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Could Labour 'split'. Tom Watson calls off talks.

(1000 Posts)
POGS Sat 09-Jul-16 11:42:10

It is being reported Labour Deputy Leader Tom Watson has called off 'talks's with the Unions/Len McCluskey over Jeremy Corbyns future and refusal to 'stand down'. He is being reported as saying 'There is no realistic prospect of reaching a compromise'

Obvious signs have been there , (noted from the beginning of Corbyn becoming leader for political anoraks) but is this perhaps a challenge that 'if' it does happen might just 'split' Labour into the Parliamentary Labour Party and another group finally calling themselves 'Momentum' as an official opposition party?

There have been a few voices suggesting a Labour Leadership challenge could happen on Monday 'maybe' they are correct.

Interesting to watch.

Anya Sat 09-Jul-16 12:02:43

I would think that is a possibility. Labour voters need to know exactly where their party stands on important issues, and, what possibility there is of Labour being elected to implement these policies.

Anniebach Sat 09-Jul-16 12:17:08

As a party member of many years I am now fed up with this circus. If Corbyn wants it all his own way then he should start a new party with his groupies Momentum. This will give party members a choice. I am a pacifist and want rid of trident but this is not wanted by the majority of the country and I have to accept this . I campaigned against the Iraq war but didn't leave the party. Good came from the Blair government years too. Labour MP's are quite aware of the fact the Tory press will concentrate on disagreements in the Labour Party and play down the back stabbing in the Tory party.

POGS Sat 09-Jul-16 12:41:47

I am not expecting much of a response on this thread but I wonder how many people actually know about Momentum?

I know I had a few posts between myself and another poster whom I believe could be a member , maybe she or others have some insight if they have attended meetings.

To my mind the fact Momentum was started by Lansman to 'support Jeremy Corbyn' and 'encourage mass mobilisation' was always viewed as a ' party within a party ' and within a very short period of time it has proven to be exactly that
A PARTY WITHIN A PARTY and it could well split the Labour Party .

JessM Sat 09-Jul-16 13:18:43

I think if the impasse cannot be resolved the anti-Corbyn faction will have to put up a credible candidate to replace him. Assuming Corbyn were to stand it is likely that the membership would vote him back in. I can assure you that the more centrist ground is not that popular with members in my area.
Momentum may be popular in certain cities and is reputed to have a membership of 12,000 which is a very small number set against the several hundred thousands of Labour Party members who prefer a more traditional way of doing things.
To split off Momentum would presumably also need Jeremy Corbyn to go with it and be their leader, which he would not necessarily choose to do. He has, after all, been a loyal member party member for an awful long time.

obieone Sat 09-Jul-16 13:27:05

I posted on the Labour haemorrhaging thread, not realising that this thread had been started. So I repost it.

Is it possible that there are 3 different camps in the Labour Party?
The Corbynites, the Blairites, and those like Ab who are now not in either camp?

Anniebach Sat 09-Jul-16 13:28:02

Angela Eagle is to stand against Corbyn, Owain Jones not said anything yet

Anniebach Sat 09-Jul-16 13:37:51

obieone, I have never been in any camp, I am a member of the Labour Party . Yes I have voted at all leadership elections, not always chosen the MP elected leader , have stayed with the party because of the core values . I do not expect a Labour Party of the thirties but I do want a leader who realises we are not in the thirties. Yes there is much poverty , homeless, food banks, zero hours contracts , seriously lack of housing. I agree with Corbyns views in these but nothing can be done to solve them by staying in oposition .

Badenkate Sat 09-Jul-16 14:36:51

DH and I had this conversation anniebach and he was horrified when I said that at the moment I was so depressed about what had gone on in the last few weeks that I didn't really care about anybody. I didn't see why I should exert any more energy since to me at the moment the country seems to be heading faster and faster to somewhere I am not interested in going. I'm sure this horrifies you just as much and you will let me know in your usual acerbic manner - but I am finding it very difficult to pick myself up and get on with life. I am worried about the way I'm feeling because this is very unusual for me.

