Cameron - a "shrewd & malevolent psychopath"?

But I am the undecided middle grumppa and I join in. I am pretty sure other gransnetters who are in the middle join in too.

I really dont get why head-banging makes people feel better! But whatever. If it does, it does.

[I didnt understand what the dialogue of the deaf bit meant]

Because no-one is going to be listening to anyone else's points?

I've been a floating voter all along, and I'm interested in others' viewpoints. Anyone who is not interested can just ignore the threads.

Don't we debate because whichever party is in government they are acting on our behalf so we need to understand what the issues are without just agreeing automatically with said government [whoever they may be and whoever we actually voted for]. Just because someone votes for a party it doesn't mean they have to agree with everything that party does and should therefore listen to reasoned arguements against any policies that are going to be implemented. No one actually goes out of their way to disagree with a policy that they think is a good one or defend a policy because their party of choice thinks it's a good idea. Or am I missing the point [it is rather late and I am tired].

A couple of very big problems for the Tories now which need debating.
Osborne said that pensions would be freed up; pension companies are saying no deal.
He is also trying to pass a new law to say that no future government can borrow money except in exceptional circumstances. That means he will not be able to borrow for infrastructure, or if there is another banking crisis or to pay our pensions.

Discuss. I'm off to bed.

Re the point about Royal Mail. After 2010 postage prices rose quite significantly. There were increases in postal prices in 2012, 2013 and 2014 and at the end of March this year the price of a first and second class stamps rose again to 63p and 54p respectively.

On the news a couple of nights ago it was suggested that Royal Mail is increasingly looking as if it will be unable to honour its obligation to make deliveries to every address in the UK, even those off the beaten track, at a flat rate price.

In 2011 a Daily Mail article warned of possible problems if the Royal Mail was sold:

"Holland was the world's postal privatisation trailblazer, transforming its state-owned postal service to a private corporation in 1989."

"..........Privatisation in Holland has also led to the closure of around 90 per cent of the country's post offices ....... In the space of just one month in 2009, ten per cent of all Holland's post offices closed."

" .......Complaints about the reliability of Holland's privatised post are widespread."

".......The move was supposed to increase competition and lead to better services. But the opposite has occurred. New firms paying workers below the minimum wage have hit deep into the profits of TNT."

So if you're looking for a better value, more efficient service it seems that privatisation will not necessarily provide it.

Thinking about Gideon's new law to be, the Micawber law, as the Guardian calls it, treasury figures show that in only seven of the past 50 years have governments run a surplus, and three of those were when Gordon Brown was chancellor.
Fancy Gideon wanting to emulate Gordon!

The new law seems to be based on good Keynesian thinking Jen. I am no fan of GO; I think he is probably the most political of Chancellors so do not trust him. However, what he appears to be saying is that, in the good times we save and in the bad we draw on the savings in order to invest, not on borrowing. As I say, a view JMK would be very happy with and one all parties seemed to favour at one time or another. It would still leave each party to decide what they prioritised in the spending.

The elephant in the room is that we do not currently have a balanced economy and the question is how GO intends to get us to that point. He still hasn't explained although I expect the upcoming budget will enlighten us.

Wasn't it Thatcher who got rid of Keynesian thinking?

Losing £13 billion on the sale of RBS shares does not sound very balanced to me.

It's fine if you'd like to give a bargain to the purchaser.

He wouldn't, would he? And short change all those hardworking taxpayers?

"Wasn't it Thatcher who got rid of Keynesian thinking?"

I think it was Jen. "The market" has been king for some years now and the swerve in that direction seemed to loose the macro-economics on the way. Having said that, what do I know, I wish I had done economics but I didn't

Gracesgran I wouldn't worry too much about not having done economics. I met a lecturer in economics at a People's Assembly meeting a year or so ago and she said that there is a growing feeling that the economics being taught in university is not fit for purpose.

www.theguardian.com/commentisfree/2013/oct/28/economics-students-neoclassical-theory

If you're interested the above link expands on that opinion.

Thank you for the link Eloethan. Wow, that is stunning. I can't believe the Economics degrees do not have a dissertation. Surely the point of any degree is to learn to reflect and analyse at a higher level and the dissertation shows how much you can think rather than how much you can regurgitate. I am shocked that this has been allowed to happen and do believe that how it is set up will stifle new thinking.

Eloethan, are you going on the People's Assembly march on 20th?

No - we're going on holiday to Cornwall with the family on the 20th.

Bad timing, or maybe good timing depending on how close you live to the march.

Interesting article about the Royal Mail sell-off. It's been done already. That was quick, but I suppose if you are selling something to your friends and do not want the general public to know too much about it, that's the way to do it.

voxpoliticalonline.com/2015/06/14/fury-at-royal-mail-sell-off-as-public-left-in-the-dark-over-who-bought-750m-worth-of-shares-mirror-online/

Ah well- Mail gone, just a bank to go, then Dave and George's mates will be laughing all the way to the bank we used to own. How else could you buy a majority share in something, with someone elses money, to get it out of the S--t. Wait till it turned the corner and then sell it off without even making the money you spent.

Maybe GN-ers who think the Conservatives are just the ones to sort out the economy for us, could explain it?
And I promise not to snipe or howl or anything else unpleasant so don't be shy, people.

It doesnt seem right at all.

Perhaps they could explain this as well, FarNorth, while they are about it.

www.theguardian.com/politics/2015/jun/14/tory-welfare-cuts-would-hit-poorest-third-of-uk-families-research-shows

Does Osborne have any friends left?

At least the Royal Mail share price has not shot up like it did the last time. They were sold for £5 each, and have since come down to £4.94, so the companies that bought them will not have made a killing yet.

Here's another interesting article about Thatcher's economics.

www.theguardian.com/business/economics-blog/2015/jun/10/growth-what-growth-thatcherism-fails-to-produce-the-goods

I bet Cameron and Osborne do not read it.

An article about Cameron's speech on the Magna Carta.

www.politics.co.uk/blogs/2015/06/15/cameron-has-betrayed-every-principle-he-mentions-in-his-magn

Shows just how hypocritical the man is.