I think my adult daughter has BorderlinePersonalit y Disorder and

Thankyou Allsorts- this is my thinking too. He does work mostly on his own though and finds interactions difficult which is one reason he can never keep a job. For years I tried to 'fix' him, but have now come to realise this is just how he is and probably will be for the rest of his life.

As to when I'm gone I have no control over that...

If your son is better working alone, is he better off finding a job where he can work from home, keepingquiet? My daughter preferred this option but wasn't able to self-motivate.

Yes, he has had working from home jobs and is supposed to be doing an on-line course for which he paid thousands and hasn't passed a single unit.

He is very much an outdoors person and loves his gardening work but needs to find an alternative income next winter. This wet and cold weather hasn't helped.

You are right, like your daughter he lacks motivation to be on a screen all day. It is too much organisation for them!

With those suffering borderline personality disorder we find some frightening trends. Around half physically neglected, half emotionally abused, around a third physically abused, sexually abused or emotionally neglected as children. As adults they typically have more estranged relationships and higher instance employment issues which leads to worsening symptoms as we are social animals. Therapy can help address this but with most things it is the causes being addressed that alleviates the symptoms. It is so important to support the person suffering and take ownership where childhood milestones have been missed to help those lost tools to be put in place as an adult. Rather hard for all involved.

How do they access therapy if they don't think they have a problem though?

I gave up on counselling years ago because it didn't help much at all. I wasn't the one with the problem.

My son was not abused, neglected emotionally or physically. He inherited his problems from his father, in some ways they are exactly the same especially when it comes to managing money.

His father functioned 'normally' in the world and worked all his life, but admitted he was much better on his own than with others. I think more needs to be done to find genetic links rather than looking for serious abuse in childhood.

So there were issues with his father growing up? Perhaps father had similar issues too.

In family life there are always 'issues.' He lived with his father as an adult for a few years, his choice. His father's death a few years ago also affected him very deeply. Are these the sort of 'issues' you mean?

I am not a believer in the 'sins of the father...' idea either. Genetics, yes I can believe there may be genetic pre-dispositions as well as, maybe in place of, childhood trauma.

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Genetics certainly account for the biological markers but the disorder like many are often triggered by trauma or stress in childhood. This happens in much the same way physical conditions are triggered by trauma or stress in childhood. Young brains are forming new connection continuously, those connections may go awry or never form at all. The genetic component may be triggered or not triggered or severe trauma can create the adverse connection that wasn't there before.

Luminance, I may be misunderstanding the point you’re trying to make but my impression is that you’re determined to put blame on parents. To make posters discussing the worries they have about their adult children, their desire to continue to support in the hope of positive change or progress, feel guilty.

It’s clear posters here are well aware of the role if genetics and trauma in the development of health problems.

That's what I thought, Iam64 but then the trauma in childhood doesn't need to be by the parents, it could be a third party. However, my daughter's father suffers from psychopathic personality disorder and my mother is a narcissist so I suspect that there is a genetic predisposition along with events that triggered that disorder. I think with my daughter, she never stood a chance. Her father was so vile when I was pregnant, I suspect she was damaged before she was even born. She then went on to have some really traumatic experiences which were nothing to do with me and that further compounded the damage. My daughter tells me that the research she has done has shown her there is definitely a genetic component.
My son has the same father but as I was only 7 weeks pregnant when I left him, he didn't experience the same problems his sister had. He has a totally different personality and I am convinced that my more stable emotional pregnancy and his calmer childhood meant that genetic component was never triggered.

Glad to hear that because it can be a difficult and troubling journey for all involved and it is important that family members are able to support their loved ones fully. Let us be clear in that from the start. Such a diagnosis may cause pain for all and topics will emerge that are rather difficult to deal with but must be withstood for the best results. That is I am afraid the best advice I can give for those able to hear it and I do stand by it because those who are able to hear it will be the most successful.

Mmm... that's a very loaded statement to make about a diagnosis very few people know about, including mental health professionals.

I consider myself an 'expert' on this disorder because I live with it on a day to day basis.

Only the people who listen to you will be 'successful?' In something for which no real treatment is offered? That is some claim there...

