HOLIDAYS

we must be very bad people because we have NEVER taken a grandparent on hoilday with us my mother was widowed for 12 years and although I looked after her ,cooking and shopping etc and saw her every day we holidayed with our kids or alone ,same with my mother in law who is coming up to 11 years widowed ,she comes and stays with us for a week every coupld e of months but not on holiday with us .Mum in law goes on holiday with friends she's met at her groups,knitting group,exercise group ,and two others that escape me.They go to places in this country or abroad for a week or so three times a year .That might be your solution .My sister in law took her father in law with them once and he expected to be taken every year after that and rather than say no they took him ,but it wasn't what they wanted,you should never expect your kids to bow to your wishes.The child care is a seperate thing and shouldn't be lumped in as it just muddies the water,you are in danger of balckmailing her over the childcare so she'll include you in her FAMILY holiday and thats not right.

DD has made it clear that it is very inconvenient for me to take up hospital appointments, weekends away, hair appointmemts if it impacts on childcare, and I have to admit I feel dreadfully guilty if I let her down in this way. Holidays are the worst as I have to go to dd's house as she doesn't like waking the children early on their holidays to come to my house!

You then go on to say that all this is an undercurrent to the main problem, holidays.

I have to disagree and say that your daughter treating you like hired-help (probably unpaid) is the main problem. I feel sorry at the way you are being treated, and it's another example of grandparents being expected to be full-on childminders.

presumably the money you GAVE was a gift so its up to them how they spend it ,they didn't squander their money, they made over their home you should be pleased for them

We all feel left out at times and this is one of them yes I think she is hiding it from you out of not wanting to hurt you . However my husband and I go through this regularly with our boys as we feel second best over e years over certain things that have occurred. We now just do our own thing and they fit in around us as I suppose you did when husband was alive doing holidays etc together,I feel for you I really do x

If we give or loan money or do childcare for our family it should be because we want to, not because we hope they will take us on holiday with them or reward us in some other way. I'm sure your daughter included you before as a last 'swansong' goodbye to a place you and your husband loved and not because she intended on sharing holidays with you every year afterwards. Did you take your parents or parents in law on holiday with you every year?

I love going on singles holidays since my divorce and have travelled all over the world and no way would I want to holiday with my daughter and her family as I see them all the time back home. Perhaps you could try another singles holiday. 'Just You' specialise in that sort of holiday. You may meet someone you can befriend and go on holiday with in the future. I know that happens a lot because when I go on singles holidays there are women there who have met on previous holidays and decided to travel together.

Of course, it is sad that you thought life would turn out differently but now you need to plan your life in another direction. It's what can happen, I'm afraid, which is why it's always better to have outside interests and friends within a marriage so that you can fall back on them if you find yourself on your own.

Such a difficult time, you not only have lost your husband but your life style.

Was bad your daughter wasn't honest with you but it seems for her it must have been very difficult to discuss this with you. You are also finding it difficult to tell her about her child care demands. If you reflect on this maybe you could find ways of you both being a bit more honest with one another but in an open kind manner.

How old are GC. When they start school you will be able to have more free time and feel happier setting your own rules.

Also your DD needs a fall back if you are ill, have appt or want to be away for a few days. Do they go to nursery yet as there is government funding. Looks like you are doing more child care than DD but I think that is true for many GPS

Do you still have friends where you had your holiday home, might be nice to hire a small apartment and catch up with old friends.

Just take this as a lesson in the real world. We are devoted to our children but are we/they so devoted to parents. It is the natural for children to break away and want a life away from their parents with their own family. So we must gently break away and make our own life.

Remember " If people ask you to do something they must expect No for an answer. " I remember having a friend who sometimes I asked a favour and she would say no I can't without an explanation. It was only in later life I realised I had the right to say No and not feel guilty.

No, you're not wrong to feel left out - your feeling aren't under your control. Bereavement shakes your confidence dealing with other people, and it sounds as if you don't have any time to yourself to think things through.

I wonder if you've had any counselling since your husband died, or have considered it? Cruse do bereavement counselling, or this may be available through your GP. It can really help to have someone to work through your feelings with, and of course if you would have talked through problems with your husband, you've lost that listening ear in your life.

It seems from what you've said about your DD that you do a lot for her and her family, I can see that it must be lovely seeing such a lot of your grandchildren, but as others have said, now is the time to be thinking about what shape the future will take, and being so much at the beck and call of your daughter's family may not be the best thing for you.

