Support and friendship for those whose lives have been affected by estrangement.

@Whiff hurray!! So glad to read your rambles again. Good to have you back!!
Am hoping you are taking it easy though, I know how you like to fill your days with purpose. Well, the purpose right now is getting you fully recovered.
And your wonderful daughter must be so glad you are recovering and back home, as well as your GCs.
Take care 🌺🙏🏾

@Yogi yes it should be the last op for our GS, but checks every year until he is 8/10.
There is the risk of cranial pressure but is very low, glad they will keep checking GOSH is a fantastic hospital for little ones but glad he won’t need to go back now until he is 2.
Xx

Dogsjj commiserations, truly, and you’ve come to the right space/page.

Whiff we put up with a lot it sounds like. In the run up to estrangement, my DS and DiL would only invite me to theirs for one weekend in late January. That was my Christmas with them and my DGC. This was over 3 years.
I knew it was a bit bad but felt that if I didn’t keep the peace, I would be in the wrong entirely.
I had booked a cottage at the seaside, I let my DiL choose it.
The month before it was full CO.

Anyway my crocuses are putting up tiny shoots and my fruit trees have tiny leaf buds and flower shoots on them. The joy of renewal, as the gardening year unfolds again.

Have a lovely evening GN friends…

@SparklyGrandma, I know that your garden and your beautiful cats are a source of joy and contentment for you, I imagine you with your cats surrounded by much loved plants and flowers and I always feel at peace with this image. So sad that your DS and DiL couldn’t see the person you are, some people are just blind to those who love them.
Take care 🌺🙏🏾

Whiff Hope you're feeling better and more comfortable back home.
Just wanted to send you love and best wishes for your continuing recovery.x

Babs seeing your fox pic in my mind the fox saying hope I am showing my good side. I know I am weird . But things like that just pop into my head.

Bridie is horrible to know your child is so uncaring they never think of you and if you need a bit of help. During covid lockdowns my daughter always asked if I needed anything and my neighbours always knocked my door if they where going shopping. My son never asked once not even before the estrangement.

Yogin I started to sort out my photos few months ago into 3 lots . One for my daughter,my brother and the other lot for my grandsons by my son. I will leave instructions with them for my daughter if she can track them down to give to my grandsons 2 years after I die. That way my son won't know I have died until then and he can't contest my will. As it could be contested up to 2 years after I die. It's horrible to have to think ahead to your death but I had to safe guard my daughter's inheritance even though she doesn't want any. But if I go into a home there won't be any . I changed my will in September 2020 and took out both powers of attorney and my daughter and son in law are my attorneys . Funny enough I thought it's a good job I did when I went to hospital and couldn't speak. If my speech hadn't come back my daughter was legally able to speak for me and make decisions.

Smiles that must have been thrilling seeing the deer. Moving when you did means you get to see the whole year unfolding in front of you. And all the new things that will appear as the months go by .

Yogin your plans for your party sound lovely . Live music as well as records . I know they aren't records but can't think what you call music on laptops 🤷. It will pop into my head later today . 🤦. Are you having a theme or anything goes.

Dogsjj glad you found the support thread but how incredibly cruel of your daughter. 18 years of nothing then wanting you back then dumping you again . Why apart from hurting you again . What did she think I know let's see if I can destroy my mom and finish her off this time .

The cruelty is unbelievable it's like some gothic novel. But if it was a book it wouldn't get published as being unbelievable. Do you think your grandchildren will want to keep in touch?

Babs that's great news about your grandson . At least he is young enough to forget what has happened so far. And a bright future ahead for him and his parents. Plus his loving nannie and other family ..

Now caught up with this page.
Babs good to know they will keep an eye on your grandson for years to come . It's amazing what medical science can do and the skill of the surgeons especially on young children. Makes me wonder how small the surgical instruments must be . People knock the NHS but where would we be without it. One of my daughters son's and one of my sons have both been helped by Alder Hey when they where younger.

