Corbyn's Magnetism

bmacca No, me neither. I don't think it will ever be perfect, but now that it's more established, I think it will slowly change - like everything, I suppose. You just need to make sure you understand the rules before/if you engage.
I think it's a hugely useful tool, but I wouldn't want to use it as my only source of information.
Very handy for knowing when the next meeting for a club is/what's going to be on the news tonight/what the kids & grandkids are up to. Not so good for conversations with strangers with different opinions!

Jen I think he's not voting Labour because of this. Some of his comedian colleagues have said the same.

Why does antisemitism in the labour party matter so much to people who would never vote labour? Shouldn't you be more concerned about antisemitism in your own party?

Personally, I don't want to see antisemitism anywhere or in any party durham. It matters not one jot whether it's the Labour party or the Tories; it needs to be stamped out. And I'm surprised that someone who appears to be as politically aware as you needs to ask that question.

Antisemitism is unacceptable whoever is doing it. End of.

The anti-Semitism problem in the Labour party has drawn the question of whether Jeremy Corbyn has demonstrated failure as party leader. Undoubtedly I would be the first to agree that he has certainly had a very bad few weeks with first his initial reaction to the Salisbury attack, a then his initial playing down of anti-Semitism claims within the party and the wider Labour movement.

However, Corbyn has demonstrated huge organizational and leadership skills in bringing the Labour party to a membership of over half a million (a figure that other party's can only dream of) and in that bringing forward the views of the grassroots membership to be represented at the highest levels of the party.

The challenge for Jeremy Corbyn must now be to organize that mass membership so as to coordinate its strength to act in full support of the new radical policies that have and are still being brought about. It will then be very much down to him to convince the electorate that those policies in housing, employment and health etc are achievable.

The next general election, many now believe will come ether late this year or in the first two months of 2019 due to Brexit problems in the Conservative party. Whenever that election takes place the arguments of racism and anti-semitism will be forgotten as much larger issues take centre stage. Should Corbyn show once again the great election "street fighting" capabilities he demonstrated in the last general election, then he may well emerge as Britain's next prime minister.

However, in the meantime, I believe that the anti-Semitism problem will affect Labour in the forthcoming local elections, but the next general election will be fought on a far different agenda. In that how Corbyn organises the mass movement he has created now and during that election will without doubt determine the outcome.

"David Baddiel has defended a man who taught his pet pug to do a Nazi salute in response to the phrases “Gas the Jews” and “Sieg Heil”.

The funny-man lent his support for dog-owner Markus Meechan, who has been found guilty of religious and racial aggravation, after teaching the animal to give the offensive gesture, on the grounds of free speech.

Meechan is due to be sentenced next month."

Doesn't fit, does it?

In which case,Chewbacca, why is it all about the labour party, and not about other parties?

blogs.timesofisrael.com/jeremy-corbyn-is-an-anti-racist-not-an-antisemite/

I'm guessing because Corbyn has been asked to address the problem so many times and his response has been found to be inadequate. But you have a more direct line of communication with the Labour party durham; maybe that would be a good question to put to them.

"Jeremy Corbyn has been MP for Islington North since 1983 – a constituency with a significant Jewish population. Given that he has regularly polled over 60% of the vote (73% in 2017) it seems likely that a sizeable number of Jewish constituents voted for him, As a constituency MP he regularly visited synagogues and has appeared at many Jewish religious and cultural events. He is close friends with the leaders of the Jewish Socialist Group, from whom he has gained a rich knowledge of the history of the Jewish Labour Bund, and he has named the defeat of Mosley’s Fascists at the Battle of Cable as a key historical moment for him. His 2017 Holocaust Memorial Day statement talked about Shmuel Zygielboym, the Polish Bund leader exiled to London who committed suicide in an attempt to awaken the world to the Nazi genocide. How many British politicians have that level of knowledge of modern Jewish history?"

which brings us back to Grandad's post:
The anti-Semitism problem in the Labour party has drawn the question of whether Jeremy Corbyn has demonstrated failure as party leader.

and Corbyn's challenge.

Not many MPs can boast that sort of knowledge Jen, you're quite right on that. Makes it all the more difficult to see how he consistently misses the anti-semitic imagery in murals and in the FB groups and in his own party with all his knowledge and expertise.

I am sure there are other MP's who could equal Corbyn's genius

Grandad Yes, I think you've hit the nail on the head there. It's all about his capability as a leader. Although the party has grown, I don't know if that's down to him - his personal actions, or if it was Lansman who did it, using him as a figurehead.
I think this has put Lansman in a very difficult position.

I am sure there are other MP's who could equal Corbyn's genius

Annie

"Jeremy Corbyn is one of the leading anti-racists in parliament – I would go so far to say that he is one of the least racist MPs we have. So naturally Corbyn signed numerous Early Day motions in Parliament condemning antisemitism, years before he became leader and backed the campaign to stop Neo-Nazis from meeting in Golders Green in 2015."

I am sure there are other MP's who could equal Corbyn's genius

Oh no, please no Annie! Corby is surely one of a kind and there are no more like him!

It is pathetic isn't it that some people because of their political prejudice will not acknowledge that someone has any positive points whatsoever. That if you post positive things you are labelled a Corbynista or some other term of abuse. It just reinforces the idea that these people are so scared of someone who has principles and beliefs that they will say or do anything to undermine him. Much like the MSM who have a vested interest in doing it. Why do these people do it? I can only think that seeing someone with ideals makes them feel a little guilty and undermining him or chucking as much muck as they can makes them feel better.

