Corbyn's true colours revealed - "Defeat' the EU!"

it's called effective and determined opposition - cooperation with others in opposition

quite simpla, put country before party and personal ambition. And also face the obvious- that he won't be eledted ... come what may (pun not intended).

POGS, as I have stated several times it does not matter what Jeremy Corbyn or the Labour party do or not do, as they are not the government at this time of great crisis.

However, what Theresa May and the Tory party does effects every one of us, and they have through their incompetence in the leave negotiations taken this nation down a pathway that should never have been necessary.

It is not Corbyn that's been on a journey, but all of us, and we still do not know how that journey will end.

Not good many seem to feel.

jura2 Quote [it's called effective and determined opposition - cooperation with others in opposition ] End Quote

jura2, no matter how good the "effective and determined opposition - cooperation with others in opposition" is, it would still not produce a majority in the House of Commons to defeat this government as long as the DUP remain as it's cohorts.

Therefore Corbyn cannot prevent anything that this shambles of a government wishes to do.

Everything in this Brexit crisis has been brought about by the Tory party and no other body.

It is as simple as that.

Grandad

"POGS, as I have stated several times it does not matter what Jeremy Corbyn or the Labour party do or not do, as they are not the government at this time of great crisis."

Yes you have stated several times Labour are not in government and therefore not accountable. I find that an incredible opinion to hold but if you think being in opposition means you are somehow weak then who am I to argue.

A). The OP is not referring to that point though is it? The OP is pointing out his hypocrisy .

B) If Corbyn/Labour are so insignificant as an opposition then why should the electorate bother taking any notice of what he/they say.?

C). Corbyn has either done a total flip - flop over his Eurosceptism or Corbyn is as many have said been misleading his supporters, I do think the penny is finally dropping for some.

D). Is Corbyn following the Labour line ? Corbyn is only abiding by the principle of trying to get a General Election by fair means or foul and not giving way to anything else. Why are so many grass root Labour Members so disappointed he is indeed continuing to sit on the fence?

E). If Corbyn/Labour are as you repeatedly say not in government so not accountable if a Snap General Election were held what would Corbyn's /Labour policy be? The last Labour Manifesto has been shown to be nothing short of a lie so why should the voter take any notice of Manifestos/Policies from Labour or any party that doesn't believe in enacting their own Manifesto?.

POGS, if you wish to refer to politicians "flip-flopping", then Theresa May must be the most primary in that. After all, she was for remain during the referendum campaign but changed to leave to obtain the Prime Ministers position.

So, we have a person who really believes that Britain should remain within the European Union leading the negotiations for Britain to leave the European Union. In that, it is little wonder that those negotiations are in such a state.

The words "Flip-Flopping" certainly do not do justice to the above. Other words come to mind such as, double standards and two-faced naivety, but there, that's what anyone would expect from those who hold office in this Tory government.

It is not a flip-flopping competiton Grandad - yes May is the champion, for sure.

But we are here talking about Corbyn. He could show leadership, he could come out clearly, he could listen to his party and MP, he could do his job- oppose- He hasn't. In discussions with his supporters fairly recently they kept saying 'oh don't worry, he won't let it happen, he is playing the long game but will intervene just in time' and on and on. Oh and he will be able to find a middle way (you know the cake and eat version- with unicorns on top) just in time.

And now they say 'ooops too late'- we will have to let it happen - take the country down with it, the economy, the jobs - then Corbyn will take over asap and do miracles for the country, you'll see.

And, NO, I don't see it. 10s of 1000s of jobs will be lost in the poorest areas- the £ tank, the financial services industry moved out of the country ...where will the money come from for those miracles?!?

Imagine a parent beating the kids badly - and the other parent just close his/her eyes and does not take every step to stop it - who is then responsible. And I say, the one who does the beating - but the other very close behind.

Well said Jura

But I don’t see Mrs May as flip flopping, she voted remain, the referendum result was leave and as PM she has accepted the result

Grandad

You used to tell posters off for changing the topic now all you do is resist answering points about Corbyn by speaking of Theresa May. Your posts used to be slightly higher in debate content .

You can repeat the mantra. ' Jeremy Corbyn has remained loyal to the Brexit policy set out by the Labour party conference' till you are blue in the face but at what point does Corbyn go past stage 1 which was ' get a General Election' ?.

You and Corbyn can hold to the principle of going for a General Election for ever and a day but at some stage he will have to agree to moving towards the next position as agreed by the Members at the Labour Party Conference surely.

He has forgotten the next position

Ben Bradshaw has just made the point very well in the HoC - they will be BOTH judged very harshly- BOTH.

Labour MP Chris Williams on Politics Live states the Labour Party does not want a 2nd Referendum.

He is a Corbyn stalwart and he makes the differential between the ' wider ' Labour voters and the ' Labour Membership ' and how the Labour heartlands are needed to win a General Election. Something glaringly obvious and has been spoken of on copious amounts of threads.

The Corbyn faction of Labour is at odds with Labour Membership over the 2nd Referendum and Corbyn is delaying the calls for a 2 and Referendum because it suits his Eurosceptism.

yep - what about this 'Conference decision' then?

Sept Conference 2018:

Labour delegates have approved a motion that would keep all options - including a fresh referendum - on the table if MPs are deadlocked over Brexit.

It was passed by a show of hands at the party conference in Liverpool.

The vast majority were in favour of the motion, with only a small number against.

Leader Jeremy Corbyn - who has previously ruled out another EU referendum - has said he will respect the result of the vote.

Sir Keir Starmer said earlier that the option of staying in the EU would be on the ballot paper in any future referendum if Labour gets its way.

In his party conference speech, the shadow Brexit secretary said all options should be kept on the table, including a so-called People's Vote, to "stop a destructive Tory Brexit".

Now that is clear - clear as a bell. And Corbyn is NOT respecting it.