Sons partner dislikes me , now son is very very distant , estranged.

@luminance I don’t think the OP is comparing her son’s partner to other girlfriends but simply trying to say that she hasn’t had any other girlfriend treat her like this. If there was a history of her not getting along with past GFs that would speak to us of sone fault on her part.
As for the partner being on the autistic spectrum, that is a bit of a reach but could be true, however in this case am sure her son would have told his parents this in order for them to accommodate her needs and adjust their expectations of her socially.
Is not the kind of thing you forget to mention and is certainly not taboo in this day and age. Most people are happy to share this information in order for their GF/partner not to feel awkward.

No I don't agree with that, I wouldn't think to myself a person agreeable or disagreeable based on past relationships preferring to judge for myself. So no need to bring the past into this scenario. Find common ground, stick to it and make this work in whatever way is possible or refuse to accept is and get less. Those are generally the prices. I don't see anything wrong with the partner stating she feels uncomfortable and only because pressed by mother and son. Step back, find comfortable.

I agree Babs that the OP's reference to her son's previous girl friends was because she hadn't encountered problems before.

I'm not sure that being autistic would account for criticising someone the way this girl friend has criticised OP.

this particular old saying is trotted out time and time again.
I'll take your word for that, smileless. Can't say I ever noticed it.

A son doesn't stop being a son when he marries or settles down with a partner
Thinking that that's what the adage is saying is taking it literally.

That's the problem Baggs some do take this supposed old Irish proverb literally.

OP I strongly suggest you focus on your son’s connection with you and shift from focusing on his partner.

Mothers have a tendency to blame the other woman every time their relationship with their son changes as if men have no agency or thoughts of themselves. It’s an inherently sexist mentality that pits women against women and paints men as inept, mindless creatures who go from being under the thumb of one woman to another. This is rarely the case outside of biased perspectives, and it oversimplifies the fact that parents often have these expectations that their relationships with their sons/daughters aren’t supposed to change over the years. All relationships evolve. It’s not necessarily a bad thing. Sometimes they expect the partners to simply blend into their family relationship dynamics the partners simply aren’t interested in joining, but neglect the fact that this expectation is also inherently selfish.

The objective truth of these type of relationship shifts are almost always much more nuanced than “he changed when he met a girl, therefore the girls is bad for him”.

It can be hard to communicate to your parent with whom you are close that you want a bit of space, or that you don’t want to share some details of your partner with them. If I were your son I would have probably done a better job at simply stating you and she are simply different people or that she was/is frustrated with something he didn’t want to speak on, but his own immaturity likely made him grasp at reasons to share. Young couples often need the space to find their own footing. Some mums either give it reluctantly or frame it as an affront to themselves. I also find that men pass the buck a lot onto their partners when they themselves cannot simply communicate to their mums how they really feel.

If you aren’t fully estranged, take heart. It may not be the relationship you imagined, but you have him and the children.

Luminance

No I don't agree with that, I wouldn't think to myself a person agreeable or disagreeable based on past relationships preferring to judge for myself. So no need to bring the past into this scenario. Find common ground, stick to it and make this work in whatever way is possible or refuse to accept is and get less. Those are generally the prices. I don't see anything wrong with the partner stating she feels uncomfortable and only because pressed by mother and son. Step back, find comfortable.

I really, really love this. Such a positive, thoughtful outlook

As a woman myself I do find it hard at times myself BlessedArt to understand at times why women treat each other rather badly. Your comment highlighted to me how we only seem to see daughter is bad and estranged from mother, DIL is bad and now son is estranged from mother. That seems a rather strange trend indeed does it not? Where are the sons who estranged for themselves?

We can only ever talk about our own experience of estrangement, and if that experience is where the relationship with a son or daughter was good until they married or settled down with a partner, then that's what has happened.

Coercive control happens and it's because it happens that it became a recognised criminal offence under the Serious Crime Act 2015.

Anyone who believes that when a mother says her relationship with her son nose dived when he married/settled down with a partner, is being inherently sexist, pitting women against women and painting men as inept, mindless creatures who go from being under the thumb of one woman to another are not just being grossly insensitive those who have experienced this, but are also showing a lack of knowledge of estrangement and its causes.

This is not rarely the case BlessedArt but even if it were, that's not to say that anyone posting here on GN who says this is their experience, isn't one of those 'rare' cases.

I also find it hard at times Luminance to understand at times why women treat each other rather badly.

Perhaps someone can explain Smile less2012 why it is that a son doesn't seem to get the blame for his estrangement? Why is the woman always to blame? It is rather hard to not see that trend now it is highlighted.

I can only speak for myself Luminance when I say that of course our son is blamed. We are his parents and regardless of how much pressure he may have been subjected too, and what that pressure may have entailed if not for his compliance, the estrangement would never have taken place.