You say:

DD has made it clear that it is very inconvenient for me to take up hospital appointments, weekends away, hair appointmemts if it impacts on childcare, and I have to admit I feel dreadfully guilty if I let her down in this way. Holidays are the worst as I have to go to dd's house as she doesn't like waking the children early on their holidays to come to my house!

I'm sure if anyone else said that to you, you'd be able to point out what's wrong with it. I never had grandparents to do childcare, we had to pay someone to do that and budget it in. This did make things financially tight, but having children is pretty costly! Have you thought of reducing your commitment so you have some time to yourself in the week? This would help you to try out new activities where you might meet new people to remove your sense of isolation.

Diamondsgirl so sorry you are feeling this way. Maybe when you took your trip alone your DD saw it as you trying to branch out. Our children can be very selfish and just think, right she is ok now. Just a thought!
I do agree with everyone else that your DD is using you and taking away the chance of you meeting people or going out by relying on you so much. It can be very hard with our own DC, you agree to something and before you know it ....it's something else entirely.
I would also put a scrap book or memeory box together ( your journey/story) of all your happy memories in your holiday home that your DGC will be able to read when they want and enable them to see all the happiness that exists in their family. Photos of the home, beach, places you visited etc and of course you and your DH.
Look at new groups you could join locally and maybe make new friends with similar interests. Nothing ventured, nothing gained. In 6 months time maybe you could update us as to what you did and any progress you have made. Take care x

Maybe your daughter has been put in an awkward position by her husband. He might have said he doesn't want his mother in law to come along. I'm sure he loves you but they might just want to go on holiday as a family. I feel we highjacked my daughter and son in laws holiday at Christmas. My husband just asked if we could tag along! They had no choice but to say yes!If possible find a friend to holiday with. There are so many possibilities out there.

I personally think we shouldn't expect to be 'looked after' by our children and always included on their holiday and I don't think your daughter would do this to leave you out on purpose I totally agree she should have discussed it with you but she's probable scared to bring it up knowing how you would react also maybe last time wasn't as good for her as you or as you think you say you muddled through which implies that it was not all wonderful
I think you have to be incredibly brave and not expect for your daughter to become your surrogate partner They have a life to lead too .....Did you take your parents on holidays with you ? I did a couple of times but not on a regular expected basis
Same with my own children I ve been invited on some holidays but certainly not all and I think that a balance is called for She felt she needed to take you last time as you were newly widowed but probably hadn't thought that that set a precedence to always invite you
I think the childcare is another issue altogether and needs addresses in a time away from this upset

You have to find the courage to make your own life now as hard as it sounds Huge good luck take the bull by the horns and spread your wings xx

You're obviously an important part of the fabric of your DD's family life most of the year, diamonds. I can see that the possibility of spending holiday "fun" times with them, especially in a venue that is so important to you, is an attractive proposition from your point of view. But for them, a summer holiday is an opportunity for time away from everything that constitutes their family life for the rest of the year - and sadly that includes you. It's no criticism of you or disregard for everything you do for them; they just want some time together.

I understand how you are feeling. My DD informed me yesterday that I had ""had my family time"" This when I rang to see how she was on what would have been my younger daughter's birthday.We lost her 7years ago as a result of untreated PND.
It feels as though the only time I'm needed is as a babysitter as they never include me any other time ,except Christmas.
I lost my DH 8 and a half years ago and find the same problems associated with widowhood. I have been away on coach holidays with other widowed friends,but that isn't my first choice . A little more consideration from my DD would go a long way to improving how I feel.
I feel your DD should also be more thoughtful and aware of how her family holiday will affect you, especially as her father did so much for her.

I do emphasise with you. It is hard when you are newly on your own and I can see why you feel left out. It is normal though for them to want to holiday as a family especially as it seems both parents are working so time with the little ones is precious. Plan you self a nice relaxing time. Do whatever you consider a treat and when they return you will feel as though you have had a holiday too. Be kind to yourself

I'm so sorry you're feeling so hurt and upset. I honestly think there is so much more to be addressed here than disappointment over the holiday. Your daughter is being selfish in expecting you to put your life on hold for the sake of herself and her family. You are absolutely entitled to have a life of your own without recourse to her needs. Obviously if you are not able to look after the children you must give her reasonable notice. Don't forget YOU are the one doing her a favour and as such you are entitled to some say in the arrangements. I know addressing these issues will be difficult but if you don't you will continue to feel resentful and taken for granted which may lead to a far worse may blow up (literally) in the future.

