Hidden Cameras in Care Homes.

A camera inside the smoke alarm is hardly noticeable and people don't look up much. (The smoke alarm still works.)

I would have thought the problem was for the elderly person. I like privacy and wouldn't want someone, even close to me, watching me all the time.
I think you need it as a last resort, if you have grave suspicions, and want the truth.

It seems a shame that people should be forced to such lengths. It should be the case that concerns raised are taken seriously and the SSD and the home should have a proper protocol for dealing with these concerns.

We had a similar problem with my father - I will not go through them again - and I went back to the CCQ and the home and the SSD and the NHS who were funding his place. I did of course also get him out of there! I wasn't prepared to wait for the slow processes to grind on.

Poor Dad - I miss him.

I wouldn't hesitate had the scenario applied to me and mine and I was concerned for my parents welfare.

I think there is a case that sometimes not all is as it appears. I think that dealing with say a dementia patient who has a violent, aggressive manner, lord knows not through any fault of their own, can require an 'assertive' level of handling . I do believe that this is different from the horror videos we have seen and there is a clear case of abuse and neglect in those cases and it is upto the family, management and staff to ensure a clients care is good.

If I was a member of staff I think I would welcome cameras to prove my innocence if ever I was accused of abuse or neglect so I see them as a win win scenario all round. Sad to think that way, yes.

I heard someone on R4 today saying that we should insist that every person in care, residential or home based, should have a have a CCTV camera monitoring them!!!.

Of course if you solidly based reasons for suspecting abuse then there is good reason to invade someone's privacy and install them, but otherwise it is an a abuse of their human rights to privacy to have them constantly monitored.

This fact did not seem to have occurred to the advocate of constant monitoring.

Absolutely would, no hesitation.

I would.

I would class it as looking after them.

There is the matter of privacy and dignity for the elderly person - for instance, if they have to receive personal care. However, if I was really concerned that something untoward was happening, I would install a secret camera.

I do agree with POGS' point that sometimes people with dementia can be confused, uncooperative and aggressive and it must be difficult to deal with. I do not excuse deliberately cruel or unprofessional behaviour, but I do think that heavy workloads, challenging working conditions and under staffing create the conditions where poor practice is more likely to occur.

In Dad's case it was not cruelty but neglect. A young care assistant was a fiend of my nephew and told him what was happening. Staff would turn his buzzer off so that he was trapped in a single room at the top of the building with no way of getting the care he needed. He could not get out of his chair and was in pain. His room was a nuisance to get to. The young assistant left - she was very young and did not feel brave enough to whistle blow. There were lots of other problems too.

You do not have to be beaten up to be badly treated.

I never thought about the idea of a camera - I just got him out at the first hint of trouble.

If you could look into the future and see yourself as the patient in this situation, wouldn't you disregard a bit of invasion of privacy if it would prevent you being ill-treated?

I have worked with people with dementia and I know it would be obvious on a recording if a measure was being taken because there was no option, due to the person's own behaviour, or whether it was actually ill-treatment.

I'm not in favour of observation of all, tho, only if there is genuine concern that they are being ill-treated.

I heard on the radio this morning that the CQC said that you had to discuss it with the care home manager before installing the cameras. As the person being interviewed said, it sort of defeats the object.

The CQC are a real damp squib.

It will be a case of privacy/human rights versus safeguarding. Wouldn't like to bet on which one one would win. All the cameras in the world won't pick up on verbal and mental abuse and there sure is plenty of that.

If you feel it's necessary to install a camera, invasion of privacy is no longer an issue.

As for discussing it with the care home manager? Like Mishap says, it defeats the object and you run a real risk of recrimination.

Mum told me the buzzers were turned off in her home. I didn't believe her at first but then caught them at it and complained. I used to call in at different times. - including on one occassion 5.30 in the morning (we were going away). I know a chap used to pop in late at night as he worked away. Visitors coming often and at any time - and talking to each other (we had monthly meetings) kept them on their toes fairly well.

I think hidden cameras should be used only as a last resort and preferably with the patients(?) knowledge. i'd hate to think there may be a danger of relatives thinking they can keep an eye on gran without having to visit.

I was thinking of cameras being installed as a matter of course merlotgran not by individual families. I think the nursing homes would fight it all the way.

I'm sure you're right, Juliette. I found home managers were only concerned with the admin and the care managers had an answer for everything.

Yes, they can talk themselves out of a paper bag. I could write a book about it all.

I hope they won't be necessary, because of Eloethan's last point - the carers are under enough pressure without adding more. Poor pay is another factor. It will get to the point where no-one will work in a care home, then what will happen? Families will have to look after their oldies at home, as most do in France.
My Mum was in a lovely small care home, the staff were very kind, food cooked on the premises etc, but it had to close down because of rising costs due to new regulations (many of which were unnecessary.)
I think it's pretty shocking really, would you like to do the kind of chores the carers have to do knowing you were being filmed? Hopefully most do the job because they "Care."

I've worked in a hospital ward and in care homes. As a worker, I would have no problem with being filmed.

Yes, the pay is appalling for the importance of the work they do. It's a worthy job, looking after our vulnerable and elderly. And worthy of a decent wage.

Better pay would perhaps attract more people to take on this work, so employers would have more choice who they emply. But there will always be those who are bullies and prey on others. The recent report about 'whistleblowers' in the NHS shows these kind of people are to be found in every position from the well paid to minimum wages.

Leopards don't change their spots and sometimes they influence others around them to behave in the same way.

In the part of the country, where I was, the pay wasn't too bad but there were bullies among the staff all the same. They know all the right things to say at interview of course and can flannel their way out of most things.

In my experience, nurses were more likely to bully than care workers (I was only a nurse auxiliary, with no medical training).
I think that is because nurses are more likely to be focused on 'getting things done' without too much concern for being nice to the patients, especially if the patients are in a confused state.

FarNorth I agree about being able to sell themselves at interview, in fact some people simply lie. That is when I only ever took on new staff with a 6 month probation period. This was made clear in the Job Description. I did refuse to re-employ one person after the 6 months and I was so glad I had that option.