Voting quandry

ana Sorry who's telling you how to think?

Perhaps you do, whitewave, but not all of us want to be told how to think, and what's 'imperative' to you may not be to others!

I've been looking at the parties statement so far, and a couple of things strike me.

The Libs have tried to be extremely detailed but I hope that their manifest will be much more disciplined. I think that they need to focus on actual policies and costing.

The Tories talk about the Nation and pride, strong economy and investment in the NHS. No actual policies - so for me they need to provide far more information.

Labour has focused on main areas and have costed them. There are many other areas that I would like to see outlined.

None of them except perhaps the Libs have really looked at Brexit. I think it is imperative that what each party wants to see a Brexit Britain should look like before we vote.

You may not have heard of food banks before Cameron became PM, but they have certainly been around since the early 2000s and especially since the 2008 recession (when Labour was in power).

jannenewton46 ;totally agee with you regarding Nick Clegg

I have always been a labour voter, but i dont like Corbyn either, his comment about sitting down with the enemy and having a cup of tea is ridiculous, you cant reason with the unreasonable,
I will never vote Tory, i am disgusted with the way the sick and disabled are being treated, also as already mentioned the rise in retirement ages and women are suffering,not everyone can work until that age, as people get older a lot have health problems
I was talking to a lady a few days ago, whos daughter has a disease which affects her regarding walking ,shes really disabled[ cant remember the name of illness] and her mobility car was taken away, she was totally housebound, but they appealed and won, but genuine cases shouldnt have to suffer, its cruel,
I am already retired but hate to think of my daughter having to work until shes 66 or whatever age they decide on eventually,
I had never even heard of food banks until Cameron took over, and even his own mother disagreed with shutting down of first start and librarys etc,
Why are the tories targetting the older generation, and wanting them to work until they drop
What about all the young people who want jobs, but now have to be in education until they are 18,
I might vote UKIP i like Nigel Farage, he says what he thinks and doesnt care if they like it or not, but i dont like Paul Nuttall, and i dont think they have a chance anyway, because they havent set out a mandate
I dont really want to vote for any of them
Teresa May has done too many U turns for my liking, and i dont trust her
What has swayed a lot of people re; Labour is the immigration aspect of it, and not all are genuine refugees anyway
We just cant support all these people that are coming in
The NHS is in trouble , and people are suffering because of that too,
These politicians are lining their own pockets and getting huge pay rises while cutting ordinary peoples incomes
As far as im concerned the tories are a cruel party
Never voted for them never will
I know some are saying we should to keep Brexit,[i voted out] but wont under any cicumstances

As a relatively new British citizen (2012), though I have lived here for a long time, I find now that people are not voting for the party they prefer to avoid getting a party leader they do not like.

There is a problem with Corbyn in that he is not a team player. He cannot assemble a working cabinet. His cabinet is a disaster. How could he govern like that? He has a mantra and a vision, but those things do not create good government.

I do agree that the rich should be paying their fair share, but that's about all he can come up with to fund his ideas.

Good government is about compromise via debate and negotiation. Corbyn does not have these skills. Unfortunately, there are many excellent Labour MPs out there. I love our local one, but I do NOT want to do anything to put Corbyn into #10. He is a maverick and is still figuratively waving the sickle and hammer flag. You cannot magic up money to pay for things that we ALL would like to see funded. It's hard enough paying for the basics as it is. The government (as all developed nations) must borrow regularly to keep things going... I do not think the UK will ever see a surplus in their budget again regardless of who
or which party is in power. Neither will the US.

How can you vote for lib.dems when they let the students down in the coalition party with clegg

Let's not forget which party first opened the floodgates and introduced tuition fees - something even Mrs Thatcher didn't dare do at the height of her powers, and at her most rampant.

The media attack Tim Farron by asking questions about "sin". This is just mischief making and no doubt we shall see a lot more of it in the next few weeks because both Labour and Tory parties and their friends in the media are worried about the increasing popularity of the LibDems.

Funny how Theresa May, who keeps telling us how Christian she is, vicar's daughter to boot, never gets asked such irrelevant questions.

Tim Farron, like many churchgoers, is actually a secularist, believing in the separation of church and politics. He does not preach. He is not a theologian and is not running as a potential Archbishop of Canterbury or Pope.

LGBT LibDems acting chair has said "I need a leader who speaks out for LGBT rights locally, nationally and internationally. In Tim Farron, I have a leader I can absolutely trust on that score." If you can't take her word for it, watch Tim respond strongly to this silly question in the HoC -
www.mirror.co.uk/news/politics/lib-dem-leader-tim-farron-10255521

You will never find one party that supports everything you believe in and has never supported, or still supports something you do not agree with.

We have to assess the each parties whole policy platform and past performance and reckon which is the best fit.

Personally, I am most concerned about each party's underlying philosophy, roughly summarised as Conservative: a doctrinaire belief in the benevolent power of the market; Labour: a doctrinaire belief in the power of the state and Liberal Democrats; progressive and non-doctrinaire.

