If there was another EU referendum Part 2

I did think the snap election was about Brexit though, crystaltipps?

Her stated reason was to strengthen her hand in Brexit negotiations. With official Brexit talks with the EU due to start in mid-June, Mrs May claimed Labour, the SNP and the Lib Dems would try to destabilise and frustrate the process in Parliament.
"If we do not hold a general election now, their political game-playing will continue," Mrs May said in her address to the country, "and the negotiations with the European Union will reach their most difficult stage in the run-up to the next scheduled election."
By gaining a fresh five-year term in 2017, Mrs May could look forward to a longer bedding-in period for the fruits of her negotiations. The extra time could be used to negotiate free trade agreements that are seen as critical to the UK's post-Brexit future.

From the BBC website 9th June 2017

although I do remember her saying ^strong and stable government as if trying to convince herself ^crystaltipps

Me neither, crystaltipps.
She also seems to conclude that all votes for Labour were votes in favour of Brexit too. Exactly how she expected would-be Labour supporters who were not pro-Brexit to vote, I don't know. Did she expect them to abstain, or vote for the Lib Dems even if they totally disagreed with all Lib Dem policies except its anti-Brexit stance?

crystaltipps....Not all about Brexit. However, you would have had to have been out of the Country not to know that the majority of the media coverage, including TV, Radio and not to mention the many interviews and question programmes that covered Brexit. Perhaps you were abroad at the time.

Mama and chrystal here is one I did earlier for Bridgeit you might have missed it.:
Allygran1 Tue 14-Aug-18 15:20:22
Bridget you and I will not agree on this matter. Whilst I accept your point about negatives and positive for both remain and leave, I cannot agree with you on the need for a second vote. We have already had two votes, one advisory the referendum, that result was taken on advice by the Government and acted upon to leave the EU. The second vote a GE which had both Conservative and Labour party's standing for election on a Brexit mandate, both party's got in one as Government re-elected and the other as Opposition, both supporting Brexit. By the time of the GE those who did not feel sufficiently informed at the referendum were surely very well informed on Brexit, the EU the types of negotiations that had gone on in the interim, both in Parliament, and in the media endlessly. If people had not by the time of the GE understood that they thought leaving the EU was for them or Remaining in the EU was for them then I do to know how much information people need to make a decision. At the GE had they wanted to spurn Brexit then they should have voted Liberal Democrat or one of the other Party's that clearly stood on a Remain in the EU mandate. There were options to the Pro Brexit Party's.

The Government got into power with a reduced number of MPs but with an increased share of the vote, greater than it had been since the 1980's for any party.

Had we not have had the GE then some would be more ready to accept your argument that people made a mistake and want another go...I find that weak but could consider even that sort of weak reason. However we had a period between the referendum and the GE when Brexit was the only thing in the Media, the negotiation, the EU the whole subject was covered, therefore to me there is no excuse for not being informed by the time of the GE and as there were both pro and anti Brexit party's and the option not to vote at all, there is no excuse for not knowing what way to vote on Brexit by then.
These are my reason's for not supporting a second referendum.

A no-deal Brexit could increase the risk of a Europe-wide pandemic, according to the British Medical Association.

The doctors union warned in a new briefing paper shared with The Independent on Thursday that crashing out of the EU without a deal will leave the UK more vulnerable to outbreaks of deadly infectious diseases.

It says that the UK’s ability to coordinate responses to emerging threats, such as the current outbreak of measles or seasonal flu, will be seriously undermined, making it harder to stop infections spreading across borders.

With UK government admitting it is stockpiling medicines in the event of a no-deal scenario, the British Medical Association warns this is proof that the devastating impact of Brexit on the nation’s health has been neglected.

www.independent.co.uk/news/uk/home-news/brexit-no-deal-nhs-pandemic-bma-final-say-voters-referendum-a8493221.html

Well, last year's serious flu outbreak came from Australia!
And I do not say that in a light-hearted or flippant fashion because I know of the devastating effects that had both there and here.

I do think that must be a very 'worst case scenario' and cannot see how they came to that conclusion at all.

Lots of people voted for other things in the GE- thinking Brexit done and dusted- in my constituency nationalisation of railways/ rail fares a big selling point for Labour. Our candidate ( new MP) said she was anti Brexit and got in with a huge majority. If it was all about Brexit the Tories would have got a huge landslide but we all know what happened then.

I think Ali G must have been voting in a different General Election than me in June 2017.
Brexit was a minor part of the manifestos (apart from Remain advocating LibDems) as both Conservatives and Tories unfortunately seemed to accept at that time that Brexit was “the will of the people”.
I remember the Dementia Tax from the Tories, and the abolition of university tuition fees from Labour were the major issues in the headlines at the time.

We have had this nonsense of "two votes for brexit" repeated enough times. Repeating nonsense again and again does not make it true.

Apologies, I should have said “both Conservatives and Labour” in my post above.

