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Not able to see our grandchildre. Miss our relationships with him, wife, and children.

(40 Posts)
JeanHarmony Fri 31-Jan-20 17:25:14

Son is behaving very angry and hateful toward myself and my husband. I have looked after 2 of the grandchildren for 4 years each 8 years in all and had lots of involvement and love for them. His anger has been going on for 3 years and getting worse. Before Christmas he returned presents and said he did not what to see us again and not to phone him. We had not seen him for months and had phoned to tell him we want to talk. We keep in touch no matter what. I never imagined in a million years that things would come to this. I feel we have been very good parents. Helping them, out with mortgage, helping with business, did his accounts for 14 years, and being close to his family, dinners, bar b ques, shopping together, walking in the forest. We have 2 other children who have children and we get on well but he won t talk to them either. He tells them how terrible we are.
I try to get on with my life and have family around but I love my grandchildren and I know they miss me and are very sad at not having us in their lives. Have others had these things happen and how do you manage it. I need some friends who understand this situation.

Lolo81 Fri 31-Jan-20 17:30:32

I’m sorry you’re going through such a tough time. You say your son’s been angry for the past 3 years, what started that? If you can pinpoint what started his “anger”, you may gain some insight on how to try and mend fences (assuming that’s your objective).

BlueBelle Fri 31-Jan-20 17:59:43

Is your son on any medication or drugs of any kind as this anger sounds very misplaced
How do you get on with your daughter in law? You don’t really mention her do you have a relationship with her could they be having problems ?
It’s terrible when you don’t know what you ve done wrong I do hope you get some answers and some solutions

Starlady Sat 01-Feb-20 06:05:22

My heart goes out to you, JeanHarmony! How painful to be CO (cut off) from DS and his family! And all the worse since you and DH have been so heavily involved! Also, I have trouble understanding how any parent can rip their kids away from people who have been so deeply involved w/ them!

If it's any comfort, you are not alone. We hear problems like this often here. I'm sure some GNers in similar situations will soon be in here.

"Before Christmas he returned presents and said he did not what to see us again and not to phone him. We had not seen him for months and had phoned to tell him we want to talk. We keep in touch no matter what."

I understand your desire to keep in touch, but I hope you don't phone him since he asked you not to. In fact, he may feel as if he asked you not to contact him, period (has he blocked you on social media, etc?). So your efforts to contact him may just anger him all the more.

Or do you keep in touch w/ DIL instead? Or just the GC? Do you get any responses?

Could DS be suffering from depression or something like that? Where is DIL in all this?

ann5620 Sun 09-Feb-20 00:15:50

I have been in the same situation for three years now, I havn't seen my Grandsons for three years . My situation is nearly identical to Jeans. I thought i had a wonderful Daughter, two lovely grandsons 12 &9. I adore them and they adored me. i had a wonderful time being involved in there lives as they grew up all the family get togethers even with her lovely in laws.I was part of a happy family, i got on well with her Husband. I am stunned beyond belief that my daughter suddenly made me surplus to requirement. Of coarse i want a reason. I have begged, i then became angry, i sent emails which were honest but i am ashamed to say bitter in the end. No response. i have spent the last three years in depression.. Today i made my decision. I lost my lovely Daughter i don't know who she is. i never want her in my life again. I speak from heart now , not bitter anymore. I sent her an email today and told her i will fight tooth and nail to see my Grandsons. I will use every avenue available to me if i have any rights to do so. Win or lose at least i will know i have left no stone unturned in the fight to my rights to see my boys and so will they. All i asked in the end was to meet them once a month and have a chat and give them there pocket money. not even allowed that much. I am turning a corner now thank the lord. I am not her Mother anymore, I gave her all that i could, she would not have survived either financially or emotionally without me. Even when she was growing up as her Father is a selfiish excuse for a man who hardly gave her the time of day. According to her now he is a legend.

ann5620 Sun 09-Feb-20 00:24:48

I don't want any answers or explanations now even if they were offered. I can live easily now without her. I have no feeling for her atall if i never see her again it will be too soon.

However i can't begin to imagine how i will get through the rest of my life never seeing my boys again, just once a month, it's not to much to ask,

sodapop Sun 09-Feb-20 08:42:51

So sorry to hear about your problems JeanHarmony what actually started all this off?
It seems all you can do at the moment is to keep the door open and try to resolve whatever the issue is that is upsetting him. Can any of his siblings help?
Enjoy your time with the other grandchildren and try not to let his affect your relationships with the rest of the family. I hope things get better for you soon.

