People who fear Christmas

A very sad situation. We can’t know why the Mother of the children did this, but the Father can surely have regular visitation rights and contact?
Grandparents are a different story tragically and it’s easy for them to just be summarily cut off from the much loved grandchildren for life.☹️

Does the son have access to his children?

It sounds an awful situation, but can the ex wife legally deny him visitation rights?

No access. Some of these mothers are very devious. Another friend never sees her small grandson because her son and his ex girlfriend never married. He has paid maintenance since the child was born and she allowed him to see him until he was about two then kept making excuses that he was ill or they were going somewhere and now that has stopped.

The problem there is, she never put his name on the birth certificate, she works in a solicitors office and her father is high up in the Police so she has obviously been getting advice. Fathers for Justice have told him it will cost him mega money to take the legal route and he doesn’t have it.

That is very sad, and apparently unjust. Has the son in the OP applied for access or shared custody? I appreciate that it may be difficult to see the children regularly across long distances, but in most cases weekend access can be granted, with shared custody in holiday periods.

It is very unfair on all concerned if not, but I would have thought it quite unusual?

Has the son attended mediation? You can represent yourself in court and you can apply for help with mediation costs so it doesn't have to cost a great deal. The children will be given representation in their own interests. Has this been done?

But she can’t just take the children away and never let them see the father Primrose He can’t have followed it through because he could take her to court for shared custody

As it’s a friend and not your story there is no way anyone on here can help so a bit if a he says she says post

You don’t know the details so we don’t know the details but no one can just take the children and disappear the courts try to be fair to both parents unless their is otherwise cause

Being granted contact doesn't mean that the father will actually get to see his children. Some mothers will do their utmost to make the father out to be some evil being who doesn't love them. In this case it's the children themselves who refuse contact.
A friend of ours on his last contact visit was told by his daughters that he was a very bad daddy. They said they hated him and never wanted to see him again. They did refuse to see him and he moved away heartbroken.

BlueBelle

But she can’t just take the children away and never let them see the father Primrose He can’t have followed it through because he could take her to court for shared custody

As it’s a friend and not your story there is no way anyone on here can help so a bit if a he says she says post

You don’t know the details so we don’t know the details but no one can just take the children and disappear the courts try to be fair to both parents unless their is otherwise cause

"He could take her to court for shared custody"

I'm guessing he can't because the mother has good reason to abandon them and the court would side with her. Seems unlikely that they wouldn't try that avenue before succumbing to a mental breakdown.

We had 5 years of no contact with our grandchildren and very little with our DS (due to his then wife). I absolutely hated Christmas. Shops were full of people shopping for children when we had no idea what sort of things out grandchildren liked. And TV and radio talked endlessly about families being together at Christmas. The hardest bit was trying to put on a cheerful act on Christmas Day when my elderly father joined us.
Please be very kind and understanding to anyone you know who is in this position .

Yes, whatever the underlying reasons, it is desperately sad when people are separated from loved ones at Christmas. The ads are all about families and 'togetherness', and it must be very difficult to be unable to be with people you love.

It's not the same at all, but I hated the Covid Christmas, when plans were cancelled at the last minute and we couldn't be with family. It would be even worse for those who live alone - at least I had Mr Dog for company, and we spoke to our children on Zoom.

The Christmas season is a very difficult time for a lot of people, estranged or not. I find it very stressful trying to please everyone, buying presents. I am very generous but I also worry that I am too generous. I doubt the kids and grandkids appreciate my generosity. But as we all know, you give but don’t expect a ‘thankyou’ in return. My main stress is trying to get the family to have one meal together during the Xmas season, but even that is so stressful. I give up 😫

eddiecat78

We had 5 years of no contact with our grandchildren and very little with our DS (due to his then wife). I absolutely hated Christmas. Shops were full of people shopping for children when we had no idea what sort of things out grandchildren liked. And TV and radio talked endlessly about families being together at Christmas. The hardest bit was trying to put on a cheerful act on Christmas Day when my elderly father joined us.
Please be very kind and understanding to anyone you know who is in this position .