How can you vote for lib.dems when they let the students down in the coalition party with clegg. We have to think about the young people in this country and what they have to pay in students loans.My gd is about to start her gcse and says she won't go on to uni when she finishes 6th form college because of the debt she will have and a lot of her friends feel the same.
There are so many things that need looking at knife crime, nhs, education who is any good at dealing with that it's not just about brexit. I didn't vote to come out.
I definitely won't vote for ms may, do not trust her.

Yggdrasil, the media has always been anti labour, Corbyn is getting an easy ride compared to previous leaders.

You then state the Tories and UKIP are against labour , yesssss, they always have been, heaven help if it rains when Corbyn is making an outdoor speech , you will claim God is against Corbyn

yggdrasil

So do you honestly know who / what Yorkshire Blogger Thomas G Clarke is? Like many others you are relaying your thoughts via a blog so you must be assured you are aligning your thoughts with him / her/ it.

Laura Kuensberg was mentioned , again!, on this thread previously ,what do you make of the BBC Comment that does not agree with the BBC Trusts findings?

Agree with much of what Lazigirl has said.

The 2 main parties have drifted to each of their extremes leaving a huge vacuum in the centre with no-one to represent those who don't want a hard Brexit at one extreme or ideologically driven nationalisation at all costs.

Both of the main parties want change but I am not convinced that the changes they want will improve people's lives - quite the opposite, in fact.

Here's what we are faced with with the 3 "main" parties:

A Labour Party led by someone who cannot lead and says one thing (eg about Trident) when the party says the opposite.

A Tory party being investigated for false accounting for their election expenditure last time and who for ideological reasons want a hard Brexit regardless of how many jobs it will cost.

A LibDem party led by a born again Christian who is too weak to say that he personally is uncomfortable about gay sex but who explains that his party believes in equality regardless of sexual orientation.

I am faced with not voting at all as there is no-one/party whom I can support as a protest vote.

Anniebach, I query again that Corbyn should be labelled 'far left'. He is no more left then Wilson was, it is just the tories (thanks to ukip) have moved a long way to the right, and still claim to be centrist.

Lazigirl reminds us that "whichever party wins an election there is always a certain amount of compromise once in power"

The 2010-2015 government was the first ever peacetime coalition government in the UK and I think on the whole it was quite successful. Compromises were made.

Unfortunately the Tories and their friends who control most of the press made sure that the Liberal Democrats were blamed for the unpopular policies, especially the rise in tuition fees which was their party policy, and got no credit for the good things, eg the pupil premium, raising the income tax personal allowance, which were LibDem policies.

In spite of the dreadful damage that was done at the 2015 election, which was disastrous for the LibDems, I still believe that coalition government demonstrated that a degree of compromise and co-operation between parties can be achieved and is a good thing.

This is what happens in most mature democracies, where proportional representation ensures that all parties get their fair share of the votes and most policies are, at least to some extent, supported by parties which actually represent the majority of voters.

FPTP is unrepresentative of the views of the majority - what Hailsham (I think) called "dictatorship by a minority". That is what we have now and if the Tories get back with even more MPs whilst most people voted against the Tory Party, they are likely to become even more dictatorial and compromise with nobody. This would be a travesty of democracy.

Labour and Corbyn have too much ranged against them. Most of the press & media, all the tories and ukip, not of few of the PLP.
See this
anotherangryvoice.blogspot.co.uk/2017/01/the-laura-kuenssberg-fake-news.html
for some of what they have to put up with.
The strange thing is, you can no longer trust BBC Radio4, but the World Service is excellent, and has interviewers who listen to what they are being told before questioning its truth. Unlike the Today programme.

Ana Not true. The deputy is elected by the membership.

I could never vote Conservative because I do not believe in their ideology, but whichever party wins an election there is always a certain amount of compromise once in power, but less need for compromise if they have a very large majority. My fear is this election the Tories will win with a huge majority and have carte blanche to deliver further damage to our health, education and public services. I do think that Jeremy Corbyn is portrayed unfairly and negatively in the media, and I agree with some of his ideas, but pragmatically I do not want to belong to a party that is merely a protest party and one that never achieves power in order to change things. I am not sure whether the traditional political parties and descriptions of "left" and "right" are appropriate any more?

I never fail to be impressed by the amount of informed comment on GN. But I am also quite unimpressed about how many clearly are only interested in their own party's propaganda. I'm like many on here and no longer have any party loyalty - I was a card carrying Labour member till the advent of Blair's New Labour - and am always in a quandary about how to vote. I live in Scotland (sorry if I'm opening a new can of worms) and have the SNP to contend with. I will probably vote tactically to try to get rid of them ...

My Mum admitted she was once tempted to vote for Jo Grimmond but not for his politics ?

To introduce a note of facetiousness, my dear late mother always voted for the best looking candidate, be it school governor, local councillor or MP..... and she was never disappointed.

llovecheese, it certaintly wasn't important for the mrmbers unless it was - none of the above

angelab

Thank you for replying.

It is interesting. I can't find anything other than a denial so if I have time I may dive a little further.

The BBC would obviously be a good place to start.

No government has to have a deputy PM, Cameron appointed .clegg, deputy PM is not an official post