Ann5620 yours is also a sad situation and you are clearly very angry with your daughter and ex husband. Try not to do anything drastic whilst you are still so angry as some things cannot be undone. Talk things through with someone not directly involved and try to get a more balanced perspective. Good luck.

jenpax Sun 09-Feb-20 09:01:55

Ann5620 You sound very hurt more than angry with your daughter and I think if she reached out to you then you would respond despite your bitter words!
Be very careful of any legal battle to see your grandsons!
Firstly you refer to them as your boys, yet they are your grandchildren not your own children and I wonder if your attitude to them maybe why your daughter has cut you out? Maybe you should try telling her that you love her first and foremost as your child and not focus so much on the children?
Secondly legal battles for grandparents rarely work out and frequently cost large sums of money which I am sure your grandchildren will not want you have to spent when they get older, maybe put the money into savings accounts for them and gift it when they reach 18 and therefore are adults themselves?

ExperiencedNotOld Sun 09-Feb-20 09:23:31

My husband's brother suddenly discarded us after years of shared living. He was full of vitriol and was so so angry. Only 15 years later we now understand that it was an enslavement to his now ex-wife that caused it. He thought he loved her and did everything to please her. I continued to see her throughout and it was only when he gained the courage to leave her that I realised her true nature (she turned against me in the immediate aftermath).
So sometimes you do never really know what goes on in a relationship. Have patience.

JeanHarmony Sun 09-Feb-20 14:06:07

Thank you so much for answering my post. Yes I realise that we have been very supportive to my son and that when my husband retired he felt abandoned. We were still there for him though but he could not handle the change, I think. He now seems to not only say what terrible parents we are but invents things and tells untruths. If only we could talk but he just calls us liars and just goes la la la whenever we try to talk. We have written thing to clarify our position but this just enrages him. He has told us that he is having counselling and his counsellor also thinks he is right and that we are terrible parents. I feel we just have to wait to see if he realises himself who we really are as parents. Just to say we have always been a child centred family and we sold our house and give money to our children to help them out. I am not saying this to show off, but to point out that we are very caring and loving parents and always have . Feel very helpless. Anyway, thank you so much for your comments. Waiting game.

agnurse Sun 09-Feb-20 18:19:55

Some things to be aware of if anyone pursues GP rights:

1. If you go the legal route, and you fail, you are quite likely to never see your GC again, at least until they are adults.

2. A GP rights battle is likely to cause significant stress on the family. The children will not be immune from that stress.

3. Legal battles cost money. That may well be money the family doesn't have. You could well be taking food out of your GC's mouths.

Bottom line: if you win, you'll have a piece of paper to say you won. You'll have your "access". You will also have children who are extremely stressed and parents who likely won't talk to you. You may have denied the children other opportunities due to the money and time taken up in the legal battles. If you lose, you'll likely end up with NOTHING.

What is it worth to you? And who really benefits?

Jomarie Sun 09-Feb-20 18:46:57

wise words agnurse

Smileless2012 Sun 09-Feb-20 19:18:20

JeanHarmony my heart goes out to you. We have been estranged from our youngest son for just over 7 years. Haven't seen our eldest GC since he was 8 months old and have never seen our youngest.

We are thankful that we never established a relationship with our GC. For you to have been so involved with yours and have them taken away is beyond cruel IMO.

"I can't begin to imagine how I will get through the rest of my life never seeing my boys again, just once a month, it's not too much to ask". No ann it's not too much to ask, the awful thing is that you have to ask at all.

Parents who deny their children the loving and caring GP's they have come to know should hang their heads in shame.

There's a lot to consider before taking legal action to see your GC but if you can show you had an established relationship with them before that was taken away by their parents, that's a positive.

I don't agree with your emotive post agnurse "You could well be taking food out of your GC's lives". If that was the case then it's easily avoided by allowing ann to see her GC once a month isn't it.

If this was to go to court, it's the children's parents who will "have denied (their) children other opportunities due to the money and time taken up in the legal battles". These parents have denied their children their GP's; the responsibility is theirs.

Urmstongran Sun 09-Feb-20 19:20:59

I agree with you agnurse - coercing contact would be a minefield - for everyone concerned.

agnurse Sun 09-Feb-20 22:22:18

From the way she's behaved and the emails she's sent I am not surprised that the mother doesn't want her children around her.

If someone behaved that abominably there is NO WAY they'll be around my kids. It sounds as if the grandmother thinks she is owed time with her GC. They aren't "her" boys. They are not do-over children, and she does not have "rights" to them. And then she turns around and says she has no interest in having a relationship with her daughter and she's prepared to FIGHT for her access.

Her GC aren't toys and she sounds incredibly selfish. Her life needs to be about more than someone else's children. How would you feel if someone claimed they had rights to your children and were prepared to fight for them in court - and they were not your child's other parent?

Summerlove Sun 09-Feb-20 22:31:49

I don't agree with your emotive post agnurse "You could well be taking food out of your GC's lives". If that was the case then it's easily avoided by allowing ann to see her GC once a month isn't it.