I was choked up all afternoon after talking to her. She was nearly in tears as was her husband. We were in a pub so they held back as best they could. My husband just asked how her son was as he went to primary school with our son. It was heartbreaking listening to her.

Her daughter also has two kids who live locally and they all spend Christmas together but she says she aches inside for the two missing ones. But puts on a brave face. 😥

Some of these mothers are very devious

Sadly, a minority of people can be devious.

crazy H I decided to make a list of things I enjoy around Christmas, might be very simple things. And try to ignore the rest.

That's so sad Primrose and my heart goes out to your friend.

Being estranged and separated from your child and GC is particularly difficult at Christmas, even if you have other AC and GC to share the season with.

We do the same*Jeanathome*. Rather than try to ignore it which let's face it is impossible, we embrace it. What brings us the most joy is watching our dogs 'unwrap' their presents and jumping into all the discarded wrapping paper.

I have seen how devious these women can be and its heartbreaking. We don't know why some people want total control unless they are suffering abuse. It's the children that suffer too, losing half their family.
It's worse if you have no partner or live alone you feel it's just you on the planet. Christmas ads don't help, but there's no ideal family as they show.

I might be on my own this year, if I do see someone it's for Christmas dinner. The rest if the time I eat what I want to it's only a couple of days, go a walk if weather permits and watch television whatever I like.
Eddie, I do hope you see your DS and grandchildren now, it sounds as if he had a controlling wife.

Primrose, not having the father’s name on the birth certificate will in no way stop contact between the father and children. Some mothers, like some fathers can and do make contact difficult but the family courts focus in ensuring children’s needs are met.

The problem for many Iam is being to afford to go to court initially, and then return to court if a contact order is in place but is being circumvented.

The vast reduction in cases eligible for legal aid has had a huge impact. I think I'm right when I say that it's no longer available for a parent needing to go to court because they're being prevented from seeing their children.

Christmas ads do tend to focus on large family gatherings don't they Allsorts, but for so many that's not how their Christmas will be.

Unfortunately not unusual at all. My son spent a lot to get a court order but it's not worth the paper it is written on. After a while, his ex did everything she could to stop them seeing him. It started with her making other arrangements when he was due to see them. After a while, all the lies she told them and obstacles she putcin the way worked and, 14 years on, he never sees them. He still messages regularly, but rarely gets a response. He is a great Dad to his second family. His older children have missed so much.

You really find what a person is really like after a seperation. Deceitful, selfish and narcistic

@Primrose53
The father of a baby has to be present at the register office for his name to be put on the birth certificate. If he isn’t there, the mother couldn’t have his name out on even if she wanted to.

That's what's so wrong with the system Jan, if the parent the children are living with refuses to comply, there's nothing that can be done. It's so unfair to the children who are kept away from a parent and are often lied too, to dissuade them from wanting or seeking contact.

If the mother registers the baby's birth without the father's knowledge, there appears to be nothing the father can do IamMaz. I don't know what the answer is but there should be a way the father can have his details added.

I hope this doesn't give false hope but I do know of several men who were denied contact with their estranged children while growing up but once they were young adults they initiated contact themselves and are now part of their fathers' lives.

I feel for you all.

BlueBelle

But she can’t just take the children away and never let them see the father Primrose He can’t have followed it through because he could take her to court for shared custody

As it’s a friend and not your story there is no way anyone on here can help so a bit if a he says she says post

You don’t know the details so we don’t know the details but no one can just take the children and disappear the courts try to be fair to both parents unless their is otherwise cause

She probably can engineer a situation where access isn't possible, it happened to a relative of mine who used to pay for a flight back to see the kids but was repeatedly thwarted by excuses like them being ill or having other commitments. The financial cost of fighting to see them was devastating and as they got older they refused to have contact. It was blatant manipulation by the other parent but effectively blocked contact.

Christmas is so hard for those estranged. I find some time Christmas Day to go somewhere private and have a good cry, then I go back and get on with it.
Thinking of those apart this Christmas and spending it alone.
😞