I hate my DIL and I don’t say that lightly!

Oh gosh how horrid for you.
We have a similar DiL but my DS has realised how she has been abusing him for 11 years and has decided to split. He feels very guilty as children are involved but he needs to do this for his own and their welfare,
There are a lot of manipulative women out there it would seem.

I hope you can sort something out with your son so you can see the children again.

It's one of those situations where you are lost for words and caught on the hop by a manipulator.
Next time you see or speak to your son - I'd be asking if DIL if she would be happy to drop GC off before she starts work - you'd be happy help then!!

Hi Swampy1961, I was about to say ‘we are three hours away!’ Then I reread your comment and appreciated the sarcasm!

Thanks dragonfly46, one of the hardest things is knowing there is no good outcome for our son. If he tries to maintain our relationship she will make his life so difficult but if he leaves her she will destroy him! [cry]

Tell them (calmly and quietly) that you plan to change your wills unless you are included in the children's lives as their GPs, and that you intend to leave your assets to a charity. OK it is manipulative but no more so than DIL's tactics and behaviour. But be prepared for it not to work.

From reading MN she seems to be a common type, weaponising 'her' children and setting rules for 'he'd house, once they have a ring through his nose all he is is a sperm donor and a walking wallet. She's set for life, or at least until they're 18.

But that’s blackmail Quercus and will make things so much worse if I had a mother in law tell me that, I d probably pull away completely
Surely it’s about trying to find some common ground

I don’t really understand her request ?
If she wants your husband (not you) to have the youngest child for a day a week and it’s a 3 hour trip to get there how is he possibly going to be there in time for her to go to work, he d have to leave in the middle of the night ? It all sounds unrealistic

It’s a terrible shame it’s come to this, stay as close as you can to your son and just wait, I hope you get to see the grandchildren soon.

I am curious. Did you do their housework for them?

I am very sorry for your situation; I have two friends with similar destructive daughters-in -law who use their children as bargaining chips; both husbands are too weak to stand up to them and do not realise these women are also destroying their careers. They, obviously, do not work.
The latest request for child care sounds a very deliberate attempt to destroy your relationship by demanding something you cannot provide. Your son, sorry to say, is a fool , but try to maintain contact, however slight. The grandchildren, in both cases above, have resumed contact with their grandparents as they have grown older, built on happy memories,and also on the parents' need for financial support; one salary is not enough.Don't disinherit your grandchildren, but quietly rewrite your wills with regard to their parents. One DiL told her children that Granny had been stealing her money, which is why they no longer saw her.

'don't disinherit'

I don't think you can get past them. You just have to go 'vanilla' and send gifts for birthday, Christmas, speak to your son about non events and try to keep the connection going. These prima donnas seem to rule the current world we live in. My daughter works with a dance troupe of them and they spend their life in the office stroking hots cups of tea, talking about their kids, dogs, and the menopause and hardly produce any work. It drives her nuts.

DIL is a drama queen and has been getting away with it far too long, you need to speak to your son about his thoughts.
As for childcare traveling 3 hours is obviously not practical it would be cheaper to pay for childcare, so if you have the cash thats one solution.
I can't help thinking that your son would be better off without her, even if it means her taking the children away, she will bleed him dry. In the long term that will probably happen anyway.
One of my nephews is in the same situation, his mother (granny) is exasperated with DIL who was as difficult as possible in the divorce. The divorce is settled son gets a share of custody so granny does see the GC.

Btw my son’s solicitor has told him that the family courts now look at the wife’s coercive behaviour and rule in favour of the man. If nothing else she will have to get a job!

I’m so sorry this is happening to you. We had similar, it took our son 20 years to divorce, by which time the children were adults, we lived close by so still saw the children but not as much as we would have liked.
Let’s hope it doesn’t take your son that long to see the light. Sorry I have no advice, only to say there’s only your son that can change things I doubt very much she’ll change. Just awful.

My elder brothers wife has always been very manipulative.It caused my mum such heartbreak and us as well as at one stage we didn’t see the children.

Fast forward many years and the children don’t see them but are in touch with us and we meet up several times a year.My brother has never met one of his grandchildren but we have and my lovely niece takes her to visit mum.

My brother is heartbroken at the situation and literally cannot see that his wife has caused the issues.He says to me he doesn’t understand why people don’t want to see her.The children have seen him a few times but she now won’t let him meet them without her.

Such sad situations for all concerned.Dragonfly your son has shown amazing courage, I am sure it is very hard for him.I wish my brother had done the same.

