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"There will be NO renegotiation!" says Juncker for EU. Let us get out NOW!

(290 Posts)
Day6 Wed 12-Dec-18 14:05:39

So, the EU will tie us to them forever and tell us when we can leave, and which trade deals we broker with other countries are acceptable.

I really, really hope there is a well-developed plan B, because our dealing with the WTO has to be the best deal for the UK.

NO DEAL has to be the way forward.

I think we are seeing just how tied and powerless we will be if we allow Brussels to continue to pull our strings.

Opal Thu 20-Dec-18 20:43:04

I voted Leave. I am not a racist. End of. Varian your comments say far more about you than you'll ever be able to say about me.

lemongrove Thu 20-Dec-18 20:43:26

Ah well, Crystal you can always comfort yourself that you won’t be here by then.....perhaps.

crystaltipps Thu 20-Dec-18 21:08:29

Along with you lemon

varian Thu 20-Dec-18 21:12:41

I have never claimed that all leave voters are racists but we can be pretty sure that most racists did vote leave and asserting that Germans have no sense of humour does seem a tad racist.

Labaik Thu 20-Dec-18 23:55:18

'Oh dear Varian you couldn't be more wrong. I've not long spent the past 6 weeks in the company of mostly Germans in Andalusia, and very good time we had ?
Sence of humour bypass on your part'...and yet you're quite happy to vote for something that will make it more difficult for other people to do the same; I really don't understand that sad.

varian Fri 21-Dec-18 03:55:58

Labaik it was Petra, not me who suggested that "German comedy show" was a contradiction in terms. I agree with you that Germans certainly do have a sense of humour and hope we can continue to enjoy each other's company as fellow EU citizens.

I .most certainly did not vote to end that relationship. I still hope we can remain in the EU.

Labaik Fri 21-Dec-18 09:52:41

Sorry for the confusion; the first was petra's reply to you. Annoyed me that petra can spend weeks abroad with German friends and yet votes to make it more difficult for others to do the same.

humptydumpty Fri 21-Dec-18 10:00:35

lemon et al, I do hope that when/if we leave the EU, you will take your share of responsibility for the chaos and economic damage that follows - or will it all be someone else's fault?

crystaltipps Fri 21-Dec-18 10:49:11

I think Leavers will all blame the EU for the economic decline and any chaos, they weren’t “ generous” enough and wouldn’t give us special treatment, even though we deserve it for being superior British , we couldn’t have our cake and eat it, despite what that nice Mr Farage told us. It couldn’t possibly be a monumental act of spiteful self harm.

nigglynellie Fri 21-Dec-18 11:48:34

I'm sure there will be chaos and confusion, the remainers will make sure of that!!!
As for 'sense of humour', all countries have their own brand of humour which others don't find funny at all, nothing racist about it! Italians eat a lot of Pasta, is that a racist comment?!
We have some wonderful Dutch friends who, although are very sad and even fearful at our departure from the EU, understand perfectly why we want to leave and wish they could do the same. Their voice is never heard,they are run by Brussels and see no point in voting! A sentiment that is echoed by their fellow countrymen! How sad is that!!

humptydumpty Fri 21-Dec-18 12:08:32

Great statistical sample, niggly, how many was that, 2?

Greta Fri 21-Dec-18 12:10:57

I do fully understand how one can say ”I don't understand German/Dutch etc humour”. You certainly will find it difficult if you do not speak the language since humour is deeply rooted in language and culture. But, to say ”Germans have no sense of humour” is completely different.
I find the question of identity very odd. If we are to believe what has been stated on here a large majority of Brits would describe themselves as only British. If one referred to them as also European this would be an insult. However, when a Brit declares that Germans have no sense of humour, this is not an insult. It is just one splendid example of the unparalleled British sense of humour.

crystaltipps Fri 21-Dec-18 12:23:00

Dutch people I know thoroughly support the EU and think we are totally bonkers making life more difficult. They know they aren’t “”ruled” by Brussels and have their own elected Dutch government. Doesn’t prove anything. There isn’t massive envy of the Brits and their current political mess.

nigglynellie Fri 21-Dec-18 12:54:18

Of course they have their own Parliament and PM,but the Dutch Prime Minister recently admitted that he very rarely got what he wanted when conversing with the Commission! Who on earth wants to run a country like that? Prime Minister in name only!

humptydumpty Fri 21-Dec-18 13:25:36

Greta be assured there are plenty of us on this forum who consider ourselves to be European as well as British, and face the prospect of being stripped of half our identity.

lemongrove Fri 21-Dec-18 13:32:20

Humpty et al......there would be no disruption or economic damage if Parliament got behind Mrs May’s deal.
That includes all the Remainer MP’s as well as the more extreme Brexiters ( and more MP’s are Remainers.)

lemongrove Fri 21-Dec-18 13:36:22

Greta....who on here has said that being European is an insult?That’s in your own mind only.
I am English, then British and lastly European.
The French see themselves as French before European, as do Italians, Greeks Germans and any other country within Europe.
We will still be part of Europe after we leave the EU, just as we were before we joined it.

Greta Fri 21-Dec-18 15:03:50

Well, it was Buffybee who wrote:^ ”...I know for a fact that Chinese or Pakistanis would not be happy being described as just Asian and would find it quite insulting”^. With that I understood she meant that that is also how the Brits feel. Of course people who live in Europe don't just say they are Europeans. They are British, French, Danish, etc. But they can also see themselves as Europeans. It's not either or.
I certainly feel European. Perhaps that is because I have lived and worked (not just travelled) in several European countries. I speak and write their languages. I feel connected to them because we share history, culture and language. This 'them' and 'us' attitude never leads to anything good.

oldbatty Fri 21-Dec-18 15:17:33

Lemon has miraculous powers that enable her to speak for people of many countries.

POGS Fri 21-Dec-18 15:29:37


Why only Lemon ?

suzied Fri 21-Dec-18 15:41:23

The Dutch PM isn't PM "in name only". Just like us, over 90% of legislation in the netherlands is home grown.Only a small % is from the EU. Most Dutch people realise the benefits of being EU members. I am not sure where people get this idea that people are envious of our parlous state.

suzied Fri 21-Dec-18 15:46:14

In reference to the above- a recent poll in the Netherlands showed a lead of 34% for remaining in the EU. The only parties who wish for a referendum are the extremist parties.

Greta Fri 21-Dec-18 16:21:14

A poll in Sweden in May 2018 showed that 68% of Swedes think that belonging to EU is a positive thing for the country.

Buffybee Fri 21-Dec-18 16:57:40

Greta you're very good at misunderstanding other posts and twisting their meaning to suit own agenda.
As I posted yesterday, if you can bother reading posts properly, then you might make more sense.
As you can't seem to remember your own posts, my observation regarding Chinese or Pakistanis feeling insulted at being described as just Asian, was actually in answer to your bizzare question about how I would feel if I had to tick a box American, Asian or European.
I replied that there would never be a form to tick with just American, European or Asian on it and that I know for a fact that people from the diverse countries of Asia find it insulting to be described as just Asian.
If you can read my post properly, instead of quoting what is just in your own head. You will see that your comment, referring to Brits, which you attributed to me:
If one referred to them as <also> European this would be an insult.
Is not what I said.

Jalima1108 Fri 21-Dec-18 17:00:02

your bizzare question about how I would feel if I had to tick a box American, Asian or European.

that would leave many of my family stateless …..