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Bereavement wipes out everything
I feel like my relationship with my daughter since she reached out is tenous. All trust is gone with me, but she reached out because she personally and professionally burned bridges. We were receptive, she is our daughter. She made some devestatingly bad decisions that had severe consequences. She appeared to have it all and now must start over. She used people, discarded them and repeated the cycle. Then she did it to the wrong people. I think professionally she may not recover at all. She will be able to work and make a living. But she won't be living in a mansion again anytime soon.
So it's like living with a ghost. I am her mother so even though I don't feel she has any love or warmth towards me or any of her former family and friends that she dumped, I know she's at her lowest so I am supportive. Her father and I worry she will commit suicide as she has alluded to. But she is careful to always say she doesn't have a plan and it was yesterday's thoughts so we don't send in the troops. And she has started therapy. But unfortunately with a therapist who tells her that her entitled behavior is not a bad thing. This entitled behavior is what helped get her in this mess to begin with.
Her father and I agonized over what parenting mistakes we made to cause such a drastic personality change in her mid to late 20's. We were a close family. Lots of fun, lots of laughs, we never abused her. We were her biggest supporters in life. But she dumped us, and most of her friends and family who weren't wealthy and ambitious.
I learned that the prescription stimulants use she dabbled in during college was not a fleeting thing. She never stopped taking them. She did confide in me at that time that she was using them to get through finals and how easy it was to find an online doctor to prescribe them. She does not and never had ADHD. So it was and is prescription drug abuse I believe that changed her. I disapproved of course, but gently. She was an adult at that time and she could talk to me about anything. We were close like that so I was blindsided when she dumped us and created a life with corporate sharks and what we believed to be very selfish people.
She acted so much like my mother and sister who many people call narcissists that I believed it was genetics. I still think that has a part, but I think abusing prescription stimulants which can cause impulsivity and lack of empathy was perhaps the main reason for her personality change. And drinking wine at night to come down from it all to sleep. Now she takes prescription sleeping pills to do this. And still drinks wine as well.
My daughter still takes no accountability for her actions and how they hurt other people. I hope in time she views things differently. She doesn't understand why she could not walk back into everyone's lives after years of absence and not be welcomed back with open arms. Everyone is cordial but they don't trust her and have moved on.
She takes shots at me because whe believes I am the barrier that keeps her old friends and family from inviting her over. I've never said a harsh word about her and these people have come to their own decisions about having a relationship with her.
She told me she was cruel to me, and I think that is the best she can do to address the way she demonized and lied about her childhood. She lost a lot of friends when she started that because they knew the truth and thought she had changed. It's not an apology but at least it shows some self reflection.
I really hoped hitting rock bottom would help her change back into being an empathatic and caring person. But as long as she abuses prescription drugs and alcohol I don't think it will. And I don't think her therapist or anyone in the medical community will address this issue because she has a prescription.
Thanks for listening to my story. I live on the edge of being supportive to a daughter who is not the daughter I know, while worrying about her still. Hubby and I talk about it and we agree to accept that she is not fully with us in heart and spirit, and acts like she is only interested in herself that she still needs support.
I miss the daughter I raised and loved for decades. I don't like the person she has become. But if ever a person needed the love of a mother and father she is the one. So it's hard. But we at least know that if and when she creates a new tribe of like minded people she will dump us again and we are okay with that while still sad about it. Just gotta get her through this part of her life.
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Portrait, I am sorry that you came on here for support and it's been high jacked.
Getting of prescribed drugs is so difficult but would be a little easier if your d did not drink alcohol, no doubt you have tried to stop her but could you in one of her quieter moments to say no drinking in the house to start with.
I do not know any way you can get through this but one day at a time and you and your husband get out and take breaks from it all. Is there nothing your d can channel her energy into. Close family member has BPD. Family all distanced from him but he is slowly improving as he has found an activity he likes and is good at and that helps enormously, a rule that once he gets angry I leave, not for good but until he realises he was out of order. He can never bring back the lost years and I just want him happy. Hope you find away through all this.
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Thank you Portrait
.
There's no need for you to defend yourself here. It's obvious from this thread and from previous posts that you love your D, have done your best to be there for her and help her in the past, and continue to do so. If anyone is unable to see that, that is there problem not yours.
Like Allsorts and I'm sure others, I'm sorry that your thread has been hijacked and hope that you have found at least some support and comfort here.
Parenting is never easy, and even harder when you're trying to break the cycle of abuse. You and your DH have done so, not everyone can so the cycle of childhood abuse continues.
Please feel free to pm me anytime. Take care, stay strong and be kind to yourself
x
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I really appreciate this balance Smileless.
I had hoped the OP might message me as I have been in a similar situation myself for years now and offered my support privately.
Progress is slow, but we are moving in the right direction as a family and have gained a great deal of strength and growth from it.
I think looking from the outside the issues seem simple, but when you are in the maelstrom it takes over your previous way of seeing things, and change in all parties involved is painful but certainly achievable, even in small ways.
I do think this thread became predictably negative and even abusive towards OP, which is why I responded initially in the way I did.
Whilst this site is helpful for many, I have learned that some topics are incredibly sensitive and trigger often unpleasant and quite ill-considered responses from people.
I hope that it an end to it now but just wanted to pop by and say it was good to read your post this morning.
I'm an EAC and generally agree with the people who are called trolls here.
However, I suggest that the person making new accounts repeatedly to post on these threads seeks help. This is an exercise in futility, and it doesn't represent other EAC well at all. The fact is that no one will change their mind from being called a bad parent on a forum like this. They are seeking validation, not advice. They aren't looking to change. There's a reason why No Contact is the best method in these situations. Talking about it doesn't help resolve it. Change is not possible for many people.