Could you provide some evidence please?

keepingquiet- thanks

Iam64

keepingquiet- thanks

And thanks from me.

Luminance - do you absolve the adult child from responsibility

Iam64

Luminance - do you absolve the adult child from responsibility

I hope I don't misunderstand. So I would not blame someone for the having of borderline disorder so I will assume that isn't the question. So that leaves us with the inarguable fact that every individual is responsible for their own actions and inaction. Of course healing together in family therapy has rather the best outcomes.

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Personality Disorders can certainly be mitigated and managed given the correct therapy Dialectical Behaviour Therapy.. but there you have the problem..

there are hardly any opportunities to receive this therapy and optimally it is twice a week.. once individually and once in a group setting and it should be carried out over a long period of time. (6 months to a year)

and secondly the main problem though is lack of compliance and commitment from the person with DBT.. which is often initial enthusiasm and then non or poor attendance..

It is as Monica says a very difficult condition to work with.

It is indeed true Borderline Personality Disorder may be treated and symptoms can be addressed with medication and therapies like DBT or MBT. I suppose a good way to understand it would be to say that the disorder may be brought into remission. If however underlying causes are not addressed symptoms may be triggered. A great failing with treatment is exposure to stressors. It is difficult for example to teach someone that their feelings are real and valid should someone else be undermining that. It can be difficult to teach someone how to properly manage their impulses and think through their actions should those around them dismiss their ability to do so. As I have explained, this is where a good support system enables recovery.

For example, a psychopath cannot be cured, merely managed, and unfortunately even the best management often will not be be effective, and a psychopath will still go on to kill.

The medical definition does not include "they will still go on to kill." Psychopathy is a severe form of antisocial personality disorder, a mental health condition that involves a lack of empathy and remorse, and impulsive behavior; it often includes criminal behaviour. When a psychopath acts antisocially, it will never be their fault, it will always be someone else's. My ex-husband has never killed anyone but has a medical diagnosis of Psychopathy. Mind you, some of the things he did meant it was amazing he didn't kill anybody!

Luminance, can you say where you get your information from? Are you a professional dealing with such things?

Yes indeed, mental health nursing.

I’ve worked closely with mh services. I’ve also known many families where there are 3-5 siblings living stable lives, with one who has displayed ‘difficult’ behaviour throughout childhood and by 13, put simply out of the control of their parents.
By adult life there’s a pattern of volatile behaviour with frequent intense early relationships that don’t endure. . Parents go on and on, bailing out, supporting, caring for grandchildren. Their adult child remains angry, blaming the for neglecting/abusing them in childhood and not supporting them in adult life. Their siblings report experiencing loving parents. They express anger that their siblings drains their parents .
When a family tree is put together, there is usually a relative who has followed a similar path.
I’m not minimising the way neglect and abuse can impact on personality and developing mental health. What is important is not to simply ‘blame’ loving parents, we must acknowledge genetic influences and the resilience shown by many children and adults despite seriously adverse childhood experiences

Luminance

It is indeed true Borderline Personality Disorder may be treated and symptoms can be addressed with medication and therapies like DBT or MBT. I suppose a good way to understand it would be to say that the disorder may be brought into remission. If however underlying causes are not addressed symptoms may be triggered. A great failing with treatment is exposure to stressors. It is difficult for example to teach someone that their feelings are real and valid should someone else be undermining that. It can be difficult to teach someone how to properly manage their impulses and think through their actions should those around them dismiss their ability to do so. As I have explained, this is where a good support system enables recovery.

Again, how are people supposed to access these therapies?

I have sobbed in GP's surgeries only to be told there is nothing they can do because the 'patient' has to seek therapy themselves. I'm the one who gets offered the counselling and group therapy, yet I am not allowed to mention that the stress I am under is caused by someone else.

It's a crazy circus because what you seem to be saying is that mental health issues can be caused by someone else?

How do you 'teach' someone that their feelings are real?

Teaching is active, not passive.

Who might the mysterious 'others' be that are undermining someone's real feelings?
Are you referring to gaslighting here?

Can managing impulses be taught? How do people access this education?

Again, you refer to people 'around them'- who are these people- family, carers, friends, therapists?

I wish I knew where these good support systems were, because I haven't come across any... and not for the want of trying.