Inheritance and divorce.

Maries, I am sorry I was a bit brusque but your last email changes the picture. If you worked unpaid or for low pay in a family business on the understanding that you would inherit half the estate on your death, if your mother makes a will leaving everything to your brother you can sue for proper provision from the will because of the circumstances around your work in the family business.

How ever taking into account your limited income. Your best tactic is to make no effort to get your mother to make a will because if she dies intestate the estate will be shared equally between the two of you. You will get your half. Perhaps the time has been reached where your brother should be left to sort his own problems and you should protect yourself. Discouraging will making protects your interest and costs nothing.

You will need a solicitor to deal with the intestacy when your mother dies and that will be paid from her estate. When this happens visit several solicitors and ask them how much they will charge, this is usually quoted in terms of a percentage of the value of the estate. A solicitor will make sure that the estate is divided equally and fairly

I askedfor advice and I received that and I am thankful to allwho answered.

I wanted to know if it was correct that myDB's estranged wife could claim any inheritance and it seems itscorrect.

I wanted to know if it could be corrected and it seems the way suggested here is that this can only be done with a will and a solicitor. Fair enough, I got an answer.

Personally I am on a low income - lower than my DB in fact. Leabing aside much of what has gone on in the past, I am not placed to pay for advice myself ( and DM would expect I did that for her too). so I thank the person who suggested an alternative.

Yes, I am p**d off that my DM , who I love very much btw, has seen fit to think now that she would leave all her money ( including money which was left to her forboth me and my DB) to my DB ...... but as was said, its her money.

We are not a traditioanlly will writing family (some are, some are not, some although it may surprise here, just leave verbal instructions, although that seems to get missed here sometimes)

My parents had a business and I worked in that unpaid for 10 years ( my DB was paid to sit on his A*se and play music btw - I have written about this elsewhhere in relationships). and it was alwys an agree ment with my dad and mum that when they passed away half the inheritance would come to me and this was my "payment" with interest for my years of service. That goal post has changed since my DD died.

But I will do what I can for my DM - but that does not include hiring a solicitor to disinherit me I am afraid. As I said, if she goes to one and gets it sorted, I have done my job. DB wont lift a finger so its up to her.

Thanks for the information,I will tellmy DM what I have found out - my job done.

Yes. I don't really know why Maries is asking for advice. The only way to avoid SIL getting her hands on any of her mother's money is for mother to leave it all to Maries in her Will. Which could then be contested, and anyway it sounds as though her mother wouldn't do it.

Ok, I think the goal posts have moved.

I would actually be thorough p****d off if I had a mother who expected me to look after her just because I was female and yet was prepared, if she bothered to write a will, to leave everything to a brother, was not expected to lift a finger and one who might easily lose half of that inheritance to his estranged wife.

In my experience, Citizens' Advice Bureaux will also advise consulting a solicitor. Some larger Bureaux have solicitors on board, but they are in a minority and shrinking all the time for lack of finance.

It seems Maries doesn't want her mother to make a will, as she herself will not be left anything and it would all go to her brother. That's the bottom line.

Maries, As I read it at the moment you want legal advice and help but don't want to pay for it. Unless you are constrained by a very low income, where the Citizen's Advice Bureau may be able to help, and I suspect that is not the case, if you want a safe and sure legal way of dealing with your problem you need to speak to a solicitor, they will often do a brief assessment meeting for free and let you know what the costs of drawing up a will etc will be and pay for the assistance you need. Consider the alternative; if you do nothing and your mother dies intestate (not having made a will) your brother will receive his half of the estate and it will all be in play for his estranged spouse.

Absentgrana, it is indeed my mopthers choice how she leaves HER money. I have no claim other than being her daughter ( my brotyher is adopted btw - not as that should be an issue).

However, my mother does see it as my duaghterful duty to look after her in sickness and to take care of her etc. This is not to be paid. This is because I am a daughter. My brother is not expected to do any such tasks.

So, whilst it is my duty as daughter to take care of my mother and ensure her care and whilst as you (rightly) point out it is Her money to place as she chooses, I do not see as my duties and obligations strech as far as my placing myself deliberately into a position where I shall be disinherited
(which would be the case if she writes a will).

As you said its her money and she can do as she wants. IF she wants to consult a solicitor and write a will that is her choice. I do not think though that my duty and obligation as a daughter stretches to helping her/ ensuring she does do that though.

Maries I should have thought it was your mother's choice how she leaves her money. Obviously, you feel an entitlement which you didn't express in your original post. I shall shut up and go away now.

Absentgrana - I do not wish to muddy the waters vis my DB and his situation. My mother asked me to see if I could find a way round the matter of his estranged wife.

Forgive me, but from my personal point of view my mother not wrting a will will suit me best. If she writes a will, I will be left out altogeher as she considers my DB to have needs ( and she considers me able to work and look after myself). However that is another story.

My aunt was intestate ( this is where the bulk of my mothers money has come from) and I did her letters of administration without a solicitor at all. There was not problem.

I do not expect my mother to pose more problems if she has no will as it will split between myself and DB - no one else involved.

I suppose because I prefer not to see my DB ripped off for a quarter million, I would like to see his wife issue settled. Maybe if I can convince him to get a divorce or hope my mother lasts five years (quite possible) and then he can divorce.

I have seen several wills where money has been slated away and not gotten where it should so forgiive me for being cynical.