The repeated new accounts (along with whatever absurd explanation you have for that) gives the appearance of being obsessive and it's clear you have little control over when and how you interact with this forum. It's not healthy. Please seek professional help with safer outlets for your frustration.
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Thank you keepingquiet.
It's good to know that you're making progress and doing so slowly is usually more beneficial than rushing in. As long as there's a desire from all concerned, I totally agree that change and eventual reconciliation is indeed achievable.
unpleasant and quite ill-considered responses from people are sadly not uncommon on the estrangement forum and although of course it's not for everyone, there's never any excuse for what EP's are sometimes subjected too.
Accusations that we seek only validation rather than advice are ridiculous as are assumptions that if you're estranged you must have done something to deserve it.
Thankfully in my experience tarring all EAC with the same brush and judging them based on our own experiences isn't what EP's do.
We post about our personal experiences which some EAC do too and when that's the case, EP's and EAC are able to listen to one another with a compassionate and non judgemental attitude.
IamAI
I'm sorry, I didn't mean for my post/revelations to drop anyone into such murky waters, at least not without a solution to get out.
If anyone thinks they can relate to my parents experience than they should re-evaluate their relationship with Shame.
Because you sincerely have an unhealthy obsession with Shame that's preventing you from admitting any faults and growing as a person (one that their child would openly love).
The origin of that unhealthy obsessive relationship with Shame can come from a lot of sources. Personally, for me it was because my parents demanded perfection. They shamed me for any flaws I had or mistakes I made.
They weren't mature enough to have a meaningful, productive talk about anything in life. So they used Shame as a cudgel to mold me into what they wanted.
As you, in previous names, never found a solution as much, it’s fairly pointless for you to be offering advice.
Endless psycho-babble websites, links and pods, aren’t really a solution. 🤷♀️
A very reasonable post User138562, and good advice to the individual you're referring to, but I don't think people posting here are necessarily seeking validation. Some may be, but there are a multitude of other reasons, some motivated by sadness, some by shock and disbelief, others genuinely hoping for solutions. Most are willing to engage with a range of responses.
Seeking "validation" implies guilt or blame again, and doesn't apply in many, perhaps most, cases.
Perhaps something else is going on in the world of estrangement and intergenerational conflict, not explained by universal "bad parenting". DiamondLily’s final sentence above is a possible clue.
What have I walked into? I've read 2 things on this forum and one is an "estranged parent" on multiple accounts upsetting people and one is an "estranged child" on multiple accounts upsetting people. Both look like they are really going through it and not coping at all well.
Really
whose the EP on multiple accounts upsetting people NiceDream?
Unless you were present in the therapy sessions you don’t know exactly what the therapist has said.
The OP will know what her D's told her the therapist has said which may or may not be true.
Not to mention that therapists love to look for problems where there aren't any since they need to make money and they seem to love tearing families apart. It makes better clients if they don't have their family talking sense to them.
Therapists do what? They have waiting lists, I don't think they need to do that... People generally come to them because they have a problem already.
I have just finished listening to a Tortoise Investigates Podcast called Dangerous Memories. It is a very strange but, having been on this site a while, quite fascinating case involving a bogus therapist and parental estrangement/alienation/alleged abuse.
There are indeed some very strange people out there...
I've come across this before keepingquiet; false memories implanted by bogus therapists and controlling partners.
It's particularly disturbing to think of someone whose looking for help from a therapist being used in this way. There are indeed some very strange people out there and some very sick ones too
.
DiamondLily
I think we can love family members, but not like them or their behaviour at times.
All pretty normal. 🤷♀️
I agree and what one is really saying is “I love you but I don’t like how you act”
I feel empathy for the OP and wish her and her daughter luck 
RedWing
Not to mention that therapists love to look for problems where there aren't any since they need to make money and they seem to love tearing families apart. It makes better clients if they don't have their family talking sense to them.
My daughter is currently seeing a therapist l, who is nothing like you describe, she has not created false memories, she has a waiting list which is really long, she has focused my mentally unwell daughter on looking at herself, how her actions affect herself and others. My daughter has made, and is making, great progress.
0neLastNote
Why parents would do that isn't up to me to decide (but it's usually because they view children as a gift, and the joy is in seeing them grow into a successful, morally upright person. Even if they never get a mothers/fathers day card in the entire process).
But what I can be deterministic about is the dynamic and nature of parent/child relationships.
The bottom line here is:
No-one forced you to have kids.
If you aren't ready to give your 110% (as in, go above and beyond) to your kid while expecting absolutely nothing in return (zilch, 0%); than simply don't take that deal (as in, don't have kids).
Because unlike the choice you had to raise children, that child had no choice what-so-ever to be raised by you (or to even be placed on this planet or not).
So it's incredibly messed up to create a whole new life while expecting something, anything, in return from them.
If you're lonely, bored, or just need attention & affection, than get a dog; not a human child.
Agree
It's good that your D's making progress Cossy and I hope she continues to do so.
IamAI
Caleo
Yes I would. I can love someone warts and all.
Caleo's viewpoint is emotionally contradictory.
Love without liking suggests affection without respect, fondness without connection.
If someone consistently dislikes who you are, their "love" lacks warmth, empathy, and relational depth.
True love involves both care and a baseline of liking the person — not just tolerating them.
*Without that, it feels hollow, not whole.*
^Love is not love which alters when it alteration finds,
Or bends with the remover to remove^
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