London fire

A lawyer, who worked on the Camberwell fire in 2009, has been saying that the survivors and relatives should refuse an inquiry and demand an inquest instead. I don't understand the legal niceties, but apparently inquiries can drag on for years and information can be "hidden" if it's not part of the frame of inquiry. Inquests with juries reveal more information and are quicker. Apparently, they can't have both an inquiry and inquest.

Criminal procedures would then follow.

The BBC is reporting that 400 people are missing. :-(

The man who lived in the flat where the fire started has already been identified by the Sun.

Behailu Kebede

Not 400 missing. There have been 400 phone calls about missing people. One man has had 16 people enquiring about his whereabouts.

The actual,figure seems to be about 100

Grenfill Tower stands a burnt out shell.

A symbol of austrity Britain

The Sun hardly covered itself in glory with the last major disaster in England did it? I find links to that paper about anything beyond distasteful but when it's about a national disaste, it's beyond the pale.

There are two photos in my paper this morning that speaks volumes.

May speaking to firefighters behind a metal fence behind which is a notice about a centre with support written on the banner, but no one could see the British prime minister nor communicate with her

Corbyn is holding a woman looking at paper - presumably about the folk that are missing. He is the public domain and accessable to all.

It says everything about the state of Britain

The woman's a walking PR disaster. Does she not realise what is expected of her?

As is being said, it's her Katrina moment. And look at the similarities - poor people affected, mainly black.

What we must never forget when we next cast our vote is that those folk living in Grenfill Tower are among the ones who suffered most from austerity Britain.

I hope those responsible for Austerity Britain look on the victims faces and weep for what they have done.

Isn't it sad Anya that we even have to use the words PR? Hasnt the country a right to a leader that can lead without the need for PR puff? Who has a human heart, who knows instinctively what to do, how to reach out - think Obama for example. All she had to do was ask for a group of survivors to be in a room somewhere and met and talked to them. She's not a hugger but you can pat a shoulder, hold or shake a hand. Just have the guts to turn up to see the people you have chosen to lead

ww you know they won't weep don't you? All they are doing at the moment is trying to cover their backs and indulge in damage limitation.

I keep hearing the phrase that many of the victims will never be identified - my eyes prick.

So sad - and utterly horrifying. It beggars belief that tower blocks anywhere could be constructed in such a way that fire spreads at such speed and without proper escape routes. I so hope that someone is brought to book over this, not out of a desire to see someone suffer, but as a way of saying this is not acceptable and those responsible for other blocks will know that they are at risk.

I fear that the blame will be distributed between an assortment of organisations. I am uncomfortable about political capital being made out of such a tragedy, but this is what you get with outsourcing and the resulting fragmentation - no-one feels responsible for anything - it is all watered down and tortuous.

You're right luckygirl that it seems distasteful to make political capital out of such a terrible disaster, but on the other hand, it might make various authorities wake up to the consequences of their actions and inactions.
Self-interest might make them do the right thing in future, tho' it seems that concern for their fellow man will never be significant.

If we don't tell the politicians that this is as a direct result of decisions that they have made or not made how are things going to change.

I would argue that political capital MUST be made out of this and other disasters.

If we don't we let those responsible off scot free which is what they want and what they are busy trying to achieve as we speak.

Grenfill Tower stands a burnt out shell.

A symbol of austerity Britain

I think it should remain like that for a very long time.

If they refurbished who would want to live in a place where people died so horribly?

And I couldn't bear the thought of someone making huge amounts of money from 'redeveloping' the site.

It should stay as it is, or as an empty space, like the twin towers.

the Diana approach usually works for many

During the Thatcher years I told my family that should I be involved in a disaster of any kind I would not, under any circumstances, want Mrs T to visit me. However, after seeing Mrs May having a 'private ' visit to Grenfell Tower and not speaking to any of the victims, I find myself feeling shocked, incredulous, and also (words I never thought I would use) more sympathetic towards Mrs Thatcher.

My DH is the most gentle, quiet person you could ever meet. He could never kiss, hug or be touchy-feely with a stranger (or even an extended member of the family for that matter) . Does that make him a bad person? Does that mean he has no feelings? Does that mean he doesn't care?

He isn't the Prime Minister.

Lots of people are not touch-feely and there's nothing wrong with that. However, May is the prime minister and the fire was a national disaster, she could have at least met a small group of volunteers & survivors at one of the churches.

Even if she was subjected to public barracking, as was Sadiq Khan, I think it was her duty to be seen in the flesh, not just a few photos.

She is well-protected by her security team.

I'm waiting for Boris to show his face.

www.news.com.au/world/europe/london-fire-melbourne-skyscraper-fire-caused-by-shoddy-cladding-may-have-been-a-warning-for-london/news-story/6de8652286b765f369e779be3062a45f

It took just 15 minutes for a single burning cigarette left on the balcony of the Lacrosse building in Melbourne’s Docklands to send 13 floors of the block up in flames.
The fire used imported cladding from China, that failed to meet Australian standards, to creep up the side of the structure. Similar cladding has been blamed for a series of skyscraper fires and fatalities.

2015
Lessons were not learned.

It's not a question of being touchy-feely, gillybob, it's a question of talking to people, and if you're the Prime Minister and there has been a disaster like this, you b*** well ought to talk to people! You don't have to touch them, and I agree that some people find that difficult. Princess Diana could do it, but it isn't a sign of failure if you can't. I just think that Mrs May was very rude and insensitive.

i saw queenie at a disaster site,, no hugging, no Diana cuddling,I still have a photograph of her taken by a friend, her eyes had filled with tears looking at the graves, , for some reason some want emotions , true or false, in full display , the awwww effect