I guess my DB will have to grin and give his money to his estranged wife.

merlotgran If it is hard to get everyone together, why not consult an independent solicitor on your own. He/she could write to the solicitors dealing with the estate and would be more likely to get a specific answer (they wouldn't be able to baffle them with legalese!). Just a thought.

As I mentioned to Maries there are solicitors who will give a free initial consultation which should at least give you some ammunition to use against the original lot!

Maries I said my piece, for what it was worth, and intended to let well alone. I have just clicked on this thread again by mistake – twitchy finger – but while I was here I thought I might just as well read what other grannies had suggested. However, something in one of your posts has caught my eye.

"We all worked out intestecy [sic] would leave everyone better placed (no contested wishes) and the tax is being got round in other ways.

You must be very careful about tax. Whether there is a will or someone dies intestate, a realistic value of the estate has to be submitted to Revenue and Customs even if inheritance tax will not be incurred. Revenue and Customs do not have to accept the estimate if it is thought to be unrealistic. Any attempt to conceal the required information will end in tears, even if it is not discovered until much later. The sentence that I have quoted above is on a public forum and anyone can read it, including tax inspectors. I am sure that fraud is the very last thing on your mind but that is what this sentence implies. Of course, you may be "getting round" the tax by the wholly legal means of your mother giving you and your brother the maximum amount allowed each year while she is still alive and this counts against inheritance tax depending on the number of years between the gift and her death.

What's more, you really should ask your mother to have a Lasting Power of Attorney drawn up so that you and any siblings can take care of her affairs if she should become incapacitated.

A reputable solicitor will charge about £150 + VAT to draw up a will and advice will be given during this process. I know this as I've just been through this less than a week ago.

They're not all lining their pockets, you must be thinking of litigation law. I'd think this money well spent.

Barrow, we have thought about complaining to the Law Society but we would have to get all the others to agree which will be a problem because some of them are very old and infirm and three have died in the last year. Their shares will go to their estates but we obviously don't know who they are so we would have to appoint someone to trace them. I can't see any of the others agreeing to that.

Everyone who was a direct descendant has been traced. We were the last - I got the letter three years ago next month. The others have been waiting for nearly five years!!

The solicitors are just dithering on purpose because they can run up costs every time one of us contacts them to ask what's going on and they then have to send out thirty letters giving the latest excuse.

I think we just have to sit tight.

merlotgran If you think the Solicitors are using delaying tactics you could make a complaint to the Law Society. Of course with so many people due to inherit getting everyone together could be a problem. Are there one or two people who could speak for you all? If so I would ask for a meeting with the Solicitors and get a complete run down of what they have done, what the continuing delay is and a realistic date they anticipate settling the estate.

To be fair some intestate estates can be very complicated and take some time to work out. Have the Solicitors made an interim payment to the beneficiaries? After three years I think it highly unlikely they are still trying to trace beneficiaries so an interim payment could be made.

maries. You are wrong if you think your mother dying intestate will save money. I am still waiting, after three years, to inherit some money from my father's cousin who died intestate. He was a very wealthy man and so far solicitors have hoovered up nearly £500,000. Everytime we (there are forty of us due to inherit) ask why we have not yet received any money, they come up with more delaying tactics.

I wrote about this some time ago (on another thread) and believe me, it's incredibly stressful knowing a legal firm cares nothing about you. They just want your money!

Always make a will.

I agree with the other posters. Making a Will, if you have substantial assets, is definitely better than intestacy.

A lot of solicitors will give a free initial consultation - your local Law Society could advise you which ones.

In your position I wouldn't wait any longer but get legal advice as soon as possible.

Legally the only grounds for divorce is 'irretrievable breakdown' of the relationship for which adultery is one form of evidence. A family trust might be one way to tie up the inheritance so that the wife can't get her hands on it but this would have to be handled by a solicitor and if you don't want to do this, so be it.

Maries totally agree with getting proper legal advice on this. In a somewhat similar situation my Mother left my brother's 'share' to me. We agreed verbally that I would, in due course, hand it over. Obviously there needs to be total trust between the family for this to work. I don't think that being divorced will protect your brother as assets, even from a family inheritence can be targeted long after any divorce. Completely wrong IMO. Good luck!

maries I can't comment on your brother's situation as I have no legal background, but two points:
1. it is madness not to make a will and will cost you far more in the long run.
2. Not all members if the legal profession are money-grabbing individuals out to line their own pockets. Some if them, including all the ones I have ever dealt with, have been honest, ethical professional people who have worked in my best interests .
Solicitors are obliged to give you an estimate of what their services will cost and there is a complaints service via the Law Society if you are dissatisfied.
To re-iterate, I have no personal connection with the legal profession.
Remember that the price of a service is not be same as its value.

absentgran was more tactful than I was. Sorry to snap, Maries, but I do believe that you need to do something more here than sitting back and letting this woman take over.

Good luck.

Maries Sorry, I stand corrected. However, I do think consulting a solicitor about a divorce on the grounds of unreasonable behaviour would be advisable.

I would also urge your mother to consult a solicitor about making a will. Intestacy is rarely the best option.

Good luck.

I withdraw from the discussion. You will do exactly what you want to - nothing.

Why did you ask for advice?

It sounds as though your mother has not yet made a will. I would urge her to do that as soon as she can using a professional to draw it up so that what happens is exactly what she intends

Your SIL will shoot peas through a DIY will, and if there is no will at all, you are all in for a long tedious process which costs money and satisfies no-one (except perhaps greedy SIL)