So, either allow your children to see someone you have deemed unsuitable, or possibly lose money in court.

Neither are great choices to someone in this situation.

Both “sides” will take massive losses.

agnurse Sun 09-Feb-20 22:41:07

Well, exactly. No one forces a GP to go to court. The GP can choose to accept the status quo or choose to fight.

A GP does not need GC. Ann's GC are 12 and 9 and have not seen her for 3 years. That's hardly going to make a favourable impression on the court. They're also old enough to have some say in the decision - and what if what they say isn't what Ann wants to hear? What if her "access" conflicts with other activities that they have? What's she going to do once they get older and want to do things other than visiting Grandma once a month?

pinkquartz Sun 09-Feb-20 22:56:14

And what if the DGC want to see their grandmother?

I would not recommend going down the legal route OP but why is your DD so against you seeing them?

I never understand why parents do not understand that children might want their grandparents in their lives.
I think children do need grandparents.
I don't like that agnurse is so against the OP. How do you know what is best? You don't.
we don't know what the OP's DGC want. so don't presume so negatively.

Smileless2012 Mon 10-Feb-20 10:46:38

Going to court wasn't something we were prepared to do, it's up to each individual to make that choice or not.

I find it hard to understand why a GM who spent 8 years in total looking after her GC and being involved in their lives should now be "deemed unsuitable", if indeed that is the case.

It would appear from the OP that it's her son who is the issue here and not her unsuitability as a GM.

Bibbity Mon 10-Feb-20 14:19:19

You won’t get access after three years of nothing.
The entire basis of the action is that you want to persevere a pre existing relationship for the benefit of the children.

There is no relationship.

Smileless2012 Mon 10-Feb-20 14:26:02

The OP hasn't said there's been a relationship for 3 years, she said her son's anger has been visible for 3 years. She hasn't spoken to her son for months, not years and the 8 years she has had a close relationship with her GC will count for something if she decides to take the legal route.

agnurse Mon 10-Feb-20 15:41:35


We were referring to Ann, whose post is either on this page or the previous page. She has had no relationship with her GC for 3 years and has told her daughter she's prepared to go to court.

Smileless2012 Mon 10-Feb-20 15:45:14

Oh thanks for that agnurse I didn't realise Bibbity was referring to a different poster.

Starlady Thu 13-Feb-20 04:34:05

Thanks for coming back in and talking to us some more, Jean. FWIW, I don't believe any therapist ever says anything like, "Yes, you have terrible parents." They might have agreed or sympathized w/ some of your son's complaints (and remember the therapist only knows what he has told them). But I doubt they would write you off as "terrible" w/o even meeting you. That's your son's interpretation.

I'm not sure why DH's retiring would have such a major effect. Is it b/c you could no longer help out financially? Or your son just doesn't like change? Or??

Regardless, I'm sorry to say it but I would back off from ES (estranged son) as much as possible for now and give him space to deal w/ his demons, whatever they are. Hopefully, in time he'll reach out to you... Patience... Hugs!

Ann, I feel for you, as well. I can't imagine why ED (estranged daughter) would turn against you this way after you had such a good relationship w/ her, her ILs, etc. Perhaps she didn't find it as "happy" as you did? Or maybe there's a problem in her marriage she's not comfortable sharing w/ you?

But you said you don't want to consider explanations, etc. Just want to be able to maintain a relationship w/ your GSs. I don't blame you, but IMO, that may be hard to do. How would you and ED make arrangements for you to see the boys if she doesn't even respond to you?

But like others, I suppose you are talking about going to court. Unfortunately, to my knowledge, those cases are hard for GPs to win. And even if you did, the situation would very likely be awkward and strained since there would still be tension between you and ED. And while others are talking about the money your ED and ESIL would have to spend, please don't forget it might be very expensive for you, as well. Sorry to sound so discouraging, just trying to give you a realistic picture. Only you can decide if you want to go down this route or not.

Regardless. I take it your depression was a response to this situation. I am so very sorry. I hope you have been receiving treatment for it, and that you spend time focusing on your own wellbeing. Hugs!

Sandmb Tue 10-Mar-20 18:12:43

Hi I’m a grandmother who has just taken my daughter and son in law to court to get contact with my 5 grandchildren. The parents won’t speak to me and won’t let the children even answer phone calls/texts and refused mediation. I was distraught just being stopped and couldn’t afford a solicitor so I got a McKenzie friend which I have now trained for to help me. They helped me fill in correct forms advise me write my position statement and attended court with me and the only down side was they can’t speak in court. This has worked out for me as I just needed to know the correct forms etc and family law is just common sense. I went to court and I now have access and phone call access at a fraction of the cost. Grandparents going to court is becoming very common now so if anyone is missing their grandchildren and desperately want to be involved the children’s lives go for it. What’s more important seeing the grandchildren or sitting hoping that you might see them