At the end of my tether

PAW007,

How are things at the moment? Any improvement? Have you taken things further?

This is an untenable situation Paw no wonder you are at the end of your tether, I can understand how stressed you are.
I think you and your husband need to agree a way forward and present a united front to your adult children. Your priority has to be your granddaughter. Time for your sons to stand on their own two feet. This is one of those times when you have stand firm, think about life for you & your husband and care for your granddaughter. Good luck

If your daughter and granddaughter move out then another possibility is that she will move in with a man. Unless he is a decent caring person that could ring alarm bells. She is not a caring mother and the child may then be at risk if the man is also irresponsible and uncaring. Knowing what your daughter is like I'd say the child would definitely be better not staying with her, or where will this lead?
Ideally the two sons should move out and get a place together, and your granddaughter move in with you (if you can manage it) then she will have a stable home and her own room.

What a sad and stressful situation. Do you think drugs/alcohol are issues? Selfish, Unreliable, chaotic, staying out, not coming home when she said she would, it shouts drugs/alcohol to me.

When you agreed to a year, we’re you aware how chaotic her lifestyle is, how unsuitable for anyone, much less the sole parent of a vulnerable three year old. Your daughter must present herself to the housing dept as homeless in order to get help in any reasonable timescale. The overcrowding a relationship conflicts equal homeless.

If you contact the nspcc, they’ll listen, may give advice but they will make a referral to Children’s Services. It must be 20 years or more since the nspcc did any investigative work, everything is recorded and faded to the area social work team, who then start the process again.

Your daughter may be living with you and giving herself permission to ignore and neglect her little girl but, it can’t go on.

No wonder you are that the end of your tether.

Do you think she will settle down when she gets a home for her and her daughter to live in? I am by no way excusing her behaviour but she must feel claustrophobic too with you all in a 2 bedroom flat. Don't do anything hasty x

What an awful situation to be in. I have no advice to offer but I would imagine a young mother with a young child is a greater priority for a council to rehouse than a single mother. On her own, your daughter would surely only be offered a single room in a shared house, if that. Maybe with a child that is all she would be offered anyway. That said, I hope your dd is not simply using the child as a means of getting better accommodation, and then going to leave her, unsupervised for a time or with other, similar irresponsible people.

So, the question is, is it better to wait and see what happens or act now, before any damage is done, and try to get custody? I really feel for you.

My focus would be on my grandchild.

As someone else said, tell your daughter to go and live with her friends.

Help your boys get a rented place together. Help them look, help them with the deposit.

Give your grandaughter the other bedroom and be a stabilising influence and home for her.

Oh what a sad and upsetting time you have had and even more so your grandaughter, she must be so confused, if i was in this situation i would ask another family member if they could look after g/daughter for a few hrs ,so she is out of the flat and tell your daughter she must be there as you want to speak with her ,and i would tell her in no uncertain way that she is not caring for her daughter and you have concerns for the childs welfare , i would give her 1 month to show you that she can care for her,or you are going to contact social services to gain custody of the child, and that your daughter will have leave your flat, she is a mother and needs to act like one and take responsibility for her child, you really need to be careful your daughter does not just move out with her daughter and you not know where she is ,as it does sound like the child may well be at risk being alone ,without supervision , its so hard for you and i hope you can work it out so this child has a safe/loving home,

shelflife the daughter is 24 the sons still living at home are 26 and 28 and unlike you I do think it’s relevant, if the daughter sees the two elder brothers still at home (we don’t know how well looked after the boys are …….ie washing clothes, feeding, limited rental maybe) but she is seeing that it’s ok for them to still be with mum and dad and if they’re helping the boys why not help her
I m not saying this is right at all just saying this may be how she’s seeing it
It’s a two bedroomed flat so overcrowded with five adults and a small child
I think it’s a good idea that Paw is going to talk it through with NSPCC first they will be able to give advice and also know the best way to try going forward
It might go right out of your hands with SS and you can’t retract once it’s all been said
Let your daughter know you are happy to help short term but she has to pull her weight equally or risk losing her little girl because you can’t carry on for another year with her being reckless and hedonistic
She’s not a child, I had two children by her age and no family help as I was a long way away from home She’s not wanting any responsibilities and she should have thought of that before she jumped in someone’s bed without using precautions

Slightly off topic but a friend of mine has a son, eldest of three, always going to move out, get his own place, she’s been saying that to me since he was mid 20’s. He flits back and forth, depends on the girlfriend of the moments living situation. Currently back with my friend and about to turn 40. Some just don’t want to leave the home comforts. Maybe these two adult sons need to move out and the daughter.

So sorry to hear of your situation. Children are a blessing ... but yours are now adults.

Solution 1. 2 bedroomed house - one for grandparents and one gor the DGC, assuming you are willing and able to take custody. How long have your sons been "saving" for their own place? At 26 and 28 they should be man enough to support themseleves, indeed a family! Your daughter has serious problems and I would agree she is likely on drugs and needs seperating from your GDC, who is the victim here. Hopefully your DD might change one day and become the loving, responsible mother she should be.

2. To repeat SueDonim where is the father? O.k. The real father? Maybe there's mileage there ... if your DD knows who he is. (Get a paternity test.) Keep hearing of this. Women getting pregnant by one man but telling another it's theirs to suit themselves. Basically giving the baby away without telling the fsther! Such women have no rights as a mother in my opinion! GDC deserves a chance with her dad.

The daughter is 24 TerriBull.

This sounds an intolerable situation for you. Is your daughter, the mother of the little girl younger than your two boy?, she does sound very immature and not really capable of providing adequate care for your granddaughter. I do wish you well and hope you find some resolution to this awful problem, but prioritise that little girl, your daughter sounds a very neglectful mother and what with the heart breaking stories in the news I think when anyone reads your post, that will be at the fore of their minds. How hard for you trying your best like so many other grandparents in your situation, picking up the pieces of the mess their children make.

