Misreading the country?

Not misreading the country - more like misleading the country. Meaningless soundbites like "strong and stable", "brexit means brexit", "we are here for you". "respect the result" etc. are all challengeable. The vociferous extremists who think they know what "the whole country " wants are taking an England- centric view, and ignoring the half that don't want anything to do with this mess. If, at the beginning, May had said, the result was really close, we will leave but maintain close ties with the EU, then most people would have said "fair enough", but she was too self obsessed with the Tory party, and to her maintaining unity in the party has been more important than unity in the country. Well that strategy's gone well, hasn't it?

Lemon Grove Quote [I think you may well be correct Grandad43 and that the deal will get through the third time.] End Quote.

Lemongrove, I think that must be the first time that you and I have agreed on any matter debated on this forum.

That must demonstrate there is hope for the world yet.

No, we have agreed a few times, but you may not have always seen the posts.Sometimes threads move on quickly and it’s too time consuming reading everything.
I often agree with posters who I mainly disagree with their views, but when I do agree, I always say so.

connie MPs don't "give all their power to Brussels", no more than 6% of our laws are EU ones, the rest of our laws are domestic ones on health, education, social care, welfare, transport, police etc etc MPs can make as much mess of them they want. Your post demonstrates the huge misconceptions and misinformation people have about how much sovereignty we have actually got - not that it has done us any good having to suffer Tory austerity- all our own MPs making, nothing do with Brussels.

Grandad do you really see this deal as 'hope for the world' or the UK for that matter?

What do you think of JC's behaviour in this matter. How long can he change tack, like a little cockerel on a weather vane, blowing in the wind? Once we have NO Deal- it will be a bit late ...

So all the leavers out there I ask for some clarity. Firstly what would you do about N. Ireland and the Good Friday agreement? And secondly do you really know what sort of Brexit you want? Because it seems to me that the Leavers are split into several sections from No- dealers who would just drop out, to those who want some sort of a customs union and/or a special deal with the EU. In other words the 52% are not a united front but have voted for different things. The 48% on the other hand voted unanimously to Remain. So the reason the leaavers do not want another vote is not because they believe in democracy but becuse they know they would lose.

Indeed- Remainers are 100% united - so a solid 48% and probably a lot more now- against a 52% who just does not know what it wants - so lots of minorities.

This whole pantomime has been for the extremists to puff themselves up for the coming leadership contest, then I too think May will present her unchanged Agreement which will probably get through. Ironic / hypocritical as she is getting people to vote time and again until she gets the correct result - just the reason she won't allow a second referendum

I think we should leave the EU on 29th March without a deal. From what I've heard (from many MPs) TM's deal is a bad deal. Why on earth is she putting it forward again to be voted on? I don't get it - it's like a form of bullying! i.e. 'Vote this through, or I'm just going to keep coming!' Let's just get out, and be done with it! (And save 39 billion, into the bargain!)

It might take a few years for everything to come right. But in the long run, we're going to be a lot better off, I'm sure.

The trouble is, with this shambles of a Parliament, that most MPs are Remainers, and as such, their hearts aren't in it. If we had had a Leaver for PM, I think we would be set up with a great deal by now, and ready to leave.

And just a constant thought of mine ... Who on earth joins a club they can't leave?

do not worry all these parliament votes have no legal standing , it is a big fiasco

we must leave 29 march, no deal WTO, perfectly fine we will prosper.

Just shows me how many traitors are running the UK...

NO deal will prevail

lyndiloo a great post ,

My favourite Brexit cliche is "we all must pull together".

Yeah, right. You broke it, you fix it. I will be over here with my £2 avocados, waiting for my Porsche to be imported.

I didn't vote for any of this sh*tshow, and I am not responsible for it. The responsible people who wanted this outcome can figure out what to do.

A lot of them ran away. Rats and sinking ships come to mind.

Lemon Grove, Quote [No, we have agreed a few times, but you may not have always seen the posts. Sometimes threads move on quickly and it’s too time consuming reading everything.] End Quote.

Lemongrove, I must have missed our previous agreements. However, I am on the first full day off from working in three and a half weeks due to Brexit.

So, after listening to all the moans and groans on Brexit everywhere we have been going, our agreeing on the matter really has made my day off.

We should both now stand for parliament and sort this mess out. Although, thinking about it, we would probably end up throwing the Mase at each other.

there is only one brexit, not a range of traitorous deals that are really remain.

WTO out we go

just get on with it....

also these votes all have no legal standing at all, just a big pantomime

out we go, I am so happy

just wondering can anyone say how many referendums we ought to have until, if ever, remain win ??

Take the deal and get on with it?

We would be stuck in the EU effectively with no say over how it was run.

No deal is the better option, things being as they are.

yes i agree

There is a strong whiff of desperation coming from thew quitters on this thread.

yes indeed- and never a discussion, never an argument, never a debate ...

In any other Forum I know- trolls are got rid of ...

smiles with great happiness

Westminster is in its own little mixed up bubble and is just ignoring the people they're supposed to represent ie the great British public

I completely agree Jane10

I feel very angry that the process of getting out of the EU seems to have been all about the personal preferences of MPs who have made our exit completely and utterly shambolic.

This is why Brexit happened - and it bucked the trend. It was a sort of revolution against being unheard, unseen unknown, by those we voted in to represent us. They have no idea of the feelings at street level and even now they carry on regardless.

I think most of the UK is united in disgust for our politicians. Very few of them have come out of this well. There is lots of anger. Ours is a Leave constituency. Our MP went on his own merry little way blocking an EU exit at every turn.

Justice of a sort will be done when he loses his seat at the next election. Oh, he'll still collect his huge parachute payment and his nice fat pension but his name will be mud and he would not dare show his face in this area again, such is the anger.

He won't give a damn though, as he buggers off to his plush southern pile, never to be seen again. He has let us down very badly.

Trolls?????Seems to me you only like it if people write things on here that you agree with!! WTO Great Britain will prosper .....the EU on the other hand will eventually fall apart!!!

At this juncture I couldn't now care less what happens because whatever the outcome you can bet it won't benefit the public so go for a no deal and be done with.

EllanVannin - Exactly. You have summed up the feelings in my neck of the woods.

People are very angry. My Remainer friends are too. They have had enough,

They want no more wrangling and point scoring and self-serving politicians delaying Brexit. There has to be an end to it and for that to happen, our elected body has to act in unison - for the good of the UK.

But they won't.

I also agree with Lindiloo's post at 16.05.
Which I've said before on another thread.
Delay would just dig deeper hole of uncertainty.