Foreigners

Puts a different perspective on this.

www.weforum.org/agenda/2016/07/which-eu-country-has-the-largest-number-of-citizens-living-overseas/?utm_content=buffercb404&utm_medium=social&utm_source=twitter.com&utm_campaign=buffer

Oh and TrueBlue I respect your oppinions and input are as valid as anyone elses.Petra wasn't criticising it from what I could tell.Just preparing you for either a withering response,or in my experience being totally blanked.

obieone Yes, I do think it's a disgrace when someone has been accepted as a citizen but is not treated equally.

I don't think someone should be preferred just because they were born in a country over someone who legally lives in a country but happened to be born elsewhere.

The answer in that case is that the person should not be accepted as a citizen in that case.

Another person should not expect to come in and grab whatever they fancy.[to be fair to Smileless2012's son, he doesnt expect that which is good.

Shudder actually that people think like Eloethan and suzied.

I have kids working in other countries but no way do they think they should take. I would hope that they give, as they are doing things that the local born people dont have the skills for.

Hmmmm! In that case, should Boris Johnson be Foreign Secretary? Surely he shouldn't have expected to grab the job - there must be loads of people just as well (or better) qualified than somebody foreign-born.

Anybody taking Australian citizenship has to pay a great deal of money, take a test and make a pledge of commitment to the country. It shouldn't matter where they were born.

Shudder all you like, obieone!

I see that Germany is sending back 10s of 1,000s of Afgan asylum seekers. Not just to Turkey but directly to Afganistan, seemingly at odds with the international convention on refugees.
And it's us who are accused of being the nasty rascist country

Two wrongs don't make a right.

The UK didn't even allow Afghan asylum seekers to enter the UK in the first place.

Can't see what all the fuss is about either. It's only like the Census.

Unemployment makes me very angry. Indigenous people over the age of 50 try to get jobs, even at minimum wages and can't. They are written off. Often ending up doing craft and selling at markets but unable to earn enough, as so many people are desperately doing it. Also for over sixties, who thought they would get their pension at 60 can't get jobs until 66 when they receive their pension. The government needs to do something. Also what about the young. They can't get jobs and if they can its call centre work even with a decent degree at a low wage.

We have not educated enough young people to become doctors, plumbers etc. It's ridiculous bringing in foreign workers when people here are crying out for work! And we are not lazy, we work more hours than any other country in Europe. Obviously there is some generalisation but there are people I know really struggling after a life time of work. You can't live on the state pension.

Obione - should someone whose parents happened to be in a different country at the time their birth be treated as a 2nd class citizen in the country where they live legally? My DIL was born in Eygypt as her parents were working there at the time, but has lived here all her life, has a British passport, works in the NHS etc - should she not have got that job? where do you draw the line here? Surely getting a job should be on merit, not where you happen to be born.

Suzied I don't agree with you. Of course people here have priority . Because there is a cost to people coming even if they earn money and of course quality of life. I am from London but now live in the south west. It's like a different country here to London.

It would be a very strange strategy to follow not to employ on merit.

Patel thinks the British worker is very lazy lyndie

When you say people here - do you mean people like my DIL (whose parents are white British BTW) who just happened to be born elsewhere but went to school, uni, is a medic, etc here should be treated less favourably than someone who happened to be born on UK soil? How would you enact such discrimination? maybe we should all get a number tattooed on our wrists.

Suzied I am not talking about people here already. I have many friends from other countries. But we have had a influx which has changed the lives of many people here adversely. Including those who immigrated here years ago. So it needs now to be controlled. We can't take in all migrants. We are a small island in huge debt. How many people should we have here before people twig it doesn't work. Would you accept another 20 million. 30 when would you stop?

People want to come here. I want a new car but I can't! I think the refugee issue is different. They need help and we should consider carefully how to deal with it.

White wave. I have worked so hard all my life and bringing up 4 children. I am still working. I am sure you have worked hard. Yes?

there are 2 different arguments going here - I didn't say we should have uncontrolled migration (does anyone?) - but the idea that we should discriminate against those who are already here legally is what I object to and what some posters seem to support.

Sorry suzied. I misunderstood. Once people are here. No second class citizens.

Smileless Is it actually enshrined in law that Australian-born applicants for teaching posts have priority over naturalised citizens?

I don't know about Australian law (DD is a teacher over there) we have the ludicrous situation in the UK where an EU nurse does not have to take an examination in English at their own expense before they can work in the NHS but Australian born nurses have to pay to take an English examination to prove they can speak English before they can work here in the NHS. £550 I believe.

We have always welcomed foreigners Apart from native Australians who were there first so has Australia!! Most Australians originate from all over the world, went for opportunities and to try for a better life.
Although I agree their present stance on refugees and would-be illegal migrants is something that needs to be addressed.

From Ana's link:
A system designed for Welsh schools to assess their pupils’ skills in English will be used by schools in England from September to decide the proficiency levels of pupils who speak a different language at home.

Currently, analysis of EAL pupil performance is binary. A child taking SATs at primary school with only basic comprehension can be in the same category as a child who speaks English fluently, simply because they both speak another language at home.

Sameena Choudry, founder of Equitable Education, which offers consultancy on reducing achievement gaps between ethnic groups, says: “EAL pupils are not homogenous. You could be comparing a fully bilingual child, daughter of a German banker, with somebody who has just come from the Czech Republic with a Roma background, or a second or third generation child where another language is spoken in the house.”

It does not sound at all sinister, rather it seems to be designed to help and make allowances in SATS assessments for children whose first language is not English.
I know from a friend how difficult it is to teach a multi-lingual class of infants in English, with the additional task of teaching them Welsh.

I hope you don't mind me using that Ana, not everyone likes links.

Of course I don't mind, Jalima - I gave the link because it's all relevant and would take too long to copy and paste!

Have other people's grandchildren had to fill in these forms?
Presumably yes, because it was first introduced in Wales and mine go to Welsh schools.

Have other people's grandchildren had to fill in these forms?
Well, to be strictly truthful, no, I expect their parents did it because, although DGD1 is very competent at writing, DGD2 can only write a few words as yet.
I don't think it is something that children should worry about, parents (and grandparents) should accentuate the positives if they ask questions and deal with any queries, not make children anxious with unfounded fears.

Washerwoman I had to fill out forms like these before joining a once a week art class, a French conversation class ..... including my sexual orientation (which I declined to answer).
I also had to fill one in about 15 years ago when working for the Civil Service - and got a printed sheet back solemnly telling me all about my country of birth, town of birth, ethnic origin, etc etc etc. As if I didn't know already! because I had just told them.