The "being invited on holiday with them" is a completely separate issue from the "childcare"issue!

Re the childcare your daughter is really not being fair to you. The childcare problems are her problems, not yours...you are not creating those problems by going away, your planned absences are just part and parcel of their childcare arrangements! We look after our grandchildren one day a week. We always give plenty of notice if we are going to be away, and when on short trips we try to work the round our childcare day. However my son ad DIL know that if we are away, it is their responsibility!!! I think you need a clear discussion with your DD that you plan to have two (say) trips away each year and will not be available on the following dates in 2017. (one of the might have to take leave and they have shorter holidays if there really is no other solution!)

Re going away with them ...are you upset because not invited or upset because she didn't tell you ...or both.? Re not telling you, talk to her...ask her why she didn't mention it ...say you hope it wasn't because she felt awkward ....and wish them a happy holiday. Arrange to go away for a while whilst they are away! If upset about not being invited that's human to feel it but as I think you know, probably not fair! Have you an interest you could use as a basis for a holiday ...painting holiday or whatever so with others with similar interests?

Its hard I know

OP, can i just check, do you have 1 DD or 2? In your OP, you refer to 'my younger daughter' which implies that you have more than one - but all the answers so far seem to assume that you only have 1 DD - and that is the one that you do childcare for... Which is correct?
I'm sorry that you feel 'left out', but as pp have asked, did you take your DP or DPIL on holiday with you when your child/ren were small...? I didn't, and I've never been on holiday with either of my DC (nice though it would be, it's their family holiday...)
I too am on my own, and neither DC lives close to me, but I have a good circle of friends and try hard to socialise with them - including the occasional long weekend away.
I think that you do have to discuss childcare arrangements with your DD - it really isn't acceptable for her to object to you having medical appointments etc - so bite the bullet and do that ASAP.
Then book some days out with friends to give you something to look forward to - it'll gradually get better - and you've got the support of GN behind you

I was widowed before my daughter had met my now ex son in law. Once she did meet him we no longer went on holidays together as his mother thought this was very odd and my daughter just went along with it to stop arguments. His parents were still alive and went away often together but I was supposed to go away on my own. I looked after my grandchildren on a regular basis for them, having sleep overs every weekend and sometimes during the week so that my daughter could work the shifts her job demanded whilst I was working full time myself. The final straw for me was when the grandkiddies told me that they were going on holiday with their next door neighbour and family. My daughter finally told me a week before they went, mainly to let me know that I wouldn't be needed to look after the kiddies that week. I was very upset at the time, not so much that they were going away but more that it had been kept secret from me until the last minute - I could have arranged to go away myself given enough notice - for 8 years I didn't get a holiday away. Even now my ex son in law tries to spoil holiday time by demanding days when he knows we have already booked to go away or by bringing the kiddies back a day late so spoiling our arrangements.

High time that some Grans started putting themselves first where they have ungrateful and demanding families.If you act like a doormat then you get walked over.
By all meand help out, but do it around what suits you.
If you go on holiday with your family OP do you still do the childcare and the cooking?
I would rather have a quiet time myself either at home, or somewhere nice in the UK.

I think they are stinkers! Of all the places they could have gone had they genuinely fancied a break, to go there and not even run it by you is brutish. I really feel for you.

How can people be so thoughtless???? Grrrrrrrrrrrr

I suspect you have made yourself so accommodationg, that they still see you as the parent of their childhood, someone with very few needs of her own that take priority over theirs.You will just have to be your own priority now.

Tell them what you will do re. childminding and if you are not available then they will have to find someone else for that time.

You have to asert youself, you are not there to bail them out, mind their kids and be put to one side when it suits them. They are adults and must manage their own finances, just as they have managed their own holiday arrangments.

Say little, but behave differently. Give them the dates you won't be around and save your money to spend on your own life.

They will respect you more for being your own person.

I sympathise with your situation completely and agree that you are being taken for granted. Hospital appts? Good grief, you have to take those when needed. As to your personal appointments, that's just being selfish... you have a life and it's not to be their unpaid nanny. You are a grandmother and deserve respect and many many thank-yous (flowers or a bottle of wine now and then, or a gift voucher for your hairdresser)if they cannot afford to treat you on hols or dinners out, Sunday lunches etc to show their appreciation.