Quite agree Varian. The GE was not a referendum.

varian Thu 16-Aug-18 18:16:04
We have had this nonsense of "two votes for brexit" repeated enough times. Repeating nonsense again and again does not make it true.
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mostlyharmless Thu 16-Aug-18 18:40:37
Apologies, I should have said “both Conservatives and Labour” in my post above.

Quite agree Varian. The GE was not a referendum

.Varian: "Repeating nonsense again and again does not make it true".

How true!

Well try not doing it then Ali.

Varian repeats endlessly that 48 million didn’t vote for Brexit, clearly a nonsense but we keep seeing it pop up time and time again.
Non voters, from the EU, toddlers who can’t vote, teenagers who can’t be bothered to vote etc etc.Nobody knows how they would have voted had they actually been able to.
It’s one of those half truths that have nothing to do with the referendum in any meaningful way.

"two votes for brexit"

How did I miss that?

Jalima1108
Maybe you didn’t pay attention.
TM called an election for two reasons
1. Had the election not been called the current term of office would have expired just as we would be leaving the EU. Therefore election campaigning and Brexit negotiating would have proved very difficult. By holding an election the winning party gained a full term in office meaning the election will be called one year after Brexit.
2. TM as the new leader was getting (and continues to get) a load of flack. In going to the country she had hoped to get a good strong mandate from the electorate for the quickly created manifesto which along with the Labour Party manifesto acknowledged the earlier referendum result and invoke article 50. It was mentioned in party political broadcasts, written in the media and in door to door campaigning.
Although the conservative majority was weakened the actual number of voters who voted Conservative was in the majority.

Jalima1108
Maybe you didn’t pay attention

Joelsnan Is there really any need for this sort of schoolmarmy tone in a discussion between (soi-distant) adults?
We’ll be told to stand in the corner and take 100 lines next!

Auto correct didn’t like “soi -disant “ !

Much as I hate the thought of cut’n’paste from Wikipedia, this is what Wikipedia says about the 2017 General Election campaign:

Negotiation positions following the UK's invocation of Article 50 of the Treaty on European Union in March 2017 to leave the EU were expected to feature significantly in the campaign, but did not. The campaign was interrupted by two major terrorist attacks in Manchester and London, with national security becoming a prominent issue in the final weeks of campaigning.

Theresa May was asking the electorate to back her Brexit stance by calling the snap election. But the electorate didn’t endorse her as the Conservatives lost their majority of 17 seats and the minority Tory government had to be propped up by the DUP.

Bo Rothstein, Professor of Government at Oxford University explains the need for a second referendum-

" Political legitimacy is not only dependent on a decision getting support by the majority. In addition, the epistemic theory of democracy points to the need for the decisions to also be in some sense “true” and “right”. Decisions need to be “true” in the sense that they are not based on what is known to be factually wrong. "

www.ox.ac.uk/news-and-events/oxford-and-brexit/brexit-analysis/second-referendum

The former cabinet secretary Gus O’Donnell has compared Brexiter ministers and MPs to snake oil sellers after sustained attacks upon senior civil servants for lacking impartiality.

Lord O’Donnell, who served under Tony Blair, Gordon Brown and David Cameron, said attacks on Whitehall officials were “completely crazy” and “ridiculous”.

His comments follow claims by the Brexit minister Steve Baker, who rubbished government forecasts, and the prominent Tory Brexiter Jacob Rees-Mogg, who accused the Treasury of “fiddling the figures” to show Britain would be worse off outside the EU, whatever the outcome of the negotiations.

www.theguardian.com/politics/2018/feb/04/ex-top-civil-servant-tory-brexiters-snake-oil-sellers

Dear Gus!!

I have signed the change.org petition called final say which is asking for us to have a say in the final Brexit deal.

Conservative HQ has barred the Conservatives for a People’s Vote campaign from publishing an entry in the official party programme for October’s conference in Birmingham.

www.channel4.com/news/by/michael-crick/blogs/conservatives-bar-peoples-vote-campaign-from-conference-brochure

Labour has been considering how to head off a concerted attempt by remain-supporting members to stage a vote at its annual conference calling for a second referendum, to avoid what would be an embarrassing defeat for Jeremy Corbyn on the party’s Brexit policy.

‘It’s not a done deal’: inside the battle to stop Brexit. About 130 constituency Labour parties (CLPs) were understood to have expressed willingness to back a motion in favour of a second vote, drafted by the pro-Corbyn campaign group Labour for People’s Vote. To avoid a damaging defeat, one option is to invite delegates to support a Brexit policy statement that would refer to holding a second referendum, but only in exceptional circumstances.

It could be similar to a watered-down resolution that was supported at Unite’s policy conference in July, which was offered by the union leadership to defuse a similar situation.

Major new polling of 10,000 people suggested Labour voters backed a second referendum by 63%, with just 8% opposed, in one of the largest surveys of public opinion since the referendum to leave the European Union.

www.theguardian.com/politics/2018/aug/09/corbyn-hopes-to-avert-calls-for-public-vote-on-brexit-at-conference