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Can anyone apart from the elite, say what they want from Brexit

(186 Posts)
Whitewavemark2 Mon 28-Oct-19 08:21:18

I am aware that this blog post treads on contentious ground. But I think it only fair to say that I could not answer European’s questions as to what Brexiters want, put to me last week.

I can answer why we got Brexit. Austerity and the attitudes of indifference that led to it can answer almost all aspects of that question in some way or other. If an elite does not care eventually the majority find a way to bite back. And they did. So I am not saying I do not understand why a majority voted as they did. I think I do. I am instead saying I do not know what Leavers want now.

It’s clear that the government wants to pursue radical de-regulation on everything from worker to environmental, social and financial protections. Their goal is Singapore-on-Thames where they can show contempt for international norms and standards on every imaginable issue, and depart from previously hallowed ground on matters such as the NHS. Their desired outcome is a country with a more powerful and relatively richer elite, and they are indifferent as to whether that reduces the income of all else in the country. They, at least, can be understood.

But why do so many still support Leave when it is so apparent that this agenda is so harmful to them? And I mean harmful in the sense of very obviously imposing restrictions on their well-being? What is the trade off? Where is the gain? What advantage does the pursuit of English nationalism provide that makes it worthwhile having despite it making most worse off within the country, and by international comparison?

I know I am told, time and again, that I must seek to understand the Leaver. And I have tried. And no Leaver I have met has ever come close to being able to answer the simple question ‘how will your life be better by leaving given that you know there are costs from doing so?’ The best most do is deny the cost. But they still can’t explain the gain.

Richard Murphy
Oct 2019

Oopsminty Wed 30-Oct-19 10:12:55

What everyone seems to forget is there had been anti EU feelings for decades. Nothing to do with lying MPs and immigration.

The Lib Dems wanted a Referendum years ago. Corbyn has always been anti EU.

But all that seems to have been forgotten and now anyone who voted Leave is classed as a racist, which is disgraceful.

Nonnie Wed 30-Oct-19 13:31:02

Oops I think you have hit a good point there. Imo many voted leave because the EU had such a bad press, some of which I agree with. However, if the remain campaign had made the point about what we have gained and what we would lose there might have been a different outcome. It is so easy to vote against something you don't like but in many cases they don't realise they are 'cutting off their nose to spite their face'. EU has faults but we lose more than we gain.

Please read this: www.bbc.co.uk/news/business-50219036?utm_source=bestforbritain.org&fbclid=IwAR1hyE-yROWQzL9kDiMrBgFhvakjSIZBzbRTPE3p5l549R5ZAGmXw8YG57I

absthame Wed 30-Oct-19 20:58:26

The bad press started as soon as the 2 to 1 majority of the very first referendum was announced when the right-wing of the Tory party refused to accept the results, swearing to drive the UK out of the EEC and supported by the express and mail newspapers.

The steady drip drip of lies had it's effect leading to the 2015 farce of a referendum where the same people who rejected the 2 to 1 majority of the 1975 referendum believe that it is less sacrosanct that a 52 to 48% result in more recent times and rejecting a 2 to 1 majority is more democratic than questioning the 52% to 48% result. Am I totally insane to challenge such weird values

GabriellaG54 Wed 30-Oct-19 21:10:42

Yes

grapefruitpip Wed 30-Oct-19 21:12:50

Yes what? Surely you are one of the elite?

lemongrove Wed 30-Oct-19 21:21:53

Gabriella ? short, sharp, and to the point.

Alexa Thu 31-Oct-19 12:37:54

Are you rich? Then vote Conservative

Are you rich, but care about other people? Then don't vote Conservative

Nonnie Thu 31-Oct-19 13:03:10

Alexa we are not rich but neither are we poor and we will be OK whatever happens. We have made a profit on our US shares because of the fall in the £ but I would happily give that up for the sake of those less fortunate rather than leave the EU and hurt the UK. I won't be voting Conservative, I will vote for any party which will oust them, in my case LD.

varian Thu 31-Oct-19 21:58:12

The Russians would celebrate if this brexit nonsense is not stopped

www.telegraph.co.uk/technology/2018/10/17/russian-iranian-twitter-trolls-sent-10-million-tweets-fake-news/

Dinahmo Thu 31-Oct-19 22:17:32

absthame You're not insane at all. I've posted a similar point but not as succinctly as you. But Leavers won't believe you.