The good thing living here is the number of specialist hospitals. I have been helped by 3 one general and 2 specialist. I went years without the medical help I needed but since moving here my whole life has changed thanks to my GP sending me to see my neurologist and cardiologist. And getting the help , treatment and answers I have needed for decades . My latest stay in 2 hospitals has been changeling but the care I have received a millionaire could have had better. I just worried so much as my daughter came everyday and stayed for 3 hours she even took a day off work unpaid . Her in laws are lovely people and stepped in to help with our grandsons. I never wanted my daughter to go through what she did 2019/2020 with me . But she told me to stop being a silly billy . Said I was looking better yesterday. The boys have a lot happening the weekend with clubs and birthday parties so told her not to come today but she said she would pop in on her lunch break then if I am ok will leave it until Monday . But I know she will keep texting to make sure I am ok.

SparklyGrandma we put up with a lot from our estranged children things we would never stand from anyone else . But they know it and play on the fact we love them . Until the day we decide enough is enough. I gave up any hope of seeing or hearing from my son autumn 2023 and have been happier since . I do wonder what my grandsons look like and the youngest name . But I refuse to let it hurt me anymore. I never even gave my son a thought in hospital.

Miss A and Sweetpeasue thank you for your good wishes and lovely of you both to post here . I know you both from other threads.

Well think that's me caught up with everyone. Thank you all knowing you are here has helped me get over my latest hurdle . 😘

Morning all

Weather so much better thank God, hate the bitter cold, scrapping off the car if leaving earlier and slippery roads and pavements.

Good to read your long post Whiff and hear you're back home recovering well. Your DD sounds like a lovely and caring young women.

@Whiff so glad our resident rambler is back!!
Am sure is reassuring to know your daughter will be checking in on you, as estranged parents we forget that love is a two way road, and we don’t expect much from our other ACs. We constantly feel surprised when our other daughters do something for us and try hard not to ask anything of them. But your daughter and our daughters love us as much as we love them. She must have been so worried when you were rushed to hospital, I imagine she’d do anything to make sure it doesn’t happen again. You mean a lot to her Whiff and to your GCs. And to so many on GN.
Never under estimate that.
Take care 🌺🙏🏾

Thank you Babs03 it helps me feeling positive and looking forward. As far as is possible.

Whiff exactly - about putting up with stuff from our ACs - and sometimes I think, why didn’t I raise things, challenge gently things - but I suppose I thought at the time that things would settle in.

Lovely seeing you again Yogi and your dear little Joey who was tentative when we first met but lay with his head on my lap when we had coffee.
Here’s to our next meet up.
🌺🙏🏾

Yogi and Babs, how lovely you being close to each other and meeting up all three of you because you have to include Joey.
Whiff so glad you are at home and feeling loads better, it must help so much having such support from your daughter.
Sparkly, I’m like you with my garden, the daffodils I have put out in tubs because the squirrels dig the bulbs out within hours in the borders. They are getting really tall now and everything budding despite Arctic conditions, unfortunately so are the weeds.
Feel more settled this year despite some problems since the new year which I have coped with. Already broke the no sugar rule, as that was my coping mechanism, I will start again on Monday.

Yes we had a lovely chat Babs didn't we. Joey is weary of strangers, but once he knows you is very loving, as he demonstrated resting his head on your lap .

Allsorts yes it's amazing that Babs & I are within walking distance of each other. I've placed my new bird table further up the garden hoping for some lovely little birds, put some fresh food out and monkey nuts for the squirrels; got loads of pidgeons & a magpie . Not even a visit from my beautiful white pigeon. Wasn't sure if it was a pigeon or a Dove, but my friend who came round, looked it up on her app and said it was a rare pigeon!