If your daughter moves out with her daughter, there seems little liklihood to me of her looking after her child properly.

She may of course just be taking advantage of you and will pull her socks up once she is on her own with her child, but I doubt it.

Has this 24 year old daughter always been incapable of managing her money? And has she always relied on others to provide her with this that and the other?

If so, are you not being unrealistic in thinking she will change?

You are between a rock and a hard place here, but in your place I would feel my duty was first and foremost to my grand-daughter, who is definitely not old enough to fend for herself.

You say your sons are not planning on moving - well that may be so, but TELL them they will have to,

I am guessing that they are about the same age as their sister and legally adults.

You are currently five adults and a child in a two bedroomed flat - this could only work if everyone pulled their weight. Your daughter doesn't: what about your sons?

Tell them all that you have had enough. You brought them up, and now they must stand on their own feet and find accomodation elsewhere.

I would also tell my daughter that unless she starts looking after her daughter herself for the remainder of the time they are living with you, you will report her to social services for neglecting the child and apply for custody of your grand-daughter or failing that for her to be placed in care with a younger couple who will actually care for her.

My friend kind of had this problem, her daughter moved in with her two small boys, after splitting with her partner. There is no way she could stay with him. She is a good mother though, and took full responsibility for her boys. My friend also had a grown up daughter in the house. They were in a three bed bungalow....very small.

It took 3 plus years, to get housing. It took its toll on my friend, who had to work, but the blessing was...they all got on.

The problem here is...even though there are things you can do, everything takes so long, unless there is abuse to the child, and then they are, or should be...removed.

If it were me...and I can only imagine your torment, so apologies if I’m making it sound easy, I would pack my daughter’s bags...and tell her to live with all these friends she keeps seeing. My grandchild would stay with us, and we’d get right on to Social Services. My daughter would have to fight for her. She is the only priority^. Would your health allow for this?

Can your sons help at all? How do they view everything? You can’t continue like this. Even if your sons moved out....you still presumably would be left with your daughter behaving the same. She may even take more liberties, as she would see there’s more space.

I’m so sorry, it sounds a nightmare, but I think if you focus on your granddaughter now...then maybe you can get your daughter the help she needs.

I wish you all the best?

First of all try to hold off ringing SS right now. They are under enormous strain over the Xmas period dealing with children who are in real danger. Your granddaughter is not.
Be aware that in the possibility that the council do house your daughter the accommodation will probably be basic.
Financial is there any way that you could help with a deposit for a private rental. Your daughter could then go to housing for help with the rent.
Then is the time to get her chaotic lifestyle sorted.

It is irrelevant that your two adult sons live with you , that is your and your sons decision and has no bearing on your present situation. You have evey right to have your son's with you and your DH. However, your GC deserves better!! Please contact SS asap for support, explain exactly what is happening and how the situation is affecting your lives. You need help today !!! I recognize your daughter is very young and may well resent not going out with friends but she is now a mother and must take on the responsibility that comes with that. If you feel your daughter is unfit to be a mother please discuss this with SS.

My sons are 26 and 28 they are both saving for their own places. I’m going to contact the nspcc for some advice and send a letter to the housing confirming her date to leave. We are going to keep a diary from today. We are going to speak to her today about her actions ,

Housing probably won’t be in any hurry to help as they will know she has a home with you You are really between a rock and hard place
Why do you have two adult sons living with you ? Are you too kind to all your children if you had a big house I d not comment but in a two bedroom flat it all sounds impossible
My worry is the little girl she must be very confused with life, and broken, she obviously lost the person she thought of as dad, has a mum who she hardly ever sees and has a smoking drinking, hedonistic lifestyle and a Nan and grandad who are stressed and upset…so far from how it should be poor child
I think talking to NSPCC is a better idea than SS as once they are involved things are out your hands and the child could be taken away from you all They seem to leave some children in dire family situations but whip some away when not necessary
You probably wouldn’t be considered suitable by SS to care for the granddaughter with two adult sons in a small flat the child is not in danger at the moment as she is cared for by you but when you do get your daughter out then she may well be in danger if she goes too, so then would be the time to contact SS in my opinion

I guess it's understandable that your DD is making the most of having live-in babysitters, although she's overdoing it.
It would be a good idea to voice your concerns to social services, tho.

Have you given your DD written notice of when she has to leave?
And, preferably, also given a copy to the housing department to notify them you have done this?
If the housing dept doesn't have a specific date when she has to leave your home, it's unlikely they'll come up with any accommodation for her.

i think you should contact social services re the child.
discuss with your husband first whether you two could bring up your GC.
her mother is completely neglecting her.
perhaps you could ring NSPCC to discuss first.
how can all those people be living in a 2 bed flat. do the two grown sons share a room? are they happy with that.

Chewbacca

I worry about that little child when she's living solely with her mother. If the mother is going out most nights now, will she suddenly decide to stay home and parent that child when she's in her own place?

No, I shouldn't think that's likely.
Unless the partying continues at her house which would be just as bad.

The priority is your granddaughter so, as others have said, you need to seek professional help.

I'm so sorry to hear this.

This is not a good situation at all. I think you need some serious help to protect your grandchild and you need to get in touch with the right local services straight away.

As Bibbity suggests, keep a diary of comings and goings and do call the police if you need to

Where does she sleep, undisturbed, until 11am? On the sofa? Any decent (or half decent) parent wants to be there on Christmas morning, watching the kid/s unwrap presents. I'd contact Social Services, without any discussion or delay, as the child needs safeguarding.