Third Age) have several avtivities going on and regular meetings.
Also your local Age UK usually have classes for various things.
Check the internet for your area and good luck
in making new friends to fill your life.