Mogg

I didn’t come back on here last night, it was getting too acrimonious. I’ve just had a quick look this morning.

Grenfell was a terrible disaster, we are all agreed. JRM made an unthinking comment. I’m sorry but are you all telling me that you’ve never said anything without thinking and then regretting it? Despite what some would have us believe, JRM is a human being just like the rest of us. And he has good and bad points and character just like the rest of us.

Thank you Annie for your comment about Grandad. I just wondered what his actual qualifications are. Still not sure.

Gonegirl and Doodle wrote caring posts about Annie. Others not so.

Annie lived through the Aberfan disaster. She is bound to remember. I remember and I was only a child. When disasters such as Grenfell and Aberfan occur, of course people remember and want to know what happened, and that it can never happen again.

There is a very interesting article about the Grenfell disaster in The Spectator this week.

The author points out that while the direct cause of the Grenfell tragedy was the problems with the cladding and evacuating procedures. Behind that lay systemic failures in the Building Regulations that enabled builders and specifiers to use those materials, which, I would remind you, have been used on expensive private flatdevelopments as well as public ownership blocks, with no guidance from Building Regulations at all.

He quotes detailed regulations about the proper height for a doorbell, as distinct from fridge or cooker points, but in the 2 volumes on fire regulations, all it says about evacuating people is simultaneous evacuation of flats is unlikely to be necessary because of compartementalisation and on the thermoplastic materials used in the cladding it simply says ^ No guidance for European fire tests performance is currently available

The question must be asked if the Building Regulations, which run to thousands of pages can stipulate in minute detail where you put lights switches and door bells, why were they so offhand and unthinking when dealing with evacuation procedures and how could they be allowed to dismiss giving instructions for the use of materials now found to be so fire prone, because there weren't any regulations available. Why on earth didn't they commission some.

Anyone who as ever had an erxtension built will know how pettifogging Buildings Inspectors can be over minute action.

It is a case of Parkinson's Law in action. A committee will spend all afternoon arguing over where to site the bicycle shed and pass the new polluting plant on the nod (in the original book it is the nuclear reactor, but times have changed).

People will argue forever about what they know and pass the item they do not understand on the nod because no-one wants to admit their ignorance. This is what has happened with the building regulations and this is the root cause of the Grenfell disaster.

Petra and Ooopsminty, caring posts.

JRM made an unthinking comment. I’m sorry but are you all telling me that you’ve never said anything without thinking and then regretting it?

JRM tends to make numerous unthinking comments, all of which appear to be designed to demonstrate his superiority of thought. Of course I've said things I've regretted, but I'm not in a public office with years of media and PR training and experience. I also don't hold the view that it's common sense to ignore the guidance from the experts - and given the nature of the interview I'd expect someone in his position to choose his words very carefully, something which he seems to manage just fine when he's sneering at the opposition.

Rees Mogg is being reviled by some on this thread for his comments.

grandad43 has said on this thread the people of Aberfan could be partly to blame for the deaths in that disaster , this is acceptable?

I only brought up the disaster because like Grenfell there were
warnings.

* Rees Mogg is being reviled by some on this thread for his comments.*

and quite rightly! Harking back to the dreadful tragedy that was Aberfan and using it to support your right-wing views is distasteful.

My right wing views ? ?

From what I’ve read on other threads, yes. Clearly.

How silly, not trusting Corbyn doesn’t make one right wing

I’m sure you think do.

So

Anniebach You brought up Aberfan because you wanted to make a comment on Dany Cotton's pension.

Please will you all leave Annie alone and concentrate on proper discussion.
Annie isn’t right wing, she’s a Labour Party member, but in case you’ve forgotten Yehbutnobut, people are actually allowed to hold right wing views, and left wing, and centre of right or left. It’s called democracy.

annie isn’t a Labour Party member, are you annie?

I apologise if I’m wrong, I thought she was.

I had forgotten about Ms Cotton, seems survivors and families of the victims want her and other senior officers to be prosecuted

I'm astonished maddyone. When I first joined GN and started to read some comments, I felt that Anniebach's views were right wing. I was very surprised to read that she'd ever been a member of the Labour Party. Obviously my mistake.

Fortunately, we're not yet ruled by lynch mobs, so Ms Cotton won't be prosecuted unless there's clear evidence that she broke the law.

Rees-Mogg should have kept his mouth shut, as should Andrew Bridgen, who tried to defend him as "clever". Rees-Mogg knows perfectly well what kind of image of himself he wishes to portray.

I resigned as a Labour Party member recently because it is no longer the Labour Party I belonged to for over 50 years.

I am a socialist not a Marxist and could never support an anti
semetic leader

Well you can vote Labour then.

What a relief.

I'm still wondering about the specific reasons the JLM won't support Labour.

Annie
Perhaps you could inform 'some' posters of your 'right wing history in the Labour Party. The diaries you have of a very famous ( now dead) person who was instrumental in starting the Labour Party. The 2 once leaders of the Labour Party. one now dead but the other a personal friend. I don't think he would be too pleased if he knew of your 'right wing' credentials, would he ?

grapefruitpip
Wed 6 Nov 20:45:59

Nasty post
But I see you say I'm out so perhaps that is just as well.

Gonegirl
Wed 6 Nov 17:24:08

Unfortunately, not everyone possesses emotional empathy, cannot understand another's pain or feelings and find themselves unable to express it in RL let alone in the written word.