Grans Moral Maze

That’s a shame varian but I think nations have a duty to take a stand against cruel treatment of children, irrespective of whose feelings might be hurt.

" banning ritual circumcision will make the 2000 Jews and Muslims living in Iceland feel unwelcome."
Maybe that's the whole point, varian.
To deter others from coming.

Maybe its to protect children?
That should be of paramount importance.

The tradition of circumcision in the Abrahamic religions is by no means universally accepted.

www.organiclifestylemagazine.com/religious-reasons-not-circumcise

It never entered my head that Iceland’s proportion shed ban of circumcision of children was in order to deter Muslims or Jewish people from moving to the country. I don’t believe that, I believe the proposal is to protect boys and girls from being mutilated without their informed consent. I appreciate the religious challenges it will pose to some members of those faiths but in my opinion, it’s long overdue that these challenges were faced.

Hear hear Iam64!

Iceland is an underpopulated country which actively welcomes immigrants. On the whole their social attitudes are very progressive. I very much doubt that antisemitism is a factor in this proposal.

I really don’t have the experience of Icelanders to judge their motivation - I took it at face value that it was child centred. After all I don’t think that making FGM illegal is about wanting to make those groups that practice it unwelcome here - surely it’s about wanting them to change?

exactly maryeliza. Apart from 'tradition' - I see little difference in principle between FGM and circumcision. It'a physical abuse (was going to write 'end of' but then realised it was better not to...).

There are many cultures that have practises that we see as abhorrent or an infringement of human rights. Some ethnic groups believe in facial tribal scarring of children as a mark of their transition to adulthood.

We'd never permit that in the the west but it doesn't mean the people from such cultures are unwelcome. It just means those particular practises are not permitted.

Sorry about my last post - I' in a rather gloomy mood.

awww, chin up, fennel

Fennel, current world events make it difficult not to feel rather gloomy. Chin up x

Iceland would not be top of my move to list I love the sun too much

But they do have lovely jumpers❄️☃️?

I wonder then how far this protection of children from unnecessary physical mutilation should be taken? I have seen very young children taken to have their ears pierced. It is of course reversible and not so drastic but should there be a restriction on ear piercing?

I would say so. I'm sure most places do have an age restriction: they did when I had my daughters' ears pierced. (When she was a baby, embarrassingly enough)

I agree with Annie I have long shared the view that I don't want to eat Halal meat and want it clearly labelled. There are several companies who only use Halal including Subway which is on most high streets.

trisher that was the question I posed on the previous page
( ear piercing for babies )
In Italy, for example, this is quite common ( unless all the tiny ones I have seen is a coincidence.)It happens a lot in the UK too.
It’s done only for decorative reasons, not religious or health reasons.

Nonnie I don’t want to eat halal meat either.

I wonder why? There is substantial evidence that the methods used in British slaughter houses are not always as sympathetic to the animal's welfare as they should be, that animals recover from the initial stun before being slaughtered, that they are often kicked or hit whilst awaiting stun and can be badly treated.
Sometimes halal meat is stunned before slaughter, sometimes it isn't. Properly done it results in death very quickly.

Slaughter without stunning is considered to cause the animal considerable pain and suffering.

It would just be easier to label meat appropriately, or not, considering how much meat is halal nowadays.

As I said MissAdveture some Halal meat is from stunned animals, some isn't. Some animals that are stunned recover before slaughter. I can understand anyone campaigning for better conditions for all animals being slaughtered for food, but not picking out a particular way of killing. After all the halal meat may be from a stunned animal, but the ordinary meat might be from an animal that had regained consciousness.

Well, that's why labelling would give people a choice, which they don't need to explain, and doesn't offend
Obviously the only humane thing would be to be totally vegan (not vegetarian) but in the absence of that, I would like to make my own choices, which do not include any which pander to religious ritual.