Let's not forget Brexit

Well said brave Oriel and Lemongrove. I'm with you on this.

I am still looking for the rainbow and pigs flying! I am sure we will get that when we leave the EU.

I am constantly astounded at the way so many leavers are prepared to accept this fantasy. La la land is alive and kicking.

What is this fantasy of which you speak?

Oh, and perhaps you could tell me what lies I am supposed to have been duped into believing.

I voted to leave because I truly believe it will benefit this country and future generations. In fact is is a bit of a selfless gesture on my part in that, given my age, any temporary disruption will have an impact on my investments/pensions, etc. However, I believe that some things are more important than finances and that is why I voted to leave.

Perhaps some of us who voted Leave realised there could be disruption/ difficulties for a while until we fully disentangled ourselves from the EU, but thought that it would be worth it.
So, all this nonsense about rainbows and sunny uplands the minute we leave would indeed be nonsense, just as the armageddon painted by some Remainers is nonsense as well.There were lies told by both sides, you had to see past them and make your own mind up.

I feel the same way as you Oriel

We can't stop it so the only sensible course of action is to get behind those who have the rubbish job of getting in through. If we don't back them we will end up over a barrel and be paying into the EU and getting less than nothing back. (I never thought we should leave but we are where we are).

Well done Cindersdad for keeping this issue high profile.

I notice that one of the main problem areas in the negotiations - the Northern Irish border - was not even mentioned in the information we received before the vote. Well at least not in the Government leaflet that I've found.

www.gov.uk/government/publications/why-the-government-believes-that-voting-to-remain-in-the-european-union-is-the-best-decision-for-the-uk/why-the-government-believes-that-voting-to-remain-in-the-european-union-is-the-best-decision-for-the-uk

Here in the US we have a similar version of the same... you can all see for yourselves how that's been going for us.

I sometimes feel there are bigger forces at play. US, UK and indeed Spain (Catalonian revolt), is all part of rising populism (i.e. Nationalism) that seeks to weaken the EU and ultimatly break it.

In simpler terms, it's the same, age old territorial struggle being waged by humans, except the borders have been redrawn economically instead of geographically. That has created a lot of turmoil because it threatens nationalism (i.e. geographic borders).

Geographically, I'm averse to nationalistic policies that promote hate, put up walls figuratively or otherwise, and espouse policies that present long term threats to our climate and our species; the most dangerous being the threat of nuclear war!

Trade squabbles, economic ups and downs, open borders, immigration numbers and job indexes now seem trivial by comparison.

Sky news

Speaker has stated that “it is opinion rather than a constitutional fact that MPs should vote through Brexit because of the referendum result”

Let out clause for all Remainers.

willa good post, and exactly how many are feeling. Populism is a real threat to stability -the politicians need to step up and address the issues that have given rise to this threat

Still nothing about the Irish issue, in fact it’s a tad quiet.

DUP are solidly against the sea version as it puts them on the other side from the UK, but my money is on that as I can’t see anything else working.

£10bn down the drain!

@whitewave Perhaps you didn't see my post - care to comment?

Quote from Whitewave... I am constantly astounded at the way so many leavers are prepared to accept this fantasy. La la land is alive and kicking

What is this fantasy of which you speak?

Oh, and perhaps you could tell me what lies I am supposed to have been duped into believing.

I voted to leave because I truly believe it will benefit this country and future generations. In fact is is a bit of a selfless gesture on my part in that, given my age, any temporary disruption will have an impact on my investments/pensions, etc. However, I believe that some things are more important than finances and that is why I voted to leave.

The Irish border is a huge problem. The ramifications of a hard border for the Good Friday Agreement are such that no PM would want their name associated with it. A hard border is impossible anyway because their are so many country lanes, footpaths and fields that cross between Eire and Northern Ireland. Consequently, all those who voted Brexit to get rid of free movement of people have voted to throw the UK off a cliff to no purpose.

Oriel, I agree. What worries me is the dependency the E U has created in this country , as if we can't run our own affairs. Our parliament should work for us and be answerable to us. Not kow towing to distant Mandarins.
We can still travel and work abroad with the approval of that country. And people can come and work here with permission from our immigration office.
Perhaps this will go in the DM.

There, not their (typo).

It's a group of people working together for the good of the whole [imo].If that's dependency then sobeit. Have just realised that our local theatre is part funded by the EU. Wonder what will happen to them [and theatres like them] when that funding is removed ina year or so. This government doesn't seem too keen of funding the arts. I would imagine our indie cinema [which supports local orphanages and people caring for children with special needs/alzheimers etc ] is part funded by them also. Still, perhaps the magic money tree will help out.

Hammond has a shortage in his budget of £900 million because of Brexit.

Good to see that Bercow has spoken out about Brexit whitewave. We need more politicians to be brave enough to speak out before the juggernaut of Brexit drives the UK off the cliff edge.

It's like the Emperor's new clothes. No-one seems able to say STOP - this is going to cause the country enormous harm.

Guardian are reporting that

Liam Fox has appointed himself as the only member of the Board of Trade

Love to listen in to the board meetings

Both Belgium and Malta have more people per square kilometre than the UK.
Can't remember who said we were the most populous per area.

It would appear that my earlier assumption that I would be ignored is correct.

Question Time is going to be very interesting tonight, from Belfast.
Good timing.

I'm sorry I won't apologise but I voted to leave. I live in what would be considered to be a nice area. But the house across the road from my house is a house that is rented out as a HMO to mainly young men I would say probably mainly Muslim as the old guy that I see very occasionally that owns property tends to be wearing the long white robes when he visits. Occasionally I have seen young white girls visit the property with these young men (as in young I mean teenagers wearing school uniform). I have no problem with young men of any race or religion on the whole but the these young men should know that having such young girls visiting their home in the uk is just not acceptable. I'm not raciest my any mean's and one of my best friends who I love dearly is Hindi.
I have a couple of houses that I let. They very rarely come up for rent as I'm a good landlord and the houses are well looked after. But in the last 15 years I've really noticed the shortage rental property's there are near me. If a house comes up for rent and I advertise it I can have up 40 people respond to the advert in 2 hours. 15 years ago that would of been unheard of to me!
As a country we need to have some form of boarder control that doesn't mean we should help people in less fortunate countries. But we should be able to make UK laws in the UK without going to Brussels.
I'm also an animal lover and would ban Halal meat if I had my way!
Dislike my view's if you like they are just my personal view's from my own life experiences.

I'm sorry, sausages. Is that really why you voted to leave. No other reasons?

Correct me if I'm wrong, but aren't European countries in the EU predominately white Christian? I would be surprised if that is where your young Muslim men are coming from. I suspect that Brexit isn't going to solve your problem.

We do already have border control; we can even control EU nationals coming to the UK. It's just that our UK governments have never chosen to do so.

I am not ashamed to be a Brexiteer - who wants to be part of Juncker's United states of Europe?We are NOT like the french and germans who will still want to trade with us and the crooked Europeans who have humiliated Greece. I am not a little englander but ultimately Brexit WILL be worth it