Four day week

Remember in the past a 6 day week used to be the norm, then it went to 5 1/2 days, then 5. Of course health care, child care etc is a 24/7 occupation, but there’s no reason why , in certain sectors, a 4 day week couldn’t be the norm. My DiL works a 4 day week doing 4 10 hour shifts and much prefers it to 5 8 hour shifts.

Yes and it was the the Tory/Libdem coalition government in 2013 that abolished the Agricultural Wages Board that set minimum conditions for farmworkers especially were tied cottages etc where involved.

So much for Johnson and Swinsons pledges in regard to caring about workers rights.

What a joke.

I remember going to parents meeting when my children were teenagers, and the topic being... coping with increased leisure!
The assumption was that, with increased automation, working hours would be reduced, and pupils needed skills in music, art, or motor cycle maintenance to ensure they would e able to make use of all the extra leisure time!
What happened?

I can't see any problem with a 4 day work, many companies and the NHS are already doing it now. My own Dr is only working 4 days a week but others Dr's are available. Nurses now work longer hours and have more days off. Teachers, well they could finish later and the children have 4 longer days at school, at the moment around here they seem to finish at about 2.30 or so.

This has been talked about for many years. I remember it being debated about 40 years ago, along with a 35 hour working week. Neither of them has yet come about, and I am long retired.

Yes, Annaram1, I remember too and the result was that people spend more than the hours specified in their contract (and not always paid either).

Barmeyoldbat If they finish at 2.30pm, what time do they start and how long are their breaks? There's been a tendency to move towards earlier start times and shorter breaks, but they still have the same number of hours of lessons.

So if schools are only open four days a week, what are parents who work on other days supposed to do?

Have you ever been in an afternoon lesson? Most children are already dropping and don't learn so well.

allule I remember being told about all the increased leisure time I could expect when I was at secondary school in the 1960/70s.

Jay Lucy I don't know any GPs who work an 8 hour day. 12 hours would be nearer the mark!

This just would not work especially with primary school children.

Of course we should be moving towards shorter working hours. This is a rich country, and with AI developing apace we have plenty of scope for making working life easier for employees.

But the above isn't on the agenda for businesses. They are out to spend the least amount while getting the most profit from their workers.

With a planned economy (democratically of course) the targets - phased in as applicable - should be:

30 hour working week for all (small businesses to be supported where necessary)
class sizes of 20
A&E waiting times less than one hour
minimum pay £15 per hour (small businesses to be supported here too)
etc - you fill it in!

Instead what do the government spend money on:
Trident £200 billion and rising
HS2 over £100 billion and rising
NHS failed IT projects £10 billion
several other failed IT projects costing £10 to £200 million each
Fire sale of RBS with £4 billion loss to taxpayers
and not forgetting procurement - the MOD pay £22 for s single light bulb!

AND we let accountants draw up tax legislation so that nice big holes are left for their other employers (the wealthy and their businesses) to leap through!

It's hard enough getting a plumber or electrician now, there'll be no chance when they work a four day week.

True Chewie

I have taken two calls this morning. 1. Broken guttering.
2. Slates off a barn roof.

No problem, we will be with you next Monday.

Humptydumpty

I think it said on the News last night that all the different manifestos are out next week.

The voice of reason, growstuff, 12.37

This is all uninformed speculation.

I would have thought that the Leavers among us would have loved this idea as they have no problems with leaps in the dark...?

The people I am talking about Maizie are not newly qualified graduates but professionals with 5, 10, 20 years experience behind them, capable, for example of undertaking complicated life saving surgery, taking responsibility for installing wind farms, capable of heading departments in schools, taking on the installation of a major IT project.

Unemployment registers are remarkable free of them. DH is stilling working at 76 because he is an expert in the safe movement of large items at sea, currently working almost non-stop in the wind farm industry because they currently cannot find enough people with the right experience for the work.

I am sure (not) that there are thousands of such experts working 1 hour a week who would leap at all the new vacancies that would be available if everyone worked shorter hours.

Changes like the mininimum wage were not a problem, because it only affected a proportion of the population and for most the effective wage rise was only a couple of £s an hour. This new plan is talking about a 20%, full on salary rise for everybody, plus a 20% rise in the size of the workforce in a competitive global economy in which British goods will no longer be competitive in international markets.

So many of you seem to be opposed to the idea of a shorter working week. What is so wrong for it t be a goal? No one is suggesting that if Labour win the election they will introduce a 4 day working week immediately.

I have to say that some of you are being deliberately stupid to suggest that hospitals, businesses etc would close for 3 days out of 7.

Swap obtuse for stupid in my last paragraph

MOnica Is it about a 20% reduction in hours? I haven't actually read what was said.

The devil is always in the detail.

When the working time directive supposedly put a cap of 48 hours on the working week, lots of people weren't affected.

Firstly, it didn't apply to the self-employed.

Secondly, it was an average over 17 weeks, so people like teachers still had to work over 48 hours a week because holidays were taken into account.

All this headline stuff doesn't make much sense without knowing the details.

It will be announced that it’s merely ‘an aspiration’ no doubt,
Along with banning all private schools and other poorly thought out policies that Corbyn and McDonnell think will appeal to the masses.

If this is a 20% reduction in 48 hours, it won't affect most people.

Visiting a relative in ICU, nursing staff worked 4 12 hour shifts a week

But in future they would presumably be working 4 x 8 hour shifts at the same pay. Who is going to work the extra 4 hours a day and how much will it cost?

The key of the policy is not simply working only four days a week, but working the same number of hours on that day, so that other people have to be employed work the hours the work the current employee is not doing on the 5th day.

Working current hours over 4 days isn't a problem. I did it myself once for some months and there was much in its favour. But reducing hours on the same pay means that hourly rates go up by 20 percent and that extra staff have to get that higher rate as well, even if just working part time.

I dropped down to a 28 hours 4 day week 3 years ago with a commensurate drop in salary. What I have found is that it focuses the need for good time management. I am doing the same job my productivity and output is roughly the same but to achieve this I need to make every minute of my working day productive. In principal it could open up opportunities for flexible working, and create employment opportunities but business and public sector would take the hit in higher employment costs. There is also a risk of exploitation to work the extra hours.