Well that was interesting. I should say Panarama was also enlightening but not as forceful and uncompromisingly direct in it's reporting content as Dispatches.
I'm not going to simply post on the Lib Dem Thread which has turned into a Labour Thread as I think this programme summed up exactly what I have thought and have been posting since the formation of Momentum , it is a ' Party within a Party.'
I will say now to those who will see it as propaganda and take umbrage at my post you cannot argue with what you see and hear from the horses mouth, no matter how hard you might try and no doubt will.
The fact Momentum are doing all they can to play down the Momentum name in connection to the ' Jeremy for Labour ' Campaign , the use of the Unite Union office are significant, the way the reporter was paid is serious stuff and I hope there is further investigation into that. Will anybody take it up I wonder?.
Has anybody 'Cicked' on the ' Jeremy for Labour ' Campaign or answered questions on the phone in connection with it. The reason I ask is if you have you are, as I understood it, on the data base on the Jeremy For Labour Services?. Listen to what is said about it , you may not be too happy, or maybe you will of course.
There is to be fair a Momentum explanation and statement at the end of the programme but it is worth viewing to make your own mind up if you didn't catch it.
durhamjen I don't tend to quit when my rosy view of how the world should be is upset by real life pragmatism. I just fight harder for the people who don't have the same good fortune as I do, and can't afford the luxury of walking away.
I'll carry on doing that, and being a LP member, in spite of Corbyn.
If this idea of a broad church coalition took off with a fusion of lib Dems greens and labour left with the right wing of the LP continuing to pursue Tory lite policies, and forming its own party, which one would the Labour, Greens and lib Dems grans go with?
I would definately go with the fusion as I think the Labour Left has more in common with lib Dems and greens than it does the right wing.
I prefer socialism to pragmatism, Millbrook.
Pragmatism was continuing the privatisation of the NHS.
Pragmatism was bringing in student fees.
Pragmatism was PFI.
Pragmatism was lying to the public and parliament about Iraq.
I could go on. Give me Corbyn's Labour party any day as opposed to the pretence of Blair.
My parents were Tory all their lives. They voted for Blair.
Some friends were liberals. They voted for Blair. All things to all men is not socialism.
If Labour right do not get together with the left and support Corbyn, I'll stay with Corbyn. Labour right are not the party, as has just been proven by this vote.
Yes I agree with that dj. But at the same time if they can't support Corbyn and the policies for which he got voted in then it is time for the parting of the ways as the right is simply a pain in the butt and a distraction from the business if opposition.
Anyone who wants to see I, Daniel Blake for free, there's a link here.
www.showfilmfirst.com/pin/431647
Yes, all that terrible pragmatism, replacing your pure socialism - and yet your hero Corbyn didn't resign from the party did he? He didn't give up his salary and expenses, did he? He didn't bother about unity or supporting his leadership, did he?
That's fine - I have more respect for him for staying 15 years to fight for his beliefs, than if he had walked away.
But you cannot have your cake and eat it. If it was ok for Corbyn to do that then - then it is ok for Labour members and MPs - those who think he is incompetent and his hard left, unelectable, backers are wrong - to do the same now.
I am sure that in 10 years time I will still be as obsessed with (what I perceive to be) the 'pretence' of Corbyn, as you and others like you have been with Blair for the last 10 years. In the meantime I think my time is better spent working with people who are open to persuasion that he needs to go, so I am going to bow out of this thread now.
They keep saying it's Corbyn splitting the party, but they will not be able to from now on. Any split, and it'll definitely be the right of the party that causes it.
An interesting statistic.
Smith got more votes than Ed Miliband did six years ago.
Just shows the power of Corbyn.
He got nearly as many as the two of them together.
There is nothing wrong with any MP sitting on the backbenches and voting according to his conscience. What shouldn't happen is someone giving interviews to the press undermining the party leader. As for why we remember Blair the legacy of his illegal war still echoes in the Middle East. It is unlikely that Corbyn will leave such devastation behind him.
It wouldn't have done the party any good if Corbyn had left the party. It would have just left Blair to walk over the party even more.
I had another party to vote for, the Green Party, which fitted with my socialist principles just as well.
Did you feel happy voting for someone who wanted to destroy the NHS? Did you feel happy voting for the party that brought in university fees, despite all of them getting free university education?
Being right wing Labour as you are, it would probably be better for the party if you did walk away now, and let the Labour party get back to its socialist principles.
Why do you want to stay in a party that obviously doesn't suit you any more?
What a fantastic result today and even after 1/4 of People who would have voted for Corbyn were purged as part of the Coup . The attempted smearing of the Leader did nothing except make even more people vote for him , I bet they are kicking themselves lol
You criticise Corbyn for still taking his salary.
Forgive me for being cynical when you support this man.
www.theguardian.com/commentisfree/2016/sep/21/tony-blair-business-rage-labour
f77, Laura Kuennsberg is still trying her hardest to annoy him, and it's not working.
I guess the question is.....will you Corbyn supporters STILL support him when/if he loses the next General Election?
I suspect a lot of Labour voters will defect to UKIP
That will be an interesting time (2020) if we are all still here.
When he loses the general election stand by for the loss to be attatched to Blair
To answer your question rose haven't a clue. A week is a long time in politics! I expect the politicians that I support to follow the mandate for which I voted. I know the type of society in which I would like to live and in which I would like my children/grandchildren to grow up in. I therefore support the person who is most likely to deliver that type of society.
No one is under any illusion that Corbyn doesn't have an uphill struggle with the entire establishment against him, but at the minimum I am hoping that he will change the Labour Party from being Tory lite, where they accepted so much of the Tory agenda to one that I can recognise as a true alternative and opposition one which gives a fairer more equal society. He may not see the Labour Party into the next election but as sure as hell I am hoping that he can ensure change in the LP
Tbh I think that is his entire mission, and that he has no real hope of ever being PM and maybe no desire for it either.
But that means Labour being out of power for at least 9 years.
Not necessarily rose if Corbyn can bring about a fundamental change that would be brilliant and one I for one would be grateful for that.
What he lacks is the type of recognisable charisma that unfortunately seems to be a prerequisite , although I admit TM certainly can't be accused of having charisma, but her path to leadership was an oddity.
Having attended many conferences and watching the rest in tv it was sad to see a half empty hall at conference today
It will be interesting to see when she calls the election to give her a mandate. The odds are on next May.
So you are going to continue sniping rather than support him, are you, Annie?
Given that members voted 2 to 1 for Corbyn the half empty Hall was not significant.
Surely no one can possibly imagine that Labour might have the slightest chance of winning a general election next May? Must be some sort of leader election euphoria...
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