Brexit dividing my family.

Some countries don't allow dual citizenship. When I wanted to apply for British citizenship years ago I found out that I would lose my Swedish one. I am now so grateful that I chose to retain my Swedish citizenship. Thanks to that our two children and now grandchildren are also Swedish citizens (they are British/Swedish).

Sweden now allows dual citizenship but it saddens me to say that I no longer want to apply for a British one and that feeling is shared by most Scandinavians I know. The people in the group I mix with have lived and worked here for 40-60 years and we have always felt welcome - until after the referendum. A very old Danish lady was asked by a neighbour of hers "why should we pay for looking after you?".

I do know that most of you on here would never make comments like that but you see, the mood in the country has changed.

If the old Danish lady has made Britain her home and has contributed to British society, then of course she should be looked after. As someone who voted Leave, that was never an issue for me. Or for the thousands of skilled people who wish to come here to work and live, and contribute to our economy and our society. What I don't believe in is free movement, and allowing people into the UK who are not able to contribute. Down that path lies chaos and anarchy.

Opal, there is a strict 3 months rule for free movement in the EU. *The UK CHOSE not to implement it*- it has nothing to do with the EU. British citizens were and still are, able to go to any EU country and Switzerland, for 3 months, to look for work- if they haven't found work by then, they have to leave. It is quite simple, really - and as said, it was the UK that decided not to enforce. Other countries did, and do.

I know many Brits here on very high salaries- they get child benefit, whether kids live with them in Switzerland, or back home, at a much much higher rate. If they become unemployed, they get 2 years un-employment benefit- at 70% of salary, or 80% if they have child/ren. They are also given courses to help with finding new employment, including free intensive language course, or IT, design- whatever they consider would help.

We often seem quite happy to refer to EU citizens as immigrants yet ourselves or our kids working in Europe as ‘working in the community’ or ‘living in Europe’. I don’t think I’ve ever heard anyone describe themselves or their children as immigrants when working in Europe. Or anywhere else actually! And here we are as we relinquish our EU status and have our European passports removed describing those EU citizens who will continue to live and contribute here as immigrants? You, me we will be the immigrants soon if we move to Europe, where for the last forty years we have had European citizenship. If you decide to retire and join your children in Europe, you will be an immigrant just taking advantage of the benefits of living in Europe; well that feels nice and cosy doesn’t it? How does that actually make you feel? My H was very ill whilst in Sicily recently and when he was rushed thro triage, some locals waiting were shouting Nationals First. One man was arguing with a guard with a gun on his hip saying we should be made to wait. I speak Italian and understood what they were saying. God that was frightening and really sad, my husband was much more ill than any of those waiting but they wanted him to wait until all the nationals were seen? To be treated on the basis of his nationality not on his need? But that’s ok cos he soon will be an immigrant!

My pal who moved here from France when she was six, has been educated, gone to uni, worked, married, raised her family paid her taxes and contributed towards her pension, must become British to continue to live here as a full citizen? Why? What hasn’t she contributed that anyone of us have?

Some of them, when losing their job, had been here for over 10 years and had never bothered to learn the local language, bar ordering a beer, clicking fingers and shouting louder and louder in English! And yet they get free intensive language courses when suddenly they need to.

bar ordering a beer, clicking fingers and shouting louder and louder in English!
Well, we all know ill-mannered people of all nationalities - they are the kind of English people who give the rest of the English a bad name.

#liveinWaleslearningWelsh

years and years ago, OH applied for a job in Abergavenny (sp?) - and didn't get it (the job had been given already and they were just interviewing to follow procedure- so annoying).

I have wondered at times what it would have been like to live in Wales- quite similar to my part of Switzerland, the Jura. One thing is for sure, priority number one would have been to learn the language, and fast. So totally agree.

Yes, spelling is correct jura

DH applied for a job there too - and it had already been earmarked for an internal candidate.

maybe they were there at the same time- 1971 or 72.

We blew the gasket on the car on the way back and could not afford to repair or replace (oh I wish we could have kept it and repaired later- TR4)

Less than 15% speak much Welsh in that area although that is increasing as it is a compulsory language up to GCSE now.

No, it was later than that, late 1980s I think.

Do you condemn all leave voters because some rather rude ones behave so appallingly

No but I do blame them for helping to create a culture when such people feel they can say these terrible things. And one family member shared a terrible joke about people packing up and leaving the UK. I do blame them especially when they know my Son in law and Grandchildren were born in the EU. Those attitudes have left me not wanting to talk to some extended family members.

Callistemon ''Well, we all know ill-mannered people of all nationalities - they are the kind of English people who give the rest of the English a bad name.''

of course, I know many notable exceptions. But I am afraid that Anglo-Saxons from either side of the pond are well-known for not making the effort to learn the language of where they settle- and expect others to speak English. Zurich ad Geneva are full of them - even after 10, 20 and more years. The Costas too - many of them after 10, 20 or more years. Sad fact. Living parralel lives, own shops, own restaurants, own tradesmen, own private schools and even Churches - like ghettos.

Living parralel lives, own shops, own restaurants, own tradesmen, own private schools and even Churches - like ghettos
Exactly what is happening here......

yes- so oh the irony and hypocrisy. That those people left, often stating the above behaviour - and then going on to do the same and worse- somewhere else (mind you as the British always have done everywhere they went).

Although I disagree, most EU immigrants, like Poles - have made sure they learnt the language quickly, even if 'only' spoken/communicative- and their kids generally go to the local schools and they attend their local Catholic Church.

But I am afraid that Anglo-Saxons from either side of the pond are well-known for not making the effort to learn the language of where they settle- and expect others to speak English.
But that does happen often as I know when I visit Australia. Because many Europeans settled there, they tended to stay near those whose language they knew and continued to speak Italian/Croatian/Greek etc. European shops, restaurants, very many Catholic schools.
It is only the next generations who went to school there who are fluent in both, speaking English at home and their parents' language at home.

Although I disagree, most EU immigrants, like Poles - have made sure they learnt the language quickly,
Disagree with what? You are forming your own conclusions and creating an argument where there is none.

Chestnut; the way you talk makes me think that Brexit must really be about immigration but people keep telling me that it isn't so I don't know what to believe...

Labaik - the way I talk? I have no idea what you mean. I haven't mentioned immigration or related it to Brexit.

Also to the PPs who have complained about remoaners when your 6 year old grandson asks as mine did if he would have to leave the country because he wasn't born here I think you might also moan and feel sad.

That must have been horrible Ethel, I would feel sad under such circumstances.

We used to be such a tolerant country. I'm so ashamed of what is happening now .

It was vey upsetting maddyone which is why I get upset when people forget the impact that Brexit has on those EU citizens who have lived here many years and made a life here. And how unwelcome many of them feel now, And now we have Mr Johnson saying for too long EU citizens living here have treated the UK as their home. Well thats because it is their home.

I've pointed out oh here some of the sad letters I've seen on facebook from people that have had nasty comments made to them because of their name, accent or colour, but a lot of people just choose to ignore it and refuse to believe that Brexit has made things so much worse.

All I can say Labaik is that until Brexit the European people I know felt welcome and safe and now they don't. It's as though it has unleashed a horrible part of society