You need your weekends away. If they work, then isn't childcare for the time in the week? They want it for weekend? If it's just an evening out, they can surely afford a sitter!

But I also might ask...do you think your daughter might feel that these holidays at this sentimental place are very emotional for you and she isn't comfortable dwelling on the loss of her father with you whenever you go back? Maybe she wants a more carefree time?

Still... selfish is the first word that comes to me, but young parents who have helpful grandparents are easily taken for granted without a though. You need to speak up!!!

I've a feeling that your daughter has got used to your being at her bidding 24/7 which is not as it should be. You bring up your children to be independent adults and she is still behaving like a dependent adolescent. This paragraph is the most revealing:
DD has made it clear that it is very inconvenient for me to take up hospital appointments, weekends away, hair appointmemts if it impacts on childcare, and I have to admit I feel dreadfully guilty if I let her down in this way. Holidays are the worst as I have to go to dd's house as she doesn't like waking the children early on their holidays to come to my house!
Not waking her children early on the holidays - For goodness sake. You really have made a rod for your own back if you didn't object to this condition. And she has absolutely no right to tell you when you can go for hospital appointments. It's YOUR life and you have given quite enough of it to her and her children. Will she get her comeuppance when her offspring have their own children and call on her for granny duty?
I sometimes regret not living close enough to be involved with my GC. Having read some accounts of GPs' childcare commitments, maybe I'm not so sure! As for holidays - they have been more than generous to me. I've been on a number of caravan holidays in France with DS1,his wife and family and loved it. I was never exploited or expected to child-mind. The caravan was sold some years ago and they took up camping. When they went camping in Spain last year I was glad not to be expected to go with them! At my age (then 75)? Camping? [shock} However, this year they are going back to lovely Provence and they urged me to go with them. So I am putting my qualms behind me and taking the risk of camping.

- I used the wrong bracket!

Find a holiday involving some shared interest. I run art holidays and have a lot of single people who come for a week sketching in a lovely place and seeing the sights. Some of them are very nervous the first time but after the first day the group gels and some good friendships are formed with some students coming again and again. Some haven't drawn since school but that doesn't matter, it is all about having fun. You may have an interest in bird watching, history, cooking, oh a whole host of things and there will be a holiday for you. If you do book an interest holiday make sure you chat on the phone or by email with the person running it to find out the number and make up of the group and to allay any fears you may have. travel to a venue may worry you but many companies, the one I work for for example, who arrange all the transfers from the station or airport and will pick you up. Please don't give up and make sure you have your holidays when you want them, you can give plenty of notice so alternative childcare can be found, after all you chose to have your children, they chose to have your grandchildren. If you do happen to be interested in art look at my website www.soniahawes.co.uk or if it is something else email me and I'll let you know if I know of something, email on the website

Getting on for 4 years, last six months almost as bad as first 6 months. Wonderful friends but they are younger, have parents my age, children, jobs and great social lives, yet still find time for me. Don't want to be a drag.

Desperately miss our life, didn't realise how lonely you can feel even in a crowd. Married nearly 60 years. Do a lot of voluntary work, which does help as see people younger than me, but less fortunate.. After a certain time people go back to their lives, don't mean to abandon you, but that's the way life is. My Sister in Law suddenly said wanted nothing to do with with me over something that upset her 9 years ago, yet she didn't raise it with her brother then, saved it for me when vulnerable!

We are all coping in different ways, no two people are the same

I am so sorry for your loss, I too lost my DH two years ago, so can fully emphasise with what you are going through.

I am quite sure your DD did not tell you because she did not want to hurt you. I did exactly the same to my parents many years ago. We had up to then spent every single holiday with my parents either at their home (abroad) or here at our house. We just really wanted a family holiday by ourselves for once. We went ahead and booked two weeks in Spain just for our little family. We never did tell my parents, even though they invited us to the same place the same year a bit later to celebrate when their insurance matured. It would have broken their hearts to know it was not a very special holiday in new surroundings for us all. The children never said a word either as they too understood how much it would have hurt my parents.
You are so lucky to see your DD and grandchildren a lot, you all need space from each other some times and please remember your DD is grieving too, she needs to do that on her own without having to consider your feelings/grieve all the time.
I wish you all the best for the future and hope you can make a good life for yourself with some new friends as I have done.