Hey Allsorts 👋🏽 yes is nice to be near Yogi, wish more of us could live near to each other. Glad you are feeling more settled, I think the turning of the years is unsettling in general. But now we can start looking forward to spring and lots of birds nesting - we have a box in our garden where great tits nest every year. The garden is such a calming and relaxing place. Am with all of you on that.
@Yogi talking of birds, that does look like a dove must be a rare breed of pigeon, haven’t seen one like that. Perhaps someone near you keeps pigeons, I had an uncle who kept them, he really loved his pigeons.
Hope you are still recovering well Whiff. Remember to take things easy. I might sound like your mum 😂 but you know it makes sense.
Love to all 🙏🏾❤️

Yes Whiff, take it easy and before you know it you will be your old self.
Yoga, I am no expert but I have never seen a pigeon that pure white. My garden is full of them, what with the two foxes, one with a limp, magpies and other garden birds, squirrels, other peoples cats, there's no room for me. If I do get a cat most of them will go on holiday, I miss having a cat but wanted to move first but i can never find the place I want.

Morning all

Allsorts It is really hard looking for a new home, Babs is in the same boat as you. I think it needs some luck to come across the home of your dreams and for it to go to purchase. I put an offer on my perfect place, waited 7mnths and then the sellers turned round and said they had decided not to sell after all! . It took me years to find somewhere and actually move, didn't help I had a limited budget and downsizing.

Morning all,
Yes Allsorts as Yogi said we are very much in the same boat, twice let down but still hopeful. We are also downsizing but that doesn’t necessarily mean a more affordable property in Brighton or Lewes, where properties are London prices. Is crazy what people can charge.
Keep looking Allsorts, am sure that like Yogi Whiff and Smiles we’ll get lucky one day 🙏🏾🙏🏾

Afternoon All, bloomin’ freezing here.

I hope that Estrangement gets talked about more in newspapers, on the radio and TV.

Bring it out into the open, shine some light onto it.

For several reasons I’ve thought of;

So people know it’s not always the DP of ACs fault.

So society knows how prevalent it is.

So society knows or comes to understand what the effects of full cut off are.

So we the estranged can start to not feel full shame about it and about talking about it.

It's lovely Babs and Yogin met and Joey of course. I have met 2 from GN in the flesh and got on well. And facetime another one who has become a wonderful friend.

Allsorts and Babs you can swap notes about moving . It's not for the faint hearted but it's well worth it. I didn't know if the neighbours would be nice but the whole road are . Plus a life and brilliant healthcare both which I didn't have before .

Decided to go too my sit fit class on Monday . I started doing my morning exercises on Thursday need to get back to my normal routine. The physios at the hospital asked me if I exercised so told them what I did and what we did at sit fit . So they signed me off as they couldn't do anything else for me. My instructor says she's happy for me to go . But only do what I can. I know my limits.

SparklyGrandma I have always talked about my estrangement and found people told me about what happened to them , relative or friend. I have never felt anyway shame about it. My son decided he didn't want me and our side of the family . I had no choice as he hasn't spoke or seen me since my birthday end of April and then his email 4 days later May . 2020. The shame is his and my daughter in law . I would never hurt someone this why it's cruel and cowardly. If I have a problem with someone I face them . I don't play mind games . After highschool I vowed no one would ever bully me again and I never have . Even my in laws never got to me . But at least my father in law had the guts to tell my I was defective to my face. So we did what we always did if they kicked off we walked out.But the next week we where back. And after my husband died I never gave up on her she had me down as next of kin. I hated her for 40 years but I couldn't turn my back on me when she needed me . Plus she was my husband's mom ,my mother in law and our children's nan.
Both the children and partners never gave up on her as well. Even though she denied she had a son or 2 grandchildren. Daughter in law knew her as they met in 2005 and she died in 2015.

Estranged parents are of course to blame their little darlings could never do anything so horrible . But they do time and time again . But of course we become the villains . It's easy for them they make all the decisions and tell everyone what they want but not the truth . As the truth would shrivel up their tongues. And people would see the real them. And they need to be the victims it's the only way they want to live . So I hope my son and daughter in law love living their ivory tower as one day the cracks will appear.

While I still love my son and my grandsons. I don't want my son in my life because I could never trust him again and he will tell my why he did this . But I know my grandsons are well looked after as they are their world .

So I get on with my life I am lucky I have such a caring daughter and son in law and grandsons who love me and care how I am and always there for me and me them .

