EU - in or out?

Felice: So what about people now resident in NZ, Australia and Canada who have paid taxes and NI in the UK for many years? Paying tax and NI here for a long time does not entitle them to any benefits or NHS treatment if they return. They are also British citizens, holding British passports. If you hold a British passport and have British citizenship then you could not be prevented from returning here even if we were not in the EU any longer, surely? Even if, as you say, you don't want to?

Lets just stick to the matter in hand shall we

Let's not.

I was referring, * felice* to the current status of Australia - not going back centuries.

When I moved to the Isle of Man, the UK Child Benefit was stopped even though I had worked and paid taxes all of my working life - I had to claim Manx Child Benefit (from a system I had never paid into) - and the Isle of Man is one of the British Isles!

Presumably, felice, you are rather biased as you live in another EU country and wouldn't want to be forced to return to the UK, which you seem to think would happen if the UK left the EU. Would you have a vote in an IN/OUT referendum, just out of interest?

Probably not. We lived in Germany when the referendum on Common Market membership took place in 1975 and weren't allowed a vote.

Unison are going on strike, too. It's the union most caretakers are in.

All parties in this country want they TTIP apart from the green party.
The TTIP vote will take place before the vote on EU membership. Therefore, unless the greens help, we will have to go along with the US anyway. SO WE WILL STILL BE PART OF THE TTIP WHETHER WE ARE IN THE EU OR NOT. WE WILL STILL BE RULED BY THE US. UNLESS WE STOP THE EU FROM RATIFYING IT.
Sorry to shout, but I have written this before, and people on here do not take any notice, apart from Eloethan.

I took notice! Signed a petition a while ago, 38 degrees I think.

Well, I don't know what else to do, having signed a petition a while ago. If I shout on here it won't make a jot of difference.

Nothing makes a jot of difference as it all trundles on like an enormous juggernaut. There will, in all probability, not be a referendum either.

I doubt there'll be a referendum - this time. But, if we all keep shouting it'll happen maybe next time. It won't matter though because, as Jen says we'll be under the thumb of the USA by then and they'll pull Brussels strings!

It's all down to unscrupulous powermongers. A bit like the Middle East in a way. Only we sign petitions and they go out and shoot someone.

Perhaps all the Don't Knows are right. We're all doomed!

Although really I think there is hope. If enough people protest things do get done. What happens in the rest of Europe isn't given much precedence in our media but there is a lot of anti EU feeling now in France, Holland, Greece, Spain, ...... DC may be alone at the moment in wanting reform but other leaders will have to follow as pressure grows. We could maybe even end up with something more akin to the Common Market!!

I would only have a vote if I owned property in the UK and was on the Electoral role, which many of the uk passport holders living in the EU are not, which as i pointed out previously is a substantial number of people.

With regard to Australia i do know a bit about the situation there as my xMil lives there and is an Australian citizen, we visited a lot and when FIL was due to retire an offer was made to us, they would gift the house they were living in,5 bedroom bungalow to us and X would take over the Singer sewing machine centre which FIL owned, it was a successful business and X had a similar business in the UK. We applied to emigrate, and were immediately turned down,me, too old at 35, X did not have a formal college qualification accepted by the Oz authorities, he is South African with british parents and a british passport, the only member of the family who would be accepted was Autistic DS1 who was studying Theology at the time. I have a very good uni degree and a diploma in Community Education, and was working in that field at the time. The business closed, 4 part-time staff losing their jobs.
XMIL worked for the local council and arranged an appeal for us, we were told the business was not a necessary one and there were no suitable jobs for me in the area.

Canada is not the land of milk and honey as friends of mine from Toronto would be very happy to tell you. Anyway you need visas etc to work in these countries, you cannot just arrive in them and get a job the way you can in the EU. The situation is completely different and cannot be compared. Oh and Xmil gets her state UK pension every month although she left the uk in 1955 and is an Australian citizen. Perhaps you can explain that one????

SO WE WILL STILL BE PART OF THE TTIP WHETHER WE ARE IN THE EU OR NOT. WE WILL STILL BE RULED BY THE US. UNLESS WE STOP THE EU FROM RATIFYING IT.

