Low fibre diet?

AlieOxon Why are you reducing fibre so drastically? Is this a medical recommendation? Is it both soluble and insoluble fibre?

If I did that I would never go again!

I can't take as much fibre as I used to because of slight diverticulitis - seeds and nuts are particularly difficult. It drives me mad when a certain relative says:'but they're good for you'. They really are not good for me! It's trial and error for me, but the errors can be painful.

I take Fibogel it is really good - I don't think cutting out fibre altogether is a good thing. Do try that as it is very gentle and not unpleasant.

allie has been suffering and having a lot of treatment in that department lately absent
Trouble is there are 3 kinds of fibre
1. woody, branny, abrasive insoluble roughage. Wholemeal, nuts, husks, peel etc
2. cellulose - often referrred to as insoluble fibre as well. Think wallpaper paste. Gloopy smooth absorbent. Non-digestible vegetable matter would be a better description. Stewed apple, strawberry smoothie that kind of thing.
3. soluble fibre - bit like the cellulose but digestible (at least by gut bacteria) - breaks down into useful fatty acids etc. supposedly good for you heart etc

So some people's insides might be very irritated by 1 but very happy with 2 and 3.

Thanks, Jess, I think that about sums me up!

Juicing is a good way to get the nutrients without the fibre Alie.

JessM I know about different types of fibre – nutrition is one of my areas of professional expertise. However, I didn't know about AlieOxon's problems. I didn't mean to be intrusive. Apologies for tiresome questions Alie.

It's funny how received wisdom on fibre in diet in UC (ulcerative colitis) has changed over the decades. DH has gone from recommendations of very low fibre in the 70's and 80's to something much more normal - fruit, green veg, porridge, stewed fruit etc, but nothing on earth will make him like "bread with bits in it"!

Sorry I was not lecturing you on fibre absent - meant as a general input to the conversation. They are not well named are they. Or well labelled on foods.

What foods are soluble fibre?

I am sure that our digestive system is still geared to a stone age diet. Which must mean loads of fibrus foods. I remember reading somewhere that in Africa a traditional diet may mean most meals of brown type rice or equivalent cereal. This means that one would poo perhaps 4 times a day, but bowel cancer is barely known.

JessM I am also interested in which foods are soluble fibre? I need to keep my heart as healthy as I possibly can.

Here is a list from a kind wikipaedia author: A FEW COMMENTS IN CAPS FROM ME

Soluble fiber is found in varying quantities in all plant foods, including:
legumes (peas, soybeans, lupins and other beans) (I AM WONDERING ABOUT THE HUSKS OF THE LEGUMES - ARE THEY INSOLUBLE?)
oats, rye, chia, and barley (AGAIN THEY HAVE INSOLUBLE AS WELL IN THEM )
some fruits and fruit juices (including prune juice, plums, berries, bananas, and the insides of apples and pears)
certain vegetables such as broccoli, carrots, and Jerusalem artichokes
root tubers and root vegetables such as sweet potatoes and onions (skins of these are sources of insoluble fiber also)

psyllium seed husk (a mucilage soluble fiber) and flax seeds
THESE Seeds ALSO HAVE LOTS OF INSOLUBLE - BUT THEY SWELL UP DRAMATICALLY IN WATER - BECAUSE THEY CONTAIN CELLULOSE

ONE DRAW BACK ABOUT THE TRULY SOLUBLE FIBRES IS THAT WHEN GUT BACTERIA DIGEST THEM, GAS CAN BE PRODUCED, AS IN BEANS, BROCCOLI AND JERUSALEM ARTICHOKES.

Sources of insoluble fiber include:
whole grain foods
wheat and corn bran
legumes such as beans and peas
nuts and seeds
potato skins
lignans
vegetables such as green beans, cauliflower, zucchini (courgette), celery, and nopal
some fruits including avocado, and unripe bananas
the skins of some fruits, including kiwifruit and tomatoes[6]

If you were to cut out all the cellulose (e.g. if you juiced everything) then you might be very constipated. It absorbs water and softens the stools. I think fybogel is mainly cellulose with flavourings added.
Back to me again now in lower case. I guess it is a case of trying out peeled and de-seeded fruits, veg etc to find what suits. Smoothies maybe?

