I see the EU Remainers' PROJECT FEAR is alive and well.

^ I am sure that this country will prosper, after we leave the EU. It may take some time and effort, but we will do it.^

We Remainers are really wanting to know what makes you 'sure'in the face of evidence from business men, economists, aviation experts, trade negotiators etc. etc. which says we will not prosper.

This is not 'remoaning' on their part; they are experienced in their field and know exactly what barriers there are to achieving whatever it is the Leavers want. Because, apart from 'We want out' there doesn't seem to be much unanimity of purpose among them.

We know, of course, that the rich Brexit backers mostly want to make a killing from the privatisation of public services and look forward to deregulation in all aspects of workers rights , but what about the rest?

What was the purpose of the original post if not to wind up those with opposing views? Nothing new was said, or has been said all day.

We Remainers are really wanting to know what makes you 'sure'in the face of evidence from business men, economists, aviation experts, trade negotiators etc. etc. which says we will not prosper

Evidence? Nothing has been agreed yet.
We haven't left the EU yet.
How can they KNOW that alternative trading arrangements won't be much more profitable? Even economists can only predict how things will fare in the future, post Brexit. Again, their crystal balls may be faulty. Mark Carney, Governor of the Bank of England has consistently got in wrong over Brexit. His guidance is WRONG.

Lots of people who voted to remain do tend to have this outlook and of course pro EU sites and papers with their biased clairvoyants will ramp up the "everything is going to be (future tense) awful".

the problem isday6 it appears the leavers voted for leaving becuase of some fantasy land that existed only in their minds.The rise in population isn't just emigrnats its people living longer ,the issues with housing and the NHS is bad management from WESTMINSTER .The EU are not in any way in control of the UK!! To think they are is deluded.

A positive spin re leaving the EU, given we were the
'reluctant Europeans'.
From the Guardian. www.theguardian.com/commentisfree/2017/jun/20/not-just-uk-benefit-brexit-eu

"The UK is keen to get on with discussing its future trading arrangements. The EU is not so keen, as it seems to think this offers it some leverage over the UK. This is a strange idea given that it runs a huge trade surplus with us and has an interest in tariff-free smooth trade after we have left, just as we do"

"I hope the EU will come to see this as an opportunity for it as well as for us. It will be freed of UK arguments and votes restraining the full development of its union. The UK will be free to negotiate more positive relationships with countries across the rest of the world. We will still want to do a lot with our European partners, but it will be done when both sides want to do it, not because we have lost a vote in the council. I find it difficult to believe the EU will want to spend the next two years trying to impose tariffs and other barriers to its trade with us, while staying compliant with WTO rules. That would be a form of self-harm for it. The good news is it does not have to, as the UK is happy to offer it continued tariff-free access to our markets despite the large deficit we run.*

the problem isday6 it appears the leavers voted for leaving becuase of some fantasy land that existed only in their minds

Explain this fantasy land please paddyann. It's news to me.
I know not of which you speak.

^Evidence? Nothing has been agreed yet.
We haven't left the EU yet.
How can they KNOW that alternative trading arrangements won't be much more profitable? Even economists can only predict how things will fare in the future, post Brexit. Again, their crystal balls may be faulty. Mark Carney, Governor of the Bank of England has consistently got in wrong over Brexit. His guidance is WRONG. ^

Somebody find me a brick wall; I need to bang my head.

For someone who claims to have gone to university, Day6 you are astonishingly dismissive of the value of knowledge gained by study and experience. No crystal balls required, just knowledge.

The human race wouldn't have achieved very much if they'd lived by your philosophy - we'd still be reinventing the wheel every generation.

John Redwood is so convinced the UK will do well he is advising people to take their money out of the UK and re-invest it elsewhere.

What about the Agencies which have already been allocated to other EU capitals. We certainly know that has happened and even should the UK change its mind the agencies will go. Only about a thousand jobs but a thousand well paid jobs and people paying taxes. But maybe you see that S a positive.

Oh, and brilliant linking to a Guardian article by John Redwood.

That'd be the John Redwood who has moved his investments overseas and is advising his company's clients to do the same as he is so unconfident in the economy post-Brexit?

Xpost, WW

I just hope we get some sort of agreement about trade and the movement of goods before we leave. Anyone who has transported lorry loads of goods through Switzerland or has been caught up in some of the miles of jams outside Dover, know only too well the sort of nightmare that could ensue. Some of us just aren't convinced that Messrs Gove, Johnson and May have any experience as truckers.

Another article outlining how Remainers' gloom was misplaced.

The New York Times has lots to say about the way the news is often skewed.
An extract from
The Good News on Brexit They’re Not Telling You

"The same confirmation bias can be seen in their determination to find bad economic news. Here is a selection of British reports from the past two weeks: Unemployment fell again, as every month since the vote, to 1.49 million (from 1.67 million in June of last year); manufacturing orders are at their highest level since August 1988; retail sales, official figures show, are up 2.9 percent on this time last year.