But these directives are coming from the EU - if the UK isn't in the EU it doesn't have to support EU decisions. This is what happens when countries sign away their rights to make their own decisions. There is little you can do about TTIP as the Greens are not big enough to make a difference.

With regard to Australia i do know a bit about the situation there as my xMil lives there and is an Australian citizen

I also know a bit about it as my brother moved there over 40 years ago on the assisted passage deal. My brother wants my my mother to go and live with him but unless she can prove a level of income that shows she won't become a drain on the Australian economy, they will not allow her to move there even if my brother vouches that he can support her (this is what he's told me) due to her age (non-employable).

Perhaps you can explain that one????

I have just googled for info and found this regarding British people with Australian citizenship:

We also left the UK in 1974, but did not become eligible for a pension until until 1995. Like ***, we also had worked in the UK for approximately 10 years. I think you will find that when you apply for your UK pension, that pension amount will be pegged at the rate it was when you left the UK. Our payments work out at £38.40 a week, averaging out at the current exchange rates, over a 3 month period, at $224.00 a month each. Hope this helps.

No wonder the pension rules in the UK have changed.

MIL had worked 1 year in Uk she left at 18, went first to SA then to OZ.

Hollydaze One of my friends had a daughter in Oz, and another who was thinking of emigrating there. She told me she could have joined her daughters, as she would then have had no relatives in the UK.

In the event, the second daughter decided against going.

I did wonder Elegran if my brother was trying to shirk his responsibilties but as it turned out, my mother didn't want to live in Australia. She said she wants to stay in her own home in an area that she loves dearly and surrounded by the neighbours and friends that she's had for over 30 years and I can understand that. Many years ago, I asked her to come and live here but she declined that as well for the same reason. However, she now has dementia and although it is being controlled well, I do think the time will come when she has to accept that living on her own may not be in her best interests.

It may have been that if you were in the UK, your mother would not have been accepted. My friend would have had no-one at all in this country if her second daughter had emigrated.

I thought that they should both have gone out, as the first daughter and her family had a great life, and these were the only grandchildren.

When we had the origial vote on entry into the Common Market as it was then, I wrote and asked advice from my brother who had lived in France for a number of years. His advice was a resounding "Yes" for very valid reasons of trade and commerce. The present day is totally far removed from those days and Brussells has taken excessive powers and Human Rights has become a absolute farce, preventing what in most peoples' mind is justice and fair play. We are being dictated to on how to live our lives which is something I very much resent. At the moment I would not think twice about voting to come out as quickly as possible. However .... I think opinions are very much a generational thing and the younger generation see opportunities beyond our shores and I think, would vote to remain in. David Cameron MUST stick to his guns and negotiate hard to revoke some of the legislation imposed on us and not waver from his determination to make us properly British again. If he was successful, I would reconsider.

Sad,that because we have a different opinion to yours that we have to be called Little Englanders..........

Felice, two-thirds of my DC live in Australia and we visit often . No matter what qualifications you have and how wonderful they may seem in the UK, if they do not require your particular discipline, area of expertise etc, they will not allow you to emigrate there ( unless you can fund yourself). 45 is the usual cut-off point, not 35.

One year working visas are allowed up to the age of 30, you can apply for another year at the end of this time if you have done a certain amount of farm work (88 days I believe) although this rule may be relaxed.
Thereafter you can apply for a permanent visa on various grounds which may or may not be granted.

I believe this is correct, if not then I will stand corrected.

Yes, the pension is pegged at the rate when you emigrated to Australia; it is not pegged in the EU.
However, this is probably better than a lot of our Australian friends who receive nothing as their income or assets are above the level to receive a state pension - despite paying in so I am told!

Grannyjilly - you are only a Little Englander if you read the Daily Mail!

I don't think so, rosequartz - they seem to be going for the OUT vote. It was a certain GN member who used the term on this thread...although he hasn't posted on it recently!

rosequartz I'd rather the United States of Europe than USA. We ARE Europeans.
And I don't know why we persist with driving on the left and keeping the £.