Juicing will not cut out all cellulose. ALL plant cell walls contain cellulose, even the cells from the 'flesh' of the plant. We cannot digest cellulose. Its use in the gut is to absorb water.

However, my mother avoids the skins and seeds of plant foods. She is able to eat the flesh of tomatoes, for instance, and grapes, but not the skins or seeds. She can also eat broad or butter beans with the skins taken off.

Looks as if it's something in the outer casings/skins, rather than cellulose, that's the problem. Perhaps the psyllium that jess mentions.

Unless I've misunderstood juicing (LIKELY!). I was thinking of blending. Duh.
Still, my mum can eat blended stuff, even with all the gunk she usually avoids. It's all very weird.

Juicing is a way of extracting the juice and leaving most of the fibre behind - you squash the cells, and leave the cellulose cell wall behind bags.
psyllium is a seed like flax that contains lots of cellulose that swells up in water. if you want to see the effect bags get a packet of cress seeds, and watch what happens when they absorb water. Fascinating to see a layer of jelly stuff appear. You may have noticed this before I think. The psyllium husks are the fibrous outer coating of a seed that swell up like this inside you.

Yes, I have seen that with some seeds. I think it was DD1 who was soaking some seeds prior to trying to sprout them, and I noticed they'd just turned into a jelly-like mass. I forget what she thought they were, alfalfa maybe.

Next question: so why do some people have a problem with cellulose, since we don't digest it anyway, and if it just absorbs water in the gut and then passes through?

jessM Re the gas causing vegetables. I am vegetarian and eat plentiful quantities of beans and pulses, onions and all other veg, without any real problems with gas.

I think that might be because I eat them so regularly I have plenty of the right gut bacteria to deal with them do you have any ideas about this theory?

Sorry I didn't get back yesterday!
Jess thanks for coming in here. Yes, I have ulcerative colitis, and quite frustrating it is too. I am still experimenting, but have improved things a lot with diet. Mostly I feel a lot better - I am not doing all the doctors tell me!

All my previous good intentions with granary bread and lots of veg seem to have backfired on me.....however it may be that I took too much ibuprofen last year when I broke my wrist....not proven, though...

Had a booklet on low fibre from a dietitian, but my insides don't seem to agree with all of what it says!
I can eat avocado and also bananas that are still fairly hard, I don't like them sweet/really ripe.
Bags I eat tomatoes and fruit like your mum.
Jess your type 1 is definitely what I must avoid.
Type 2 - wouldn't strawberry smoothie have seeds in it?

I am still planning to grow broad beans again next year but to eat only the little still soft ones, this is what I did with the runners.

Commercial smoothies I think are filtered. But I am not sure. Something as small as strawberry pips may get blended up. But if it is fruit with bigger stones they would definitely be removed. I have stopped buying them a DH was glugging them by the half pint and they do contain a lot of sugar (which he does not need).
I guess in general peel everything. Remove pips. Shell those broad beans like the Spanish do.(not just the pods the individual shells). Eat younger more tender veg that is less woody.
Don't beat yourself up Allie. It may be nothing to do with previous diet or ibuprofen consumption. It is an imbalance of your immune system in your gut, and I don't think anyone knows what causes it. Just like they don't know what causes arthritis - unwanted inflammation in the joints. etc. The immune system in the gut is incredibly complex and usually manages to keep a delicate balance - reacting to things that are dangerous and ignoring things that are not, including foods and gut bacteria.
I don't know whether people are intolerant of pure cellulose. It is often recommended medically in the form of the dreaded fybogel as a stool softener.
Glad to hear you are a lot better than you were!
Glad you are a fart free zone nelliemoser. Everyone's gut bacteria are a unique blend so 2 people can eat the same meal and one is fine but has to wear a gas mask because the other is not.
Jerusalem Artichokes are the acid test though...

Did I hear once that the flesh of tomatoes has a lot of soluble fibre? Not the seds, obviously!

Well it is made of plant cells so it will have a fair amount of cellulose type fibre