@Whiff glad you are going to sit fit class again. Little by little you will reclaim your old routine.
@Sparkly and Whiff, I still can’t talk about my estrangement with people, even friends I have had here for years, which is why is so liberating to be able to come on here and talk about it. Only a few very good friends from my hometown in Lancashire know all about it, those who knew us as a much younger family and have never been able to understand why it happened any more than we do. And of course those on my side of the family whom I am also estranged from know all about it, or think they do, in the past few years some of them have cut off from my estranged daughter as well but they took her side to begin with when I hit rock bottom and I will never forgive it or forget that betrayal.
I just don’t want to explain or justify anything, perhaps I wouldn’t have to, but am afraid as Sparkly says society listens mainly to EACs because they have no worries about having to justify anything, they are mainly believed without hesitation with everyone and their blooming uncle’s dog advising them to cut free, to forget their parents and get on with their lives. And I would add therapists/counsellors to that list.
But EPs are automatically judged and deemed to have done something bad, in most cases is ‘innocent until proven guilty’ but not for an EP is ‘guilty until proven innocent’. And of course we are never innocent.
Our EACs might use the forgive all phrase that they didn’t ask to be born, but then neither did their children - our grandchildren - who didn’t ask to be estranged from loving grandparents either.
Hard to take the moral high ground when they decided to rob their own children of a loving relationship with their own grandparents.
Ah well….is water under the bridge but sometimes I just feel so cross about it all and how unfair it is on all of us.
Take care 🌺🙏🏾

Babs I have felt it's unfair and get not just cross but angry about my son. Realised it may seem strange saying I don't want my son in my life. But my week in hospital not knowing what was going to happen to me . Machines beeping around and realising I was in Afib for days then the pain the injection caused me and inability to get in and out of the bed at the second hospital without help because it didn't go lower enough. Then the angiography and not realising the local or sedation hadn't worked and I felt everything the pain as well as the pushing and pulling. Lying there with my eyes shut crying and tears filling my ears . I didn't want my son to know if I lived or died . Fear can really clarify your thoughts and decide you are worth so much more .

I will never deny I have 2 children and 5 grandson's. But I hope I have another 20 years in me and I don't want that time wasted . I have a life to life for me and my husband. I can't and won't live with what ifs or if onlies . I spent 15 years after my husband died looking after others who needed me . I was 61 when I moved here 66 now and done more in that time since my husband died for me than I did after he died. Some may think it's selfish but my life upto my move involved putting others first and it cost me healthwise . But I am who I am and would do it all again still the same person who cares . But now I need to care about me first.

@whiff doesn’t sound strange that you don’t want your son in your life, especially at such a difficult and worrying time when you needed to concentrate on your own health/wellbeing, and as you say these moments do clarify things in your own mind.
As you know I lost a lifetime friend last year whose daughter was estranged for many years, she knew her mum was dying in a hospice but didn’t come or even send a message, I felt really angry at the time but her DH explained later that this probably would have been the worst thing that could have happened, with the daughter possibly causing trouble and making it all about her.
I never asked my dear friend if she would have wanted her daughter there but her silence on the matter was enough. And like you Whiff she has a wonderful daughter who was there throughout.
I have already stipulated to my daughters and DH that I don’t want my estranged daughter or members of my family I am estranged from including my sister to know if I ever become terribly ill and hospitalised or for them to know when I die. My DH has said the same.
If people we loved and still love despite everything can’t be there when we are well and alive why would we want them tgere when we die?
Oh dear, I suppose this all sounds a bit morbid. But is just how we feel about it all.
Take care estrangees
🌺🌺🙏🏾

Babs not morbid truthful and because of estrangement we have to put things in place and make decisions that we never thought we would make . I changed my will in 2020 as my son will not profit from my death and took out both lasting powers of attorney my daughter and son in law are my attorneys and they know my wishes and should I be unable to make my own decisions I trust them to make them for me.

For the Brits here… The Archers has started a storyline about relationship/ estrangement and how it causes problems within families and friends.