The EU - we are on the home straight folks!

Good point, Welshwife. If they can't blame Brussels, who will they blame?

I know jane10 it is utterly depressing. It seems that it is going to boil down to voters making their mind up on hyperbole, and lies.

The most important decision we shall ever make and something that will effect future generations let alone our children, and it boils down to that.

Why can't they be made to get rid of dishonest information?
The brexiters £350 million a week is a case in point.
They have been told it is wrong so many times, but still seem to be using it. On one bus I noticed it said £70 million a day.
Still the same lie.

They are settling on immigration as the best bet to get votes.

We'd also probably have a complete melt down in the Tory party with a leadership challenge and probably a general election. They are probably hoping for one anyway - before the corruption chickens (see other thread) come home to roost. Johnson et al seem to be lining themselves up for some kind of coalition with UKIP judging by their straight-from-the-UKIP-leaflet thoughts on immigration. So political chaos with lots of angry Remain voters in and out of the Tory party...

This evening Laura Kuenssberg asked Boris if he could guarantee that migration would lesson if the UK left the EU. Got a tad flustered and then he said it would depend on the UK Govt whether it did or not.starting to back track already.

Completely wrong, but there's no persuading some people that immigration is not the big problem they say it is.
People who think it is do not watch the right programmes or read the right papers.
They need someone to ask the brexiters about their EU credentials, and what they are doing here if immigration is such a problem.

Did you see admitting that brexit was wrong on the NHS funding, and on when things would change after the vote if Brexit win?
He was just backtracking on everything.

Sorry, missed out Chris Grayling from that. He is quite invisible most of the time!

indy100.independent.co.uk/article/would-you-get-into-the-uk-under-an-australianstyle-pointsbased-immigration-system--Zk5S57FFmW

A quiz for you. Would you get in?

indy100.independent.co.uk/article/everyone-should-read-this-mans-brilliant-rant-about-emigration-from-britain--Zy5EIDFaBe

I find the whole thing incredibly depressing, especially when people admit they don't know anything about politics, object to being spoken down to and vote because they don't like certain individuals, despite having voted for them in the past.

This isn't about individuals or the silly games some members of the Conservative party are playing. It's so important and I really wonder what future historians will make of it.

I truly believe that if the UK leaves, it will be making the biggest mistake for decades. It's just so wrong on so many levels and BREXITers are getting away with outrageous lies. It doesn't do much for my faith in humanity.

And me

It is so wrong on every level. I just wonder how they think their life is going to change. It will be all too late when they realize they have been lied to and treated like idiots.

It actually undermines my beliefs about the whole democratic process and makes me question why on earth people vote as they do in any election. So many people just don't seem to grasp the issues or question what they're told.

So, people don't vote the way you want them to! what a cheek eh?There is the massive assumption that anyone who wants to leave the EU doesn't 'understand' and can't ' grasp the issue'
Well, yes they do actually, which is why they will be voting for OUT.Do the Remain camp question what they are told ?
If this was a referendum about joining the EU, hardly anyone would vote for it.

Some people have just grabbed onto one reason that they do not like and throwing all others away and just deciding they are outers instead of weighing things up. I believe they either cannot be bothered to read/watch the serious reports or are not able to fully understand the implications of leaving. I do not like Cameron or the Tories and I do get it that they are exaggerating things a tad but they are preferable to lying Farage and dopey Boris. They all think they are still at the school debating stage and can say outrageous things. It has got too nasty now for sensible debate - we have been democratic enough to allow the Brexiters to give their views on this thread but I have been shouted at for putting a post on their thread - not quite so democratic are they - and shouting is always the sign if a loser!!

I think in a bazaar way it shows how the voter is constantly manipulated by the media and politicians.
It brings into sharp relief the level of lies and deception told by the elite. It is usually much more veiled, but this referendum has shone a light on exactly what happens

And before an outer moans my post covers all sides in that observation

Welshwife that was somebody joking with you on the other thread.We are ALL allowed on any thread.However a note of pomposity has crept in on this thread about
Anyone voting to leave.

I agree with you WW the whole thing has been a shambles.

I think the problem is that the propaganda was allowed to start too early, which is why many people have given up watching anything to do with it.
The Brexiters are going to be found out from now on, but most people will not care.

Go on the other thread, roses, if you think this one is too pompous.
The other one is for the brexiters, after all.

I think not Roses - I do realise that we can all post on any thread but I do not wish to spoil their moaning and groaning. I just hope that should there be an out result we are not all bitterly regretting the choice soon afterwards - but I fear that would be the case.

Oh I like to spread myself around Djen

Well it would be ridiculous if someone ignored something that was patently untrue, on either side. You simpy can't have mental inflexibility over something so important.