You ask Why is the woman always to blame? but that doesn't appear to be a concern of yours when it's the mother or m.i.l. who is being blamed.

About 6% of the population are estranged from mother, but more boys sever contact with fathers. I would assume its a wide range of reasons, no one should judge as don’t know the ins and outs. I have two friends who once their son married, broke contact with parents despite being fine until wedding and had getting on well before. I don't know anyone estranged from their daughter though.

Also know some interfering mother's whose children are very much still involved in each other’s lives. Just be kind to those who for whatever reason are abandoned by children.

It is absolutely true that men are not held responsible for maintaining their own familial relationships. It is seen as a woman's job to maintain it, so women are blamed when it goes wrong. The truth is, if a man's relationships are so easily controlled by a woman, maybe he is comfortable that way and chooses not to take responsibility. I have a theory about how that happens.

Treat your son like an adult and stop blaming other people for his own choices, or for the choices you made raising him.

Sometimes an abusive person can control the relationships of their partner, but some would do well not to project their own experiences onto this in such a confident way. Assume he's an adult with a mind of his own and act accordingly. Otherwise you just look jealous. I see no reason to suspect abuse from the partner here, and assuming that is occuring will destroy the relationship between parent and adult child. Maybe he wants a less involved relationship with his parent and that's a normal and healthy thing to want.

I don't get the impression that the OP is accusing her son's partner of abuse, not sure how you came to that conclusion.
And 'yes' the son could be at fault but seeing as the OP was told
that her son's partner doesn't like her with various rather superficial reasons given am pretty sure that it isn't just down to the son. Reading the thread back a bit will give you a bit more info.

Smileless2012

I can only speak for myself Luminance when I say that of course our son is blamed. We are his parents and regardless of how much pressure he may have been subjected too, and what that pressure may have entailed if not for his compliance, the estrangement would never have taken place.

You ask Why is the woman always to blame? but that doesn't appear to be a concern of yours when it's the mother or m.i.l. who is being blamed.

You mentioned pressure, from his spouse? Why would that be?

OP, you say your son tells you he's "flat out". Can you not just accept that he's very busy and probably tired a good deal? Just applying Occam's razor to the "flat out" comment should give you some sense that it's not about you.

I hope you find some ease now and that things generally improve over time.

I suggest you read up about coercive control Luminance and the role that control and manipulation plays in some estrangements if you want information about spousal pressure.

I agree Babs with regard to the OP's son especially as the reasons her d.i.l. has given for not liking her appear to be rather spurious.

This so sad for you, Jogr. I hope the relationship with the young couple eases as time goes by, as it did for us. Our DiL really hated our family and refused to come to our 30th wedding anniversary party. But eventually she became quite affectionate towards us.
I found that light-hearted e-mail and later WhatsApp messages, no too frequent, also genuine interest in her work, made a difference. I think so, anyway. Also, the fact that she was and is married to a truly lovely man! And knows it.

Smileless2012

I suggest you read up about coercive control Luminance and the role that control and manipulation plays in some estrangements if you want information about spousal pressure.

I agree Babs with regard to the OP's son especially as the reasons her d.i.l. has given for not liking her appear to be rather spurious.

Ah but you see I was asking about situations where the son is blamed and the "pressure" you mention as well as "coercive control" does rather suggest you blame your DIL even if some of that is allocated towards your son too. So not what I asked. Do carry on, perhaps better examples will come.

I know what you were asking Luminance which is why if you are really interested in how coercive control can be a factor in estrangement, I suggest you read up on the subject.

You might even find some better examples.

Jogr

Thankyou , yes she has come from a very different family. The sad thing is it seems my son has lost all his values morals and teaching of his up bringing, has gone his partners way .

Obviously your daughter in law comes from a family with different social norms to yourselves ( the baby welcoming party)
She’s young, she’s pregnant. Perhaps she felt intimidated by your family. I’m not saying intentionally.

That was 5 years ago petra so however old the OP's d.i.l. was then, she's 5 years older now and has two children of her own.

It either is not of a son choosing to estrange for himself or it is not an example of a mother acknowledging that it was a sons choice because of the use of "coercive control" and "pressure". So when doesn't the woman by virtue of being either the daughter or DIL get implicated in fault? Rather a simple question and one that needs analysing to help people avoid estrangement I would say.

Luminance

It either is not of a son choosing to estrange for himself or it is not an example of a mother acknowledging that it was a sons choice because of the use of "coercive control" and "pressure". So when doesn't the woman by virtue of being either the daughter or DIL get implicated in fault? Rather a simple question and one that needs analysing to help people avoid estrangement I would say.

Perhaps we should just address the OP who has already stated that her son’s partner has admitted to disliking her, which kind of helps the whole analysing of the situation along.
Just a thought.

I agree Babs, the issue for the OP is that her d.i.l. doesn't like her and it appears that this dislike has impacted on the relationship she has with her son, and how often she sees her GC.