Rearrange these words to read a well known phrase or saying:

Horse. Dead. Flogging.

"Because all racisms are interlinked it is worth examining Corbyn’s wider anti-racist record. Corbyn was being arrested for protesting against apartheid while the Thatcher government defended white majority rule and branded Nelson Mandela a terrorist. Corbyn was a strong supporter of Labour Black Sections – championing the right of Black and Asian people to organise independently in the Labour party while the Press demonised them as extremists. He has long been one of the leaders of the campaign to allow the indigenous people of the Chagos Islands to return after they were forcibly evicted by Britain in the 1960s to make way for an American military base. Whenever there has been a protest against racism, the two people you can always guarantee will be there are Jeremy Corbyn and John McDonnell. Who do you put your trust in — the people who hate antisemitism because they hate all racism or the people (be they in the Conservative party or the press) who praise Jews whilst engaging in Islamophobia and anti-black racism? The right-wing proponents of the Labour antisemitism narrative seek to divide us into ‘good’ and ‘bad’ minorities — they do not have the well being of Jews at heart."

I know Chewbacca but you will keep trying

Is it coincidental that his initials are JC?

Definitely not M0nica. It was pre ordained!

"Antisemitism is always beyond the pale. Labour, now a party of over half a million members, has a small minority of antisemites in its ranks, and it suspends them whenever it discovers them. I expect nothing less from an anti-racist party and an anti-racist leader.
If the Conservatives took the same approach to racism they would have to suspend their own foreign secretary, who has described Africans as ‘Picanninies’ and described Barack Obama as ‘The part-Kenyan President [with an] ancestral dislike of the British Empire’. From the Monday club, linked to the National Front, to MP Aidan Burley dressing up a Nazi, to Lynton Crosby’s dogwhistle portrayl of Ed Miliband as a nasal North London intellectual it is the Conservative Party that is deeply tainted by racism and antisemitism."

He certainly gets treated as if he was God. He also attracts the same group. The very young and very old.

JVL has had their largest increase in members so some Jews obviously agree with their views & not those of the Board of Deputies.
A blogpost by Robert Cohen, JVL:

"Yesterday’s demonstration outside Parliament against Jeremy Corbyn’s failure to recognise and deal with alleged antisemitism in the Labour Party has become a textbook study in the complexity of the Israel/Palestine debate. So many political agendas at play that I imagine it’s impossible for the casual observer to unravel it all.

It can’t be understood without acknowledging the right wing of the Labour Party’s desperation to remove Corbyn, still seeing him as an electoral liability. It can’t be understand without remembering that we have local elections coming up in the U.K. It can’t be understood without understanding how fragile Brexit makes Theresa May’s Government. It can’t be understood without acknowledging the mainstream media bias against Corbyn too, even from the Guardian.

It can’t be understood without having any empirical data on the scale of antisemitic sentiment among Labour members. Roughly what percentage of Labour’s 500,000 members would have to be proven antisemites to justify the charge of “rampant” and “epidemic” Jewish hatred?

It can’t be understood without understanding that Israel is still considered a well functioning democracy despite its control over the lives of 4 million Palestinians in the West Bank and 2 million in Gaza. It can’t be understood without acknowledging that Zionism is still considered a legitimate expression of Jewish national self-determination despite the past and present catastrophe it has created for another people.

It can’t be understood without acknowledging that anti-Zionists easily slide into antisemitic tropes because Israel presents itself as the nation state of the Jewish people rather than the nation of its citizens. It can’t be understood without acknowledging that the Jewish communal leadership believe they have a responsibility to advocate for a foreign country.

It can’t be understood without acknowledging that there exists a significant number of British Jews who support Corbyn and support Palestinian solidarity. It can’t be understood without acknowledging that Jeremy Corbyn cannot face down his critics on their own blindness to the “rampant” discrimination caused by Israel’s actions without imploding his leadership of the party. So, indeed it’s complicated. All of these things are ‘in play’ and the stakes just got higher.

As I said yesterday morning, the blatant attempt by the Board of Deputies and the Jewish Leadership Council to topple Corbyn could backfire very badly on them and whole Jewish community"

Quote Primrose [GrandadYes, I think you've hit the nail on the head there. It's all about his capability as a leader. Although the party has grown, I don't know if that's down to him - his personal actions, or if it was Lansman who did it, using him as a figurehead.
I think this has put Lansman in a very difficult position.] End Quote

Yes Primrose, I agree that others surrounding Jeremy Corbyn have played a huge part in developing the Labour party into a mass movement. Lansmans contribution has been enormous along with McCluskey and other union general Secretaries for they have been hugely successful in portraying Corbyn as a leader for their memberships.

It will be seen if Corbyn can maintain the hold he has on the National Executive, of which Unite, Momentum and other Unions are a prominent part if Corbyn continues to "flounder" on issues that affect the nation in what many see as beyond party politics.

The above and his organisation of the mass movement Labour party will determine how history will perceive him in the future.

The Blair premiership is now viewed as a failure due to one major issue. Corbyn may be remembered for one great achievement, but failed due to many small lack of perceptions.

Interesting times we indeed live in Primrose.