Exports were up 10 percent year-on-year in May, helped by the long-overdue correction of the exchange rate. Remainers like to point to the fall in sterling, but rarely mention that, before the vote, the International Monetary Fund and the Bank of England agreed that Britain’s currency, seen as a haven from the travails of the euro, was artificially expensive.

Continental Europeans evidently still regard the British economy as attractive; more of them are working in Britain than ever before. As for the supposed decline of London, a number of European banks, including Deutsche Bank and ING, have grown their operations here since the referendum. Last year, Wells Fargo spent £300 million (about $392 million) on its new European headquarters — in London. The latest survey from the Robert Walters City Jobs Index, for July, reported that hiring in financial services was up 13 percent year-on-year."

A Daniel Hannan article in July. You are really selective, and don't like to give the sources of your information, do you, Day6?

"But wage increases continued to fall further behind inflation.

Excluding bonuses, earnings rose by 2.0% year-on-year. However, inflation had hit an almost four-year high of 2.9% in May.

When the impact of inflation is factored in, real weekly wages fell by 0.5% compared with a year earlier."

He missed this bit out of one of his references, the BBC one of the ONS figures.

So why is the OBR forecasting a progressive fall in GDP over the next few years? Very much publicised by all media after the Budget last week.

The Wells Fargo story was in the Financial Times and The Independant.
I think it's very unfair that nobody told them that the city is going to hell in a hand cart, and if they'd waited a couple of years they could have got the building for a knock down price.

The banking figures were from October 2016.
Inflation has hit a four-year high since then and banks are on the move.

"you are astonishingly dismissive of the value of knowledge gained by study and experience. No crystal balls required, just knowledge."

Of course knowledge is gained by study and experience Maizie I do not dispute that. However MaisieD, you attempt to patronise once again but seem completely unaware of the difference between what is and what is predicted. Do you not get it?

These people you put your faith in, have made forecasts. Do you need some synonyms? Predictions, conjecture, assumptions, prophecies..etc, etc, etc.

Not one economist or financier would bet his family home and life savings on the financial state of the UK in 2021 - or even 2019 - even if they studied the markets and fluctuations in finance and politics 24/7.

I expect you have never speculated to accumulate. When you invest in anything it is made VERY CLEAR that even though stock may be rising, and things look good, it could fall. A broker will not give you any guarantees that your money is safe and you will make a profit in the future.

All we have right now is speculation. Yes Maizie, bang your head against a brick wall if you like but you fail to see that knowledge of financial systems and markets and trading patterns does not mean these beloved experts of yours can guarantee anything for sure in the years to come. They may be experts in their fields but they are not able to predict with GUARANTEED accuracy future events.

If Mark Carney gets it wrong - he has - others can, despite their expertise.

You anticipate a dreadful future. Carry on. Wallow in your misery.

The people you rely on for your figures are very selective, Day6, just as you are.
I prefer my experts to yours.

Just remind us, how much has the value of sterling (the pound in our pocket, as Harold Wilson called it) fallen since the EU referendum?

Ah but DJ do remember that during the referendum debate the leave campaign made it very clear that no experts are to be trusted at all!!

Brexit IS positive: Anti-Brexit prediction proved WRONG as business investment in UK BOOMS

A headline most Remainers refuse to acknowledge I suspect. Oct this year.

BREXIT doom-mongers have been forced into a U-turn after new figures showed business investment in Britain has risen since the EU referendum.

Mark Carney has predicted economic doom over Brexit
Remain campaigners made the economic impact of leaving the EU a key plank of their campaign to stay in the EU.

And Bank of England governor Mark Carney had warned the uncertainty over Brexit was holding back UK growth.

But newly revised data from the Office for National Statistics - the key economic indicator of business investment - has been revised upwards, despite previous estimates that it had plateaued.

According to the figures, investment increased by a massive 2.5 per cent during the second quarter this year compared to the same period in 2016.

Overall investment stood at £81.1 billon in the second quarter, with £45.7 billion of that coming from business investment, the Financial Times reported.

www.express.co.uk/news/politics/864075/Brexit-UK-economy-ONS-Theresa-May-Philip-Hammond

Mark Carney is less accurate than Mystic Meg.

Another piece which made me smile. "Speaking about Brexit last month, Mr Carney warned the “speed limit” of the UK’s economy had decreased because of flat productivity and uncertainty on the UK’s departure.

But he was challenged on his gloomy economic forecasts by BBC Today programme host John Humphrys, who branded them “pretty dodgy”.

The journalist told him: “One of the things that has come out of that is your ability to forecast, and in this, you’re not alone at running a bank in this respect, your ability to forecast is pretty dodgy.

“That’s not an expression you’d use I’m sure, but you’ve not been very good at it so why aren’t you being more honest?”

Mr Carney told him: “We’re not holding anything back where we see potential risk in this economy.”

Oh look. There is that word 'potential.' So The Governor of the Bank of England won't hold back in giving us his inaccurate forecasts. Hmm. I don't rate his 'potential'.

mcem - whoops.

There's an expert-in-chief (Mark Carney) who got it wrong!

Strange, Day6, that nobody will own up to writing that article in the Express.