TerfGran💐

Hello TerfGran and welcome to the estrangement forum here on GN but I'm sorry that you need to be here .

I agree with eaybee that this situation has been deliberately orchestrated by your d.i.l. so she has a 'reason' for keeping you from your GC and disrupting your relationship with your son; it's what people like her do. Unfortunately, their weak partners enable them; our estranged son included.

The children become collateral damage in these situations losing the relationship they had or could have had with GP's, and one worries about the extent of their mother's manipulative control on them as they grow especially as their father's weakness will in all likelihood prevent them being protected from it.

SpinDriftCoastal's advice about going 'vanilla' is good. Sending cards and gifts for birthdays and at Christmas maintains a degree of contact and if you're instigating any and all contact with your son, I suggest pulling back and doing so less frequently as well as keeping any communication superficial.

I agree with Susan Dragonfly, that your son was very courageous extricating himself from that abusive relationship and setting a good example to his children that coercive control is wrong.

We've been estranged from our youngest son and only GC for more than 13 years and as heart breaking as that is, at least we don't have to have anything to do with his awful wife.

This sounds so sad, am really sorry this is happening to you both, also am sorry for what has happened to you Smileless2012, I cannot even imagine how painful this must be.
Try as much as poss to see your GCs with your son and as has been said about going ‘vanilla’ just keep up with the minimum of contact keeping your DiL at arms length.
Don’t engage in any tit for tat dialogue which your DiL will probably enjoy because she gets to be melodramatic again and blame you for everything.
Wishing you both all the best with this.

I'm curious as to why she's requested Grandpa's and not grandma, or both ti look after the child?
Also, what about suggesting they drop the child off at yours...

I am sorry to hear of your situation, TerfGran, and sadly, your DIL holds all of the cards in this " game".
I would add my support for the gentle approach, maintaining contact, but keeping a low profile.
This worked for an acquaintance of mine, and some reasonably cordial relationships have been re- established.
I hope that things improve, not just for you, but for your GC .

Quercus

Tell them (calmly and quietly) that you plan to change your wills unless you are included in the children's lives as their GPs, and that you intend to leave your assets to a charity. OK it is manipulative but no more so than DIL's tactics and behaviour. But be prepared for it not to work.

Please don’t ever consider this.
You would be stooping to her level.

Sago

Quercus

Tell them (calmly and quietly) that you plan to change your wills unless you are included in the children's lives as their GPs, and that you intend to leave your assets to a charity. OK it is manipulative but no more so than DIL's tactics and behaviour. But be prepared for it not to work.

Please don’t ever consider this.
You would be stooping to her level.

I agree. It's the exact tactic my mother used to use on me and it only drove us further apart. I can truly sympathise with the OP, as my ex-DIL was extremely narcissistic and manipulative. We almost lost our grandchild because of her actions and at that time, I truly hated her - and I also don't say that lightly. I've learned to let that hatred go now though, but it took a long time. Fortunately our grandchild has lived with my son ever since then and we rarely if ever have anything to do with her. I hope the OP can find some way of being able to see her grandchildren. It's unfair on them too not to let them see their grandmother.

We've had this in our lives for over thirty years since he met her, leading to not seeing him for almost thirteen years. No grandchildren so don't have to placate her in any way, thank goodness.

I should add when we did see him it had always been in an on/off relationship with him due to her selfish attitude to us, his family.

Manipulative and coercive partners cause chaos in families. I just don't understand why anyone wants to control anyone else, and tell them who they can talk to/see.

But, for every manipulator, there is a partner unwilling to stand up to them, which is cowardly. 🤷‍♀️

I understand coercion and manipulation, as my ex tried it with me for many years.

But, I was having none of it, and got the last word when I served him with divorce papers. 👍😉

It's puzzling that your DIL expected you to do her housework and babysitting when you live 3 hours away from them. Why did they move 3 hours away from you, bearing in mind how much you were needed? If it was for your son's work, that's understandable, presumably your DIL doesn't work, as no childcare. How much do you love your home and surroundings? Maybe for the sake of your happiness and regaining the emotional and physical closeness of having your son and grandchildren in your lives, you would consider moving to live closer to them? You don't have to have a close relationship with your daughter-in-law, who sounds absolutely awful, but as your son's wife and your grandchildren's mother, sadly you'll just have to put up with her. At least, if you lived close by, your grandchildren would have you as support, because she probably treats them in a controlling way too and it would be good for them to have somewhere to escape to when needed. That is what I would do, I couldn't bear to be separated from my son and grandchildren. Good luck 💐