Anniebach Sat 09-Jul-16 14:48:46

BadenKate, many feel as you do, it is a frightening time , I am deeply concerned and at times tearful , I send you a hug

Anniebach Sat 09-Jul-16 14:50:53

Am listening to Corbyns speech from the miners gala, why didn't he put even half as much effort and energy into the remain campaign

Badenkate Sat 09-Jul-16 14:57:03

Thank you anniebach, I feel in need of all the hugs I can get sad

POGS Sat 09-Jul-16 15:24:36

Ah, the Durham Miners Gala.

I asked about this on the Corbyn thread but received no response.

Did any Northern Labour MP's share the platform with Corbyn in the end, Kevan Jones, Pat Glass, Roberta Blackman -Woods, etc.. The 'traitors' as they have been called for voting 'no confidence' in Corbyn were uninvited from sharing the platform.

Statement on 132nd Durham Miners' Gala

by Davey Hopper
on July 04, 2016
Contrary to recent press reports, Labour MPs who refused to support Jeremy Corbyn in the recent vote of confidence have not been "banned" or "barred" from attending this year's Gala. The Gala is a public event which anyone can attend.

However, the invitations to attend the official Durham Miners’ Association events and functions, stand on the balcony of the County Hotel and grace the platform on the Racecourse have been rescinded.

Statement by the Durham Miners Association.

"Jeremy Corbyn is a guest of the Durham Miners’ Association at this year’s Gala and we will not allow those who have sought to humiliate him and undermine the democratic process in the Labour Party the honour of taking part in the aforementioned Gala traditions.

Dave Hopper, General Secretary, Durham Miners' Association
Monday 4th July 2016

Definitely a divided party.

Beammeupscottie Sat 09-Jul-16 15:33:50

Wasn't the plot of The Omen about the rise of the Anti-Christ when the usual political parties were in disarray? We should be afraid - very afraid.

POGS Sat 09-Jul-16 15:39:33

Who is the anti Christ. Corbyn, Sturgeon, Theresa May, Junker?

You watch too many horror films.

Beammeupscottie Sat 09-Jul-16 15:46:59

This was the last one I watched, as I am too old to have my blood pressure hiked by fear!
I think the Anti-Christ was a man who came out of nowhere, A Charismatic man who wanted power and won the people over,which was really my point.

POGS Sat 09-Jul-16 15:50:32

Well I hope he isn't Tom Watson .

Beammeupscottie Sat 09-Jul-16 15:52:10

Tom Watson strikes me as charmless.

Anya Sat 09-Jul-16 16:24:58

Well happily there is a notable lack of charisma in any of our politicians, so we are safe ....for the moment.

Could it have been Hitler hmm ??

trisher Sat 09-Jul-16 16:49:58

Watched a Labour MP on TV going on about how the party members were responsible for the split and not the MPs. It seemed to me that what they failed to realise is that they are appointed to serve the public and if they are at odds with the party members they have a responsibility to find out what their constituents want and not team up with other MPs for some sort of Machiavellian take over. She didn't once mention going to her constituency to discuss things.
Pleased about the Durham Gala only asking Corbyn and uninviting the rest.

yggdrasil Sat 09-Jul-16 16:56:29

<Am listening to Corbyns speech from the miners gala, why didn't he put even half as much effort and energy into the remain campaign> Anniebach

I know people who saw him in Bristol, and there he did. But it wasn't on the TV.
Remember though he was working with Cameron, and therefore had to be a bit restrained. It wouldn't do to point out all the things the EU was being slated for were actually the Tory party policy.

Anniebach Sat 09-Jul-16 17:01:33

What is the point of Corbyn declaring at the miners gala that the party should unite and he said this when other MP's had been prevented from attending. He should have been more truthful and said the Party should unite behind me , doesn't matter I didn't keep the Labour Party agreement that we were against Brexit . He wouldn't share a platform with others during the Brexit campaign, MP's who disagree with him are not allowed at the gala which means he will only speak when the listeners are in full agreement with him.

crun Sat 09-Jul-16 17:54:27

The party needs to split sooner rather than later, otherwise they'll just end up with a succession of unelectable Corbyns under the current voting system.

trisher Sat 09-Jul-16 17:58:17

Nothing to do with him who attends the Gala. The organisers chose to uninvite MPs as they are entirely entitled to do. Corbyn was just a guest.

Anniebach Sat 09-Jul-16 18:08:51

Trisher, as it is organised by the unions I cannot believe Corbyn was just a guest with no knowledge of the unions decisions. Do you want a leader who